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-- Tom Tom (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928409202)

Tom Tom

Okay, me and my buddy need some advise.
My buddy got a pup about 6 months ago. The pup was a 11 months old. The pup has ran and treed coons. But here's the kicker. He runs the first track he runs over, whether its deer, bear, coyote, possum, skunk, pheasant, porcupines, squirrels. We've tried everything we know to get him focused on coon. But he just seems to be extremely trashy. And he's so independent that he won't run with an old dog. So I'm asking for some advise on what to do.
He has potential. He is lightning fast on what ever he runs. We just need to find out how to get him focused.

Fire him up with the shocker! Put him on the road to recovery!

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Bobby Cagle,
Waldron, Arkansas
(479) 207-3789

Yeah we tried the E-collar. He just doesn't respond well to it. My buddy is to the point to send him down the road. I know he has it in him to be a real good dog. He just needs to be trash broke. And we've tried everything we know of to get him straight.

How many time have you shocked him & at what level? How does he respond to it? It always works on mine. But I lay the juice to mine! I turn it as high as it'll go. Make em do flip flops if you know what I mean!

But you're hound is just 11 months old, he's got plenty of time to grow out of that! Just keep tweeking him with the shocker and he'll be just fine!

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Bobby Cagle,
Waldron, Arkansas
(479) 207-3789

if

im reading correct, he is now 17mnths old? I always had the best luck setting them up. Turning loose on trash and pour the juice to them as soon as they get exited (that means they don't have to even open on it). lots of praise when they tree a coon and give them the reward if you are allowed and able to. sounds like my type of dog.

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" an old wood burnin stove with no
natural gas "
405-471-7372

I believe you're right Tom! 17 month old dog needs the juice!

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Bobby Cagle,
Waldron, Arkansas
(479) 207-3789

What do you mean by "he doesn't respond well to it" I've never seen a dog that didn't respond to an e-collar.

???

How good can he run a coyote sounds like my kind of hound I like them full of fire

Some of 'em can't be broke. I had a Walker female about 20 yrs ago that refused to be broke off deer. I broke (temporarily) about 6 times. About two months later she would backslide. Outstanding coon hound otherwise. Most accurate I ever had. When treed.

How many nights has this dog been out and how many coon has he had in his mouth?

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John Smith
Ohio Valley Bluetick Kennel

I've got a 20 month old, solid coondog, but he likes to run a fox and a coyote every now and then. He's about to get the juice when I can get close enough to him. My shock collar now only reaches about 200-400 yards. Im fixing to order an alpha or a better shocker that reach at least a mile!

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Bobby Cagle,
Waldron, Arkansas
(479) 207-3789

Ok, what I mean by doesn't respond well to it is he will quit hunting all together for the night. We've set him up on deer. We hit the button made him flop like a fish and he wouldn't go more than 5-10 yrds from us the rest of the night(3-4 hrs). Now we've tried the collar on lower settings to see if he'd respond different to it, there's no difference between it on high or low for his reaction. And we aren't thinking after one deer he'd learn. We've set him up on prolly 20 deer in a few days time. You can take him out the next night and he'll still run a deer. we've left him in the pen for a few days for him him to think about it. And on first drop he might run anything under sun. He's had prolly 20-25 coon shot out. The first night of the season he done real good, treed 4 coon. He only ran coon that night. Night 2 of the season he ran trash. He never opened on coon. He has treed a few coon this year but the trash running has my buddy ready to cull him.
And at this time we haven't gone hunting in 3 weeks. It's been right around 0 for temps. And the wind chill makes it well below zero. But up until that point we were hunting 3-6 nights a week. Although this coming weekend has warmer temps coming.
The only thing we haven't tried is hunting the hide off of him. Hunting 7 days a week 5+ a day. We tried hunting 5-6 days a week 3-4 hrs a day and still the same.

sounds like he needs conditioned to the e-collar in the yard.

__________________
" an old wood burnin stove with no
natural gas "
405-471-7372

You need lessons in using an e-collar. Making him "flop like a fish" is not the answer.

Dedicated Trash Runners

Every dog is different, & they all react differently to different types of correction.

I had one years ago that flat loved those deer. The odd thing was he didn't really get bad about it until he turned 2 years old, & had multiple coon put down on him. When I first started working on him with the ecollar, he would leave the country when you laid the juice to him. You would usually find him treed several miles away. After he picked up on the ecollar & what would happen when he ran a deer, he got to where he would run them silent. You'd cut him loose, 20 minutes would go by & I'd get the beep beep out to check on him, & that rascal would be treed several miles away. He would run that junk out of the section you cut him in, stretch his legs good on it for a while, then drop off & tree a coon. That told me that dog knew it was wrong to run those deer, but he was like a junkie & just couldn't turn a good race down & learned how to do it & not get shocked. He did eventually improve some with age, but he never completely got over it.

