UKC Forums - Think of the changes in ten short years.

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-- Think of the changes in ten short years. (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928482532)

Posted by Bruce m. Conkey on 05-25-2017 01:42 PM:

Think of the changes in ten short years.

Been almost 10 years since the Garmin Astro with DC 20 was introduced to the dog world. This has to be the most important change to dog hunting in the past fifty years. I know it had to be big when we went from carbide lights and lanterns to flashlights. But small in comparison to what the Garmin has done to change dog hunting around the world. Maybe the most important thing, is it took poor hearing and egos out of the equation. When trying to figure what your dog is doing. It tells on a dog that works a track back and forth. It shows you exactly where the deer runner is headed and exactly where it crossed the road. Just in case you cant believe it and want to check tracks. It will tell you if your dog is trailing behind a dog that is covering ground hunting. You can mark trees and go and check whats up trees your dog is leaving. Use to be only the bird hunters had control over their dogs with the stimulation and tone. Now good ole boys can round up a pack of hounds in minutes, which is a big improvement over half the night it use to take. Funny thing is with the knowledge this equipment brings us, we still think a dog should take three years to train. We have been the gift of knowledge and some won't accept it. Just think about this. Many of us have read John Wicks books. What if John was a young man training dogs today. Using todays tools and not having the baggage of old methods. He would be the same wise Man but he would be preaching a modern tune. I would love to be able to read it. In the past ten years, Garmin has changed the results we will get with our hounds forever.
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Posted by yadkintar on 05-25-2017 02:09 PM:

Bruce I agree with all of that but where I have changed is going to the little 3 dog local hunts or getting a ntch win hunting by yourself drawing the same guys every hunt don't trip my trigger no more if I had a puppy tomorrow it would probly be 3 yrs before you seen me at a hunt with that I am going to put it in every bad situation I can to the point that I am confident that dog can handle the pressure of competing in the bigger hunts not many young dogs can just my way of doing things don't mean it's right garmin sure does make it easyer tho.

Posted by Dpenton on 05-25-2017 02:46 PM:

Only changed for some!!!

The fact that knowledge is available and plentiful has no bearing on many in today's world. The same people with good hunting practices of old are in my opinion no different than today. If we base our decisions on the end result the outcome should be the same. If you strap a dc40 to Nailer he would be the same dog. If you strap that exact collar to a poodle it is the same dog. The only difference is the hard decisions that information causes us to face. In my opinion hunter's expectations of their dogs and the USE of information,ie. hunting distance and style, leaving trees, running trash is all that matters. If you know the bad and dont correct the habits or change your breeding program then you are no better off than the hunters of old. Most hunters are unfortunately not committed to improvement enough to make the hard choices. JMO

And yea go ahead and nail me on using Nailer I just picked one that people would recognize. I should have used another dog or another breed bla bla bla! lol

Posted by JiM on 05-25-2017 02:55 PM:

Good post Bruce. I wonder if Wick even uses a Garmin? I'll have to ask Zepp, I'm sure he'd know.

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Posted by MIKE CARDER on 05-25-2017 03:49 PM:

Robert

quote:
Originally posted by yadkintar
Bruce I agree with all of that but where I have changed is going to the little 3 dog local hunts or getting a ntch win hunting by yourself drawing the same guys every hunt don't trip my trigger no more if I had a puppy tomorrow it would probly be 3 yrs before you seen me at a hunt with that I am going to put it in every bad situation I can to the point that I am confident that dog can handle the pressure of competing in the bigger hunts not many young dogs can just my way of doing things don't mean it's right garmin sure does make it easyer tho.

I thought the change you made was you didn't cheat anymore. Lol. Guess not.
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Posted by joey on 05-25-2017 04:22 PM:

Didn't change how I train them. Just made it easier and caused me to be real disappointed a lot of nights.

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Posted by Bruce m. Conkey on 05-25-2017 04:25 PM:

It has made me more aware of what is actually going on and allowed more specific training in certain areas. Also allowed me to make quicker decisions on dog into the deer dog pack and allowed me to spend time on coonhounds with natural ability.

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Posted by 2ol2hunt on 05-25-2017 05:42 PM:

Most people still won't face the truth even when it's staring them in the face,I guess it's those alternative facts! Lol They had rather lie or maybe just fool themselves or it is still possible they just don't know what a dog is doing!

