UKC Forums - Socialism or Fascism

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Posted by Bob Hennessey on 12-16-2013 07:28 PM:

Socialism or Fascism

If you aren't too lazy and you have time research both there are lots of information if you look. What I found was very interesting mostly because of the left and right stance. It would be nice to get some thoughtful responses , but I don't have much hope. Too many on here will just post nonsense because they are too lazy to put the time in to give a informed response, but we will see.
It's cold outside and coyotes aren't moving deer hunting ended yesterday and if weather permits the dogs will be going hunting tomorrow.

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Posted by Randy Tallon on 12-16-2013 07:43 PM:

Fascisim relies on a strong leader. If you're going where I think you're going we can rule that out!!

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Posted by brushrunretiree on 12-16-2013 11:08 PM:

I hope it is beginning to become clear what is going on here. Communism, Socialism and Fascism ARE ALL THE SAME. The subtle differences between them are minor things that make hardly any difference. It's like me asking you whether you would like to die by lethal injection or by having your head cut off. Either way you're dead. Don't let the process towards dictatorial, totalitarian tyranny fool you. In the end it is tyranny.

Capitalism is the best form of government we have experienced on earth so far because it is in the closest alignment with the laws of the universe and truth. It mirrors openness and freedom. It advocates responsibility and integrity. We should never forget just how important such virtues are.

The more socialism fails the more power we lose until finally our new dictator will come in and seize our property, rights and freedoms. This is basic history. All it takes is one generation to forget and they will experience it.
I researched the differences between the different "ism's" and thought this explained my position the best!!

Posted by truly on 12-17-2013 04:46 AM:

Re: Socialism or Fascism

quote:
Originally posted by The Seeker
If you aren't too lazy and you have time research both there are lots of information if you look. What I found was very interesting mostly because of the left and right stance. It would be nice to get some thoughtful responses , but I don't have much hope. Too many on here will just post nonsense because they are too lazy to put the time in to give a informed response, but we will see.
It's cold outside and coyotes aren't moving deer hunting ended yesterday and if weather permits the dogs will be going hunting tomorrow.

Bob, back when Obama was running for office I kept hearing him being called a fascist AND a socialist. By the same person, in the same sentence. At the time I did not know the meaning well, so out of curiosity I looked it up.
As you probably know, a fascist is (among other things) a person OPPOSED to socialism, communism or even liberal democracy. So a person can't be a "fascist socialist". That being said the term fascist has come to be a general pejorative term. Most often used by people who don't even know what it means. Besides Mussolini's fascists I don't think anyone else has called themselves fascists.
Fascists tend to be Uber nationalists- flag waving and proclaiming the greatness of their "homeland". Lots of symbolism, loyalty oaths and signature gestures. Fascists would be incensed if they saw someone not honoring a tradition appropriate for the time- seeing a president not with his hand over his heart during an Anthem, or not properly saluting a troop. Fascists tend to be very pro war and pro expansion. Imperialism and running over smaller weaker countries. By these criteria fascists would generally line up with much of right leaning Americans today. I have also often heard that fascism is "the merger of corporation and state", or similarly the wealth class taking over government to run it for their own well being. By those last two terms it is hard to argue that we aren't nearly there now, since we opened the doors to all of the money invading Washington through lobbyists, specials interest groups, and all of the "dark" 501C4 money it sure looks like the wealth class runs our country now. IMO I think since the Reagan era and onward we have had a "kabuki theatre" style of govt. The Dems and Reps (actual elected officials- not their constituents) play this back and forth game but behind the scenes shadowy figures really pull all the strings. Having Bush 1 in office suggests that our govt has been heavily infiltrated by "intel guys".
I don't think it is particularly helpful to cite a specific person or specific action to be the best example of fascism as the term is so pejorative. That being said, I do feel like there is plenty of reason to think this country has been at least mildly fascist for much of my lifetime.
wiki gives it a pretty good shot:
"Fascism /ˈfćʃɪzəm/ is a form of radical authoritarian nationalism[1][2] that came to prominence in early 20th-century Europe. Influenced by national syndicalism, the first fascist movements emerged in Italy around World War I, combining more typically right-wing positions with elements of left-wing politics, in opposition to communism, socialism, liberal democracy and, in some cases, traditional right-wing conservatism. Although fascism is usually placed on the far right on the traditional left–right spectrum, fascists themselves and some commentators have argued that the description is inadequate.[3][4]
Fascists sought to unify their nation through a totalitarian state that promoted the mass mobilization of the national community,[5][6] and were characterized by having a vanguard party that initiated a revolutionary political movement aiming to reorganize the nation along principles according to fascist ideology.[7] Hostile to liberal democracy, socialism, and communism, fascist movements shared certain common features, including the veneration of the state, a devotion to a strong leader, and an emphasis on ultranationalism and militarism. Fascism views political violence, war, and imperialism as a means to achieve national rejuvenation[5][8][9][10] and asserts that stronger nations have the right to expand their territory by displacing weaker nations."

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patriotism is supporting your country all of the time and your government when it deserves it.
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Posted by truly on 12-22-2013 10:13 PM:

Pretty good 54 minute talk here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bNEqAU7S2w#t=3240
While Hedges is critical of Christianity's use to drive fascism, don't write him off, he grew up the son of a Pastor and got his Masters in Divinity from Harvard before going in to journalism.

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patriotism is supporting your country all of the time and your government when it deserves it.
if you think the price of education is high, check out the cost of ignorance!

Posted by trackdriver on 12-22-2013 10:41 PM:

In short the repub.party now.

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