UKC Forums - Hunt ?

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-- Hunt ? (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928479285)

Posted by CoryHamby22 on 04-08-2017 12:46 PM:

Hunt ?

Dogs a b and c are struck and treed in that order. Upon arrival dog c is found split 20 yds away from a and b. Split is declared. Trees do not touch in any way. Judge orders dogs to be handled. As handler of c walks past dogs a and b. Dog b moves to c"s tree and begins treeing.
Should dog b take his tree minus for moving?

Posted by Tom anderson on 04-08-2017 01:32 PM:

Yes

Posted by harleydan1956 on 04-08-2017 02:12 PM:

IMO, no. Judge has ordered dogs to be handled. At that time, judge knows who was where. I would not minus dog if I was the judge.

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Posted by CoryHamby22 on 04-08-2017 02:22 PM:

So after the call to handle. If handler fails to handle dog on his declared tree that dog can move to another tree and not take minus?
Cast vote minused the dog in question. Didn't effect outcome of cast. Just a question.

Posted by harleydan1956 on 04-08-2017 02:44 PM:

Would you minus a dog hard to handle? He showed the tree to the judges satisfaction. If a dog is in a hole and treed, shows you the hole, comes to you but not back to the hole, do you minus him? Sorry, IMO, dog showed the tree. Could also be interference due to a handler walking by him and to another tree
Maybe a stretch, but dog showed the tree. To the satisfaction of the judge.....
If dog was not declared treed, but on the tree when the judge arrived, then left when handlers walked in.... How would you score him? Coon seen... Would you minus him for being there? By minusing him, you agreed he was treed..... Hmmmm

Posted by CoryHamby22 on 04-08-2017 02:53 PM:

Would you minus if dog went back and opened on trail after being told to handle. Same difference. There's a lot of what if's.

Posted by Rip on 04-08-2017 02:57 PM:

I think this has come up enough that UKC made an official ruling on it and I am pretty sure that they decided that the dog is responsible for what it does until it is actually handled, not just told to handle so the dog would be minused for leaving the tree just like he would have if he had done it before you got there.

It gets more difficult when one chews a lead in two LOL.

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Posted by Tom anderson on 04-08-2017 02:58 PM:

I was not there and who knows what happened but if dog is treed on one tree it can not leave that tree and tree on another with out taking minus points

Posted by ssgied on 04-08-2017 03:05 PM:

Yes, minus tree points for leaving the first tree, then minus strike if coon is + on second tree. If the second tree is slick or off game he would get 25- on the tree also. Treeing on a closed tree.

Posted by joey on 04-08-2017 03:52 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by ssgied
Yes, minus tree points for leaving the first tree, then minus strike if coon is + on second tree. If the second tree is slick or off game he would get 25- on the tree also. Treeing on a closed tree.

Almost, he would not receive minus if it was slick because the cast had already arrived at the tree.

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Posted by rob thompson on 04-08-2017 07:33 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by harleydan1956
IMO, no. Judge has ordered dogs to be handled. At that time, judge knows who was where. I would not minus dog if I was the judge.

dog left the tree!

Posted by T.LEE on 04-08-2017 10:29 PM:

hunt

(Would you minus a dog hard to handle? He showed the tree to the judges satisfaction. If a dog is in a hole and treed, shows you the hole, comes to you but not back to the hole, do you minus him? Sorry, IMO, dog showed the tree.)

Neither of these situations apply. He said the dog was treed then moved to another tree and started treeing. How can you not minus the dog for moving. A dog hard to handle is not barking treed at another tree. A dog that is treed in a hole and comes out to meet you is not treeing in another spot.

Posted by Redneck Mafia on 04-09-2017 12:54 AM:

Re: hunt

quote:
Originally posted by T.LEE
(Would you minus a dog hard to handle? He showed the tree to the judges satisfaction. If a dog is in a hole and treed, shows you the hole, comes to you but not back to the hole, do you minus him? Sorry, IMO, dog showed the tree.)

Neither of these situations apply. He said the dog was treed then moved to another tree and started treeing. How can you not minus the dog for moving. A dog hard to handle is not barking treed at another tree. A dog that is treed in a hole and comes out to meet you is not treeing in another spot.

What if the dog left and just went on ... this is no different the dog is still minused for leaving his tree.

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Posted by damon shivers on 04-09-2017 02:20 AM:

No -

20yrds moves as dog c handler walked Past come on! All dogs act different when coming to getting handled at tree! Different strokes for different folks!why was dog c handler at tree before other handlers?

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Posted by msinc on 04-09-2017 01:18 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by damon shivers
20yrds moves as dog c handler walked Past come on! All dogs act different when coming to getting handled at tree! Different strokes for different folks!why was dog c handler at tree before other handlers?

This has in fact came up in question several times before...just because the judge orders dogs to be handled does not mean they are free to go do something else at that point. The tree is not "over" until it is scored.
The last time this came up a dog was ordered handled on a split tree. The cast goes to the one called first to score it and when they returned this dog was gone. He broke lose and went hunting again.
Leaving the tree is leaving the tree and the dog cannot do that. Ordering dogs to be handled does place dogs in a position where they cannot be minused.
Getting to the tree before "other handlers" is not an issue...maybe the other handlers were slow. As far as getting to the tree before the judge...last time I heard you got scratched for it, but in a hunt last night the "winner" and high scoring dogs handler beat the judge to EVERY tree. The judge did nothing about it. Dog got a first place win!!!

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