Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4044

i believe that was the name of the dog. the gentlemans last name was falcon(sp) and it was a georgia dog back in the 70s that was crossed between vaughn and hammer. i think i found me a nice dog that goes back to him and was just wondering if any of yall had some info on this bluetick

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Longview Texas
Posts: 801

Heard the dog was a nice one. Was bred more than any other blue dog ever but fell short as a reproducer as far as titles go. Did win the ACHA Little World Hunt, which at the time was a "big time hunt"

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Cartersville, Ga.
Posts: 337

Southern Blue Pride, John Falcon did own him at one time. I never hunted with the dog. Did draw John before. Pride fell short in the breeding pen. Good looking dog. I did know the man who owned the only Grand Nite Champion out of Pride.Old Pride sure did breed a lot of them though. At the time he was at stud, not every one was competition hunting. He may have produced some real nice dogs we don't know about. He came from good stock that did reproduce.Lots of folks are still hunting dogs from those bloodlines.

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Mulberry Blue

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Longview Texas
Posts: 801

LOL, I said about the same thing. I bet if you asked River or Arkie, or Rock they would say he was pretty darn successful in the stud pen! LOL!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4044

i went to the zone 6 bboa hunt in miss this weekend and hunted against a dog out of the same cross. he was a solid dog. consistant, didnt take no minuses and got treed quick after striking a trail and handled extremely well. as a registered dog he won both his classes and was runner up for king of the hunt. he said the dog im interested in is very similar.

btw, had a great time at the hunt, 33 dogs friday night and 40 the second.

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

Southern Blue Pride did no doubt come from a line
that were reproducers......He even showed up in the Uthctman line of hounds, and later than the famous cross of Hammer III. and Flash.....Flash did not go back to Jack's Blue Frost, as all those crosses that produced Rebel, Hawk, and the Ranger Line, and I have always wondered why that hound only showed up in that line of dogs ( Jack's Blue Frost , Beans Ranger) that is a mystery. Southern Blue Pride was from Hammer V. owned by the great Bluetick man Mr. Dave Dean of the northern Blue Kennels. ......GOOD STOCK

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Armstrong,IL
Posts: 3348

say in that post?

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"If you are mad as hell and aren't gonna take it anymore, grab your rifle and head outside. If you're the only one with a rifle screaming like a maniac, go back inside. It isn't time yet."

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

Elett, Just that Pride is of good stock ( THE HAMMER LINE ) and that the Hammer line was used in the Uthctman line of hounds after the famous cross of Hammer III.

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Armstrong,IL
Posts: 3348

what I didnt get was the following"and I have always wondered why that hound only showed up in that line of dogs ( Jack's Blue Frost , Beans Ranger) that is a mystery.

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"If you are mad as hell and aren't gonna take it anymore, grab your rifle and head outside. If you're the only one with a rifle screaming like a maniac, go back inside. It isn't time yet."

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

The thought again just came through my mind as to why Jack's Blue Frost, Beans Ranger only produced the line of hounds of the Uthchman's...............That is a mystery to me why those two hounds only show up in the Uthctman's line. Do you know why ???

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Armstrong,IL
Posts: 3348

Well Gary got a pup named Jack Blue Frost that went on to become quit a hound and eventually Mr. Cecil Sherill brought NITE CH SHERRILL'S PEGGY to be bred to Jack abd this cross produced NITE CH BEANS RANGER.
Eighteen-yea old brother Lonnie bought Ranger from Luther Bean. Now as why this hound is promenate primarly in the Utchmans hound only would probably(my opion only)be that given the time's and speed of communication of the day and great costs of traveling to a stud probably is why he didnt show up in more lines. And at the time I imagine that the Utchman name and family of hounds were not as prominate as today. But as can be seen, once they had gotten wider recognition there were soon greater numbers of dog's being brought to the Utchman boys to be bred.
As I said this is my opion only, and if it will help you I will not dance around the subject as you have been doing since your arrival to this board. It seems you want to bring up the rumour that when Gary went to Dave Deans house that he took alot of females there and and bred them and came back and registered them as being out of Utchman males. Is this story true? I have no idea,and dont even care. Why did I bring this up? Because you have been trying to get someone to bring this up,I guess so you claim that Gary stole the blood from the great one,who know's and who cares!

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"If you are mad as hell and aren't gonna take it anymore, grab your rifle and head outside. If you're the only one with a rifle screaming like a maniac, go back inside. It isn't time yet."

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Armstrong,IL
Posts: 3348

from other Hammer hunters,hmmmmmmmmm! Never heard it from someone hunting Utchman hounds,hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!

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"If you are mad as hell and aren't gonna take it anymore, grab your rifle and head outside. If you're the only one with a rifle screaming like a maniac, go back inside. It isn't time yet."