Posted by JiM on 05-25-2017 05:50 PM:

If I was a dog, I'd be doing my best to get them outlawed. Can't get away wifh nothin since they came out with those things.

Posted by pamjohnson on 05-25-2017 06:26 PM:

yadkintar

I feel the other way around than you. I don't like a dog titled out in the bigger hunts. to often it is so the handler of the hound or the hound itself can act like jerk because the people he is hunting against are no account to his actions during the hunt cause chances are they won't ever draw out together again.
after all titles only mean something if you see how there won and or know the people and dog there won buy real well.

Posted by Well Started on 05-26-2017 12:38 AM:

Re: Think of the changes in ten short years.

quote:
Originally posted by Bruce m. Conkey
Been almost 10 years since the Garmin Astro with DC 20 was introduced to the dog world.

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Then I must of been one of the first guinea pigs to try one. Remember that 1st DC 20 had the antenna sticking straight up out of the top? The weight of the 20 always had it worked around to the bottom of the dogs neck sooner or later resulting in the antenna pointing straight down. Loss of signal and an antenna dragging in the dirt and mud were a common theme.

I rigged up 2 C batteries taped to the outside bottom of the collar to act as a counterweight to keep the 20 up on top of the dogs neck......worked okay, but when they came out with the DC 30 I got myself 2 of them and haven't looked back. The Garmin is like going from a single speed bike to a Cadillac compared to what we use to use.

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Posted by yadkintar on 05-26-2017 01:03 AM:

Re: yadkintar

quote:
Originally posted by pamjohnson
I feel the other way around than you. I don't like a dog titled out in the bigger hunts. to often it is so the handler of the hound or the hound itself can act like jerk because the people he is hunting against are no account to his actions during the hunt cause chances are they won't ever draw out together again.
after all titles only mean something if you see how there won and or know the people and dog there won buy real well.

What I meant was I like stiff competition I also like to see good dog work if it's mine or sombody else's been at it a long time I want it to mean something when I win went from the beep beep strait to the alpha.

Posted by msinc on 05-26-2017 03:43 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by 2ol2hunt
Most people still won't face the truth even when it's staring them in the face,I guess it's those alternative facts! Lol They had rather lie or maybe just fool themselves or it is still possible they just don't know what a dog is doing!

I see this a lot around here. Don't get me wrong, I believe the Alpha 100 and TT-15 collar is the best thing to happen to this sport in a right good while. I still see guys cut their dog loose and it hits a track down in a bottom. Takes it up to high ground and grabs a slick tree right in the middle of a thicket of pine trees the biggest is 8" in diameter and maybe 20 foot tall. What's the guy do??? Walk right up the hill and squall and shine the tree, 15 minutes later leash the dog talking about how "the coon must have tapped that one"....the bad part is that these same guys just don't seem to ever figure it out. They will get another dog about a year later, if that long, and repeat the whole situation.
Running off game is bad enough, couple it with a handler/trainer that don't have a clue what the dog is doing and you really got problems.

Posted by CONRAD FRYAR on 05-26-2017 12:01 PM:

Msinc, Gadget hunters, they like the light, the squaller the Garmin etc... The dog is just a gadget also, don't like this one or I am tired of this one need to get another(never train one, cause it's really not about the hound. They are everywhere!

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Posted by msinc on 05-26-2017 12:21 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by CONRAD FRYAR
Msinc, Gadget hunters, they like the light, the squaller the Garmin etc... The dog is just a gadget also, don't like this one or I am tired of this one need to get another(never train one, cause it's really not about the hound. They are everywhere!

Yes sir. Gadget hunters is a good description...a lot of big game hunters could be called that too. I had a guy the other night whose dog ran gray foxes twice and ended up slick treed both times. His owner was actually bragging on the dog for "getting off to himself".....I mean, the dog never showed us a coon the entire night, but the owner was just as proud as if the dog got a first place win. When people are that far gone I don't even try to tell them different.

Posted by pamjohnson on 05-26-2017 01:51 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by msinc
Yes sir. Gadget hunters is a good description...a lot of big game hunters could be called that too. I had a guy the other night whose dog ran gray foxes twice and ended up slick treed both times. His owner was actually bragging on the dog for "getting off to himself".....I mean, the dog never showed us a coon the entire night, but the owner was just as proud as if the dog got a first place win. When people are that far gone I don't even try to tell them different.

this is so funny yet so true. to often it is the handler that keep these dogs from reaching there full potential.

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