Registered: Jul 2003
Location: east tennessee
Posts: 141

We were tallking about a problem we have here in the hunts
we have alot of guys that when your dog split trees or is the only
dog treed when you start the shinning time they never lift a light
to help search and who would never see the coon it happens alot the lastest instance was a freind of mine who's dog was split and 2 BUDDIES in the cast would not shine or help then when the 10 minutes was up they said rigfht here is the coon we knew were it was the whole time....
my question is could these 2 hunters be scratched for unsportsman like conduct or some other rule??
these types of instances make it hard for honest dogs to progress up the championship ladder what do you think???

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Posts: 568

Handlers can not be scratched for refusing to shine the tree.

If they refuse to look at the coon once you are showing it they can possibly be scratched for failing to participate in the cast.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: east tennessee
Posts: 141

tank,
under what rule could you scatch them for not looking at the coon

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Registered: Not Yet
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Posts: N/A

Forget it. You can't make anyone see a coon. Judt file it away for future reference.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Posts: 568

Per the advisor:

An, individual may be scratched for refusing to score tree. IF he refuses to look at a coon that the rest of the cast is attempting to show he is not participating with the cast. ie Voting on how to score the tree.

This does not include the handler not "seeing" the coon. You cannot make someone see the coon.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: CRAWFORDVILLE,FL
Posts: 582

while hunting in the winter classic i had a guy that wanted to right me up for handler miss conduct for not shining a tree. i wasn't trying not t help i just step back a little to listen to what my dog was doing. all he had to do was say hey would ya help look a little and i would have been glad help and to see his dog under a coon but instead he started hollering i'm gonna right you up for handler miss conduct if you don't start shining the tree i was judging the cast we had already had problems with the guy earlier i was just to young to be judging a cast i was like 14 or 15 now after encountering quite afew more people like that in the hunt's when i'm judging i tell'em i'll be has fair as i can if you don't like the way somthing is scored question it let's try to have some fun and if some one starts fussin and being rude i tell all i want to hear from you is strike and tree your dog anything outa line and you can have a nice trip home cause that's where your goin'

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Cairo, Missouri
Posts: 756

why not have a rule that would scratch a handler for not shining the tree? I realize I can turn on my light and just stand there with my head up and you wouldn't know the differnce. But isn't this supposed to be fun and a test of the dogs ability, not "let's see who can be the biggest A$$HOLE contest"? If you were on a pleasure hunt during season with friends and their dog(s) treed split would you not help them look for a coon? Didn't competition nite hunts come from the idea of making pleasure hunting into more that just running hounds in the off season? You know sometimes folks work so hard at winning they loose sight of what coonhunting really is and should be a SPORT for enjoyment of all participants. In the old days it was a way to get food and a few extra dollars in your pocket, do you think they really cared who's dog it was treed as long as the coon was found? Now I have nothing wrong with standing back and listening for your own dog who is split, but most of todays lights will shine a tree from way back. So Tnredman I do believe it to be UNSPORTSMAN like conduct.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: N.W. GEORGIA
Posts: 728

TANK IF YOU ARE SAYING THEY ARE NOT PARTICIPATING BY NOT VOTING WOULD IT BE NOT PARTICIPATING BY NOT SHINING? SEEM THAT SHINING THE TREE IS JUST AS MUCH Part or scoring the tree or hunting as anything. cant score without shining?

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 23

i lost a hunt once because a guy fefused to look at the coon and the judge who was winning said he didnt see it . That made it two to two . If i would have been plused on that tree i would have won the hunt and beet the judge. Although i know its not possible i wish we could have non hunting judges in every cast.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: COLLINS MO.
Posts: 218

IF MY DOG IS SPLIT I WOULD RATHER THEY NOT SHINE THE TREE. HOW MANY TIMES HAVE YOU SEEN SOMEBODY THROW THAT LIGHT UP ON HIGH AND TRY TO BURN THE LEAVES OFF THE TREE ONLY IN HOPES OF MAKING THE COON NOT LOOK. I'LL HELP FIND YOUR COON IF YOU LIKE BUT I JUST FEEL I'M MORE LIKELY TO FIND A COON THIS TIME OF YEAR WITH ONE DIM LIGHT. ARE YOU A BAD SPORT FOR NOT LETTING EVERYBODY SHINE THE 1ST 2 MINUTES.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: east tennessee
Posts: 141

i think that all of the bad sports and buddy buddy guys who are winning because of not helping u score a tree and making their dogs nite ch. and gr nite ch. are cheapen having a dog who was a nite ch or gr nite ch years ago when i first started hunting in nite hunts have a nite ch meant something but now there are alot of these cheaters who have them and most of those could tree a coon if it was under their nose i work hard to have a good comp. dog and i prefer my dog to split when they can but when no one wants to see the coon what chance does the dog have of winning its just bad business when you go to a big leafy tree and they score a star or spider eye and u go to a split tree and the coon is in plain view and know one can see it

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Pa.
Posts: 132

tnredman,you're right.Those hollow titled hounds are worthless.The people that cheat,lie,go blind etc.to get their dog titled care about one thing,MONEY.This is also a great disservice to whatever breed they happen to be useing.I've seen guys that "can't see" a coon in vines ten feet off the ground.When I go to a hunt I want the best dog to win whether its my dog or not.Its a shame some are greedy simpletons.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Hohenwald,Tn
Posts: 465

Problems just like these are the reason I only go to the hunts in the winter time when theres no leaves and no excuses.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Comer, Georgia
Posts: 4724

just another reason I took my "little dog" and went home.....................seriously, though,.......... in all the hunts I have been in (hundreds), I was only in 2 casts where jerks just sat down and didn't help find the coon...........was in only 2 more (that I know about), when I had the only dog treed, that I found out later, another person SAW the coon, and just didn't say anything (summer hunts, lots of leaves, and they had the only angle where the coon was visible........they knew enough not to move, or someone else might see it)..yeahhh buddy.....real sportsmanship there!!!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Kalamazoo, Mich.
Posts: 6113

Just one thing to add. All the above examples are not solely reflective of our sport. It's reflective of people in general. Are those "types" giving coonhunting a bad name? No, they are giving every sport, every hobby, every profession bad names. The same person that's cheating you in a hunt is cheating someone else on a car that he's selling, cheating his boss out of an honest days work, cheating at every thing he does. No doubt there are some people like that.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: NC
Posts: 175

I take the first 2 minutes alone and would prefer the whole 10 to myself. I feel I can find a coon if he's there. Not sure if someone else could or not. It doesn't bother me a bit if noone else wants to help me look.
As far as others not seeing a coon, I'd rather them not see one than plus those that aren't there.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location:
Posts: 31

I wish the world hunt would be held a few months later with most of the leaves gone,as far as people not shining trees not much i will do except remember these jokers.I also remember the honest hunters and thanked them.What people need to do instead of giving up and going home with theier tail between their legs is stay in the cast and not let these crooks win playing by a different set of rules.At the end of the hunt tell them what you think of their integrity.These people are usually known for how they play the game,if not let it be known.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Comer, Georgia
Posts: 4724

on the world hunts..............somewhere between mid December and early March would be nice.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Minden Louisiana
Posts: 147

This may be off the subject a little but, I was judging a cast a while back and had a handler that was just playing every game in the book and was using some very foul language. I finally had enough and explained that if he cussed one more time I was going to scratch for misconduct. Not sure If I could do that or not. But I feel when they go to cussing they are trying to intimedate. He calmed down a little but after the hunt said I couldn't do it....How about it?????

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