Don Little (well known dog trainer in Illinois) always talked about shocking the dog on a lower setting for several seconds at a time, over & over again while they were running junk. His logic was they basically would learn that it is an uncomfortable experience to run that junk for the entire time they are running it. Don said this method would not take the desire/fire out of a dog.

I don't have any kind of good advice to give you. I will say it is a lot less aggravation hunting one that has a natural preference for a coon.

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Don Little (well known dog trainer in Illinois) always talked about shocking the dog on a lower setting for several seconds at a time, over & over again while they were running junk. His logic was they basically would learn that it is an uncomfortable experience to run that junk for the entire time they are running it. Don said this method would not take the desire/fire out of a dog.

Here's the answer. If you can bump him ten times on the same deer track, he's going to think, boy this sure ain't as much fun as I thought it was. If you try to burn his head off he'll come back to the truck cowered down not knowing what hit him or why.

makes sense!! good info to store back in my tiny lil brain

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" an old wood burnin stove with no
natural gas "
405-471-7372

quote:

---

Originally posted by shadinc
You need lessons in using an e-collar. Making him "flop like a fish" is not the answer.

---

X2. Works on mine! But my crappy shocker only works on high. But I like the idea of conditioning this man's hound. Maybe working the tone, then slowly giving him the juice? Idk. Beyond me. I know if they keep getting away with it, they'll get worse. But this dog ain't been getting away with it! What does he do when you hunt him by himself? Does he not trash as bad?

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Bobby Cagle,
Waldron, Arkansas
(479) 207-3789

Again this isn't my dog. It's my buddy's dog. Yes we've condition the dog to the collar. Yes we've started off slow and gradually increased the heat. Until he started to notice it was uncomfortable. He will run through the low settings like its not on him. He's getting tone wise also. And what I'm saying is he's a HARD HEADED S.O.B. He's figured out that if he stays close by us he won't get the juice or tone. I think the dog is collar conditioned.

It doesn't matter whether he's with company or not. We've been hunting this dog solo since just before holloween and he still does it. I won't run my young dog with him. And both old dogs go right to work when unsnapped. He just happens to be very independent.

Im at a loss! Some people cut their loss and some keep pushing forward with a dog.

If it were me, I'd keep putting it to him, and I'd where my shocker out on him. Send him back to the truck and go to the house! Next night, I'd turn a live coon out to him. Give it a couple minute head start. When he trees it, pet him up, and give him the meat.

Next night, whenever he runs trash, same thing, we go to the house or he stays in the dogbox. Repeat with the live coon as much as you can. Were hoping he'll relate trash with not getting to hunt the rest of the night. And reward and what you want with the coon.?.

I don't know, but sometimes I have to take a pup back to school and remind him what I want him to do. But, Idk. You've probably already have done that. Best of luck to you! And I hope you get him lined out and on track!

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Bobby Cagle,
Waldron, Arkansas
(479) 207-3789

[QUOTE]Originally posted by bobbycagle1
[B]Im at a loss! Some people cut their loss and some keep pushing forward with a dog.

If it were me, I'd keep putting it to him, and I'd where my shocker out on him. Send him back to the truck and go to the house! Next night, I'd turn a live coon out to him. Give it a couple minute head start. When he trees it, pet him up, and give him the meat.

Next night, whenever he runs trash, same thing, we go to the house or he stays in the dogbox. Repeat with the live coon as much as you can. Were hoping he'll relate trash with not getting to hunt the rest of the night. And reward and what you want with the coon.?.

I don't know, but sometimes I have to take a pup back to school and remind him what I want him to do.

GOOD IDEA^^^^Okay, the only thing we haven't tried is putting him in pen after he trashes. It sounds like we will at least have a place to start with him. See we just ignore him after he does it and is at our feet.

If at first you don't succeed try and try again. Only you can decide when you've had enough.

Just remember to reinforce the negative with something positive. You'll have to live trap you a few coon, but you can fix him hopefully!

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Bobby Cagle,
Waldron, Arkansas
(479) 207-3789

Yeah. thanks for your advice. I hope this works. Its not like he's not worth trying to get corrected. It's frustrating is all. Here's his ped


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