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Longview Texas
Posts: 801

Yeah, and last month he was basicly saying Smokey River Kennel and Warren Haslouer owed all their success to "the hammer line" so if you go by his own system, the "hammer line" owes all its success to the Vaughn and Sabastian lines.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Camden,NC
Posts: 2719

GR Nite CH'PR' Southern Blue Pride
Born 1976
1,610 pups registered to him
33 Nite Champions
Only 1 GR Nite Champions


GR Nite CH'PR' Smokey River Blue Rambler
Born 1960
969 Pups Registered to him
30 Nite Champions
3 GR Nite Champions


GR Nite CH'PR' Deans N Blue Hammer II
Born 1963
1,088 Pups registered to him
32 Nite Champions
9 GR Nite Champions


GR Nite CH'PR' Smokey River BL Diamond Jim
Born 1968
1,679 Pups registered to him
39 Nite Champions
9 GR Nite Champions


GR Nite CH'PR' Deans N Blue Hammer II
Born 1968
1,320 Pups registered to him
35 Nite Champions
10 GR Nite Champions


GR Nite CH'PR' Uchtman's So Bl Ranger II
Born 1973
290 Pups registered to him
30 Nite Champions
3 GR Nite Champions


Nite CH'PR' Uchtmans Blue Rebel
Born 1976
240 Pups registered to him
16 Nite Champions
12 GR Nite Champions


GR Nite CH'PR' Uchtmans So Blue Scout
657 Pups Registered
51 Nite Champions
15 GR Nite Champions


GR Nite CH'PR' Uchtmans So Blue Hawk
914 Pups Registered to him
72 Nite Champions
25 GR Nite Champions


GR Nite CH'PR' Myers Blue Smokey II
540 pups registered to him
13 Nite Champions
14 GR Nite Champions

After looking these over I guess now I know why I've always kept certain of these dogs blood in my dogs, and as Emet use to say "NUFF SAID"

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Take a Child Hunting, and you will never forget it !!

GR NIte CH GR CH'PR' Dalton & Haucks BluRidge Lynn

GR Nite CH GR CH'PR' Southland's So Blue Queen

GR NIte Ch Rogers Blue Molly

Nite CH GR CH'PR' Daltons BluRidge Pat (Full liitermate brother to Smokey II)

Nite CH GR CH GR W CH'PR' Hauck's Carlolina Star

Nite CH GR CH'PR' Southland's Blue Queen II (Daughter of Queen)

GR CH'PR' Southland's Blue Nancy Ann

GR CH'PR' Southland's Blue Ebony (Daughter of Ann)

Nite CH'PR' Southland's Blue River Joe (4 wins to Grand & 15 cast wins !!)

Gr Nite CH CH'PR' Blue River Little Sue (Daughter of Lynn)

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Longview Texas
Posts: 801

Well Said! Mark, you should have been a Lawyer!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

I said nothing of the Uthcman's doing such a thing, and I only know what I know from history that I have read from the blue books. As far as me thinking the Hammer line did a great deal for the Uthcman line I am guilty of that, and also give a lot of credit to Marvil Hill's stock of dog.Both the Hammer line, and Hill's stock proved themselves through a lot of other lines, and are still a big influence on all blues of today. And as old tex dog says there in his reply yes I do believe Hammer III. had a lot to do with Chief's success, as well as Spanky on a lot of those crosses of the Smokey River line. I also heard and maybe some of you men can tell me this............That old Spanky stayed at the Smokey River Kennels for a while .........IS THIS TRUE OR WOULD ANY OF YOU KNOW THAT..........??????????????

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

Thanks for the numbers you put up I find it so interesting that the percentages are so low on all the dogs you showed. Even the Hawk dogs number are low, but no doubt are the highest. We all know the lines these dogs came from, and old Texdog is right about Vaughn, and Sebastian being the foundation of our breed. I have never been in the woods with any of the Daulton breed hounds and I can't say anything about them, but Iwould like to hunt with this line of hounds.The success of these dogs have been really through the droop dogs as far as big winnings go, and I am surprised that this line of dogs hasn't had a more noticed influence on the blueticks of today. They sure have been around long enough, and you have some dogs that are getting some recognation now. Good luck to you at Autumn Oaks I hope a blue dog wins.........

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Camden,NC
Posts: 2719

The Dalton dogs started long before Droop, but his sire Smokey II who also was National GR NT CH Bluetick at Autumn Oaks was also a Dalton Bred dog. Droop may have been the most noticed from Jerry, Mike, and Steve campaining him and droops son Droop Jr winning the Purina Race twice. The Dalton dogs BlueRidge Joe, White Oak Joe and Everetts females have been a corner stone in the Mnts of VA for some time. Used on Bear, Coon they have never surfaced to the competitive world of Coon hunting for the simple fact Everett lives a simple life and likes it that way.

Jim Myers was the person who brought this line to light with Smokey II and he produced many top notch coon hounds. I've had the pleasure to own 2 dual grands from smoke, and also smokes sister that finished out after 7 years of nothing but pleasure hunting in the ole hills of VA.

I would love for you to hunt with these dogs, not that they are the best, far from it, but they work for me and many others who for the last 40+ years have had shere enjoyment following this line of dogs through the woods.......I think you wouold like them, they run fast, are loud, and tree coon, and most of all they have brains making them a pure pleasure to train, own and hunt.

Maybe we'll take a hunt one day soon !!!!!!!

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Take a Child Hunting, and you will never forget it !!

GR NIte CH GR CH'PR' Dalton & Haucks BluRidge Lynn

GR Nite CH GR CH'PR' Southland's So Blue Queen

GR NIte Ch Rogers Blue Molly

Nite CH GR CH'PR' Daltons BluRidge Pat (Full liitermate brother to Smokey II)

Nite CH GR CH GR W CH'PR' Hauck's Carlolina Star

Nite CH GR CH'PR' Southland's Blue Queen II (Daughter of Queen)

GR CH'PR' Southland's Blue Nancy Ann

GR CH'PR' Southland's Blue Ebony (Daughter of Ann)

Nite CH'PR' Southland's Blue River Joe (4 wins to Grand & 15 cast wins !!)

Gr Nite CH CH'PR' Blue River Little Sue (Daughter of Lynn)

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

I am aware of the Dalton line of dogs, and the Smokey II. hound. However these hounds have not been so popular until the Droop boys have had a lot of success with them, and with real quick results. I am sure Mr. Dalton has done a great job with these dog in breeding coon dogs. They are no doubt a line that can win, but has fallen short becoming popular in the night hunts, and as you say Mr. Dalton decided not to hunt them in hunts, but I am surprised that they haven't become more populat with competition hunters like you, and the Blue River boys. I truly would like to own one of these hounds they sure would fit in the type of country here we have to hunt. I like a dog that can track an old feeder track, and come up with coon eyes to look at. I like a hound that will hunt out deep if he must, but not passing up coon going through the country.

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4044

on the bloodlines upclose, but do you think the old southern pride blood would be a good cross with a little jet5 female i have, well she goes back to jet 5 on top and bottom 3 generations back and the great granddad is spanky and the granddad is quail creek jet. or would i better off breeding her to jet 6?

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 763

Mark can you tell me just what the numbers do mean to you and what line you are staying away from because of them.

Titled dogs you listed:

Pride 34 titled pups
Rambler 33 titled pups
HammerII 41 titled pups
Jim 48 titled pups
Hammer III 45 titled pups
Ranger II 33 titled pups
Rebel 28 titled pups
Scout 66 titled pups
Hawk 97 titled pups
Smokey II 27 TITLED PUPS

Also what (in your opinion) does a "Line" consist of. I noticed of Smokey II's 14 ancestors 5 are Dalton bred. Just curious?Also has anyone ever noticed of the top 20 reproducing blueticks 12 of them have Hammer influence Now there is a number for ya lol.

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Dave & Nicki Oswald

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: illlinois
Posts: 1902

who has the "winningest blue line"...come on fellas. get real! no such thing...THEY ALL PLAYED A ROLE! each 10 years someone else just moves up..someone else wins something. i could say ol dwight cantrell, lead hill, ark. started some of the utchman or smokey river hounds. now look that one up...namely cantrell's blue buck! warren and dwight bred cantrell's shawn several times to ol rambler..yet only a few show up?! dwight is gone and so is his knowledge of breeding. oh yes..he also bred to bean's ranger. kept a female and made her a gr ch. by way of his son-in-law, alvin taylor. all of us have a favorite breeder and we base it on many different reasons. the fella that started us, the one who wins the most in the current hunts, a pedigree we heard about..list goes on and on. the top ten ONLY tell of those that made it to the nite hunts. but how many really made it as a good coonhound in the timber?! and when you read those "top ten" why not check out littermates? you never see any of them up there as well?! what about the one's who don't make the "top ten"? are they any less a reproducer? i'm sure we could ALL name some of those! and if you have started hunting in the last few years...then what you experience now is what you will remember later on. the past is just that to some..the past. and we have sure had some great ones before the "top ten" or the internet.....doesn't matter who bred them or hunted them..now does it? enjoy what you have and be grateful for the past..

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location:
Posts: 136

Jet 6`s mother has HammerV bred into her, so this might work ,if you cross your female with Jet 6.Jet 6 `s mother is Dark Blue bred. Steve Fussell probably has as much or more Hammer V blood concentrated at Dark Blue Kennels than anyone in the world

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Longview Texas
Posts: 801

John, I agree S R Chief has alot of hammer blood in him? What would you say, about 25 or 30%? What about the other 70% ? Plus, Smokey River Kennels was very well known before Cheif. You had Smokey River Blue Sage, Rambler, Sail, Diamond Jim etc. and a bunch of other Grand Nites, male and female alike. I would say he was pretty well known before Cheif. But you are right Cheif did have a good shot of hammer in him, maybe thats why it took so long for him to make Nite Ch. LOL.

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Indiana
Posts: 151

I am the one that had Molly. Ihad planned on breeding her to Jet 6 if I kept her. This would be a similar cross as Jet 7 and my buddies Willie dog. I like both real well. I have hunted both several times. Thier mother was also out of C W. I think this would be line breeding at its best.

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