UKC Forums (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/index.php)
- Black & Tans (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=47)
-- Training (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928332133)

Training

Lets try it and se what happens and keep it clean and simple if you can't then don't post.

I'll start it off with this.....when starting a young dog it doesn't bother me if they tree opossums because even though it's junk they have what they was tracking. How does everyone else feel about starting a young dog on grinners?

Personally, I never would do it simply because I'd have to re-tread old tracks when I had to break the dog from treeing em. Makes for a confused dog. If they can smell a possum they can smell a raccoon.

__________________
Midnight Black and Tan Kennel
GRNITECH Midnight Gunner
GRNITECH PKC CH Midnight Super Crow
Nathan Nantz
nantz54@msn.com

I won't put a possum in front of them but if they tree one I don't pet them up or punish them either

I've never seen a dog that had tree in them not tree possum , I get nervous when a young dog is out in the woods and starting to hunt and can't even tree a possum... or likes to run coyotes or dillers more than tree even a possum.

I agree that all your exposure with a pup should be consistant and mimick what you will do later ... no re-training.

Don't use too many hides , or at the house much , or in the daytime .. it takes years to learn what is a waste of time and how to be effecient .. timing and reading your dog so that he goes from nothing to treeing his own coon in the shortest amount of hunts ... early , medium or late starting.

Dogs are much more intuitive than we think ... they pick up on if trashing bothers us , if we are consistant .. like do we let them slide when we aren't hunting with friends and embarassed ... they can sense if you are committed to a hard night or just wanting to tree one and go home .. most smart dogs , anyway.

Trashing is alot genetic .. you can trash break dogs on the surface or if they know they have a collar on ... but trash free to the point of not trashing ever or when the pack does ... that is much more genetic.....

Ever notice that when soemone has a trashy dog , they spend all their hunting time around breaking that dog til' the dog dies .... and some dogs just take a good " come to Jesus meeting' and they quit.

90% of training is being hardcore about what pup you invest in ... at puberty .. watch that pup and judge it like it was grown .. dont keep a pup that has a trait you already need to fix or hope they grow out of ... the money or heartache you lose upfront will still be less than the aggrivation later on when you do all that work and never had enough dog flesh for finished product .

I like to let mine run loose so they can let all those natural abilities come out then when they start staying gone days at a time I put em up. When I start hunting them they are usually already treed squirrels, possums, coons, run rabbits,deer, even had some tree an run a few bear. I don't praise them for treeing possums but don't brake em til it gets to be a problem. I'm a firm believer in hunting a dog with since. Most brake there selves after several coons are put out to em. What I've seen anyway.

POSSUMS

A OLD GENTELMAN TOLD ME MANY YEARS AGO ,NEVER BEAT OR WHIP A YOUNG DOG FOR TREEIN POSSUMS TILL THEY KNOW WHAT A COON IS ,THIS OLE MAN WOULD SAY RENNY THAT WAS MY NICK NAME WHEN I WAS YOUNG A BLACK AN TAN ,REDBONE , BLUETICK ECT ECT ARE TREE DOGS THERE SUPPOSE TO TREE GAME THAT GOS UP A TREE AND POSSUMS GO UP TREES,SQUIRRELS,CHIPMUNKS COONS AND OTHERS DO TOO.WHEN THEY TREE THESE THERE DOIN WHAT THERE BRED TO DO ,TREEIN IS THE HARDEST THING TO GET DOGS TO DO AND DO RIGHT,,,JUST THINK OF HOW MANY DOGS YOU OWNED THAT COULD RUN TRACK BUT COULDNT OR DIDNT TREE.I HAD A MANY GOOD TRACK DOGS THROUGH THE YEARS THAT COULD FLY ON A TRACK BUT NEVER MADE A TREEDOG OR SOME NEVER EVER LOOKED UP A TREE,,,THOSE WERE GIVEN A FARMERS BURYIEL {CULLED} SO YEP IF THEY TREE WHEN THERE YOUNG AND NEVER HAVE TREED BEFORE WHETHER ITS POSSUM ,OR CHIPMUNK IL PETEM UP ,AFTER THEY VE TREED SOME COONS THEN DO THAT ,,THEN I WORK ON THEM ,,THATS MY STORY,,,HAVE A BLESSED ONE MY FRIENDS ,,,FROM THE RIVERBOTTOM,,,RON

__________________
RON MAGGART FIELDON ILLINOIS
{TEAM BIBLE THUMPER}
ALWAYS REMEMBER GOD GAVE US FRIENDS AND COONHOUNDS, " I AM A GREATLY BLESSED",HIGHLY FAVORED" " IMPERFECT BUT FORGIVEN CHILD OF GOD "KEEP YOUR {FAITH IN GOD } FAITH SEES THE INVISIBLE,BELIEVES THE INCREDIBLE,AND RECIEVES THE IMPOSSIBLE. WERE BLESSED !!

I would never reward a pup on a possum just pull em off and send them on until they tree coon regularly then I let em know how much I hate looking at possum but each individual hound has its own personality what works on one dog might not work on another

__________________
mike smith

I wouldn't say I start them on slick tails but I won't correct them the first couple times. I just let em tree it I don't praise any just leash up and walk away with no talking. The next coon they tree I make a point to give them more praise then normal. They usually catch on quick with out any real trouble breaking them.

__________________
Chris Nidy


Give me a call anytime and we can cut loose some black dogs. 330-553-0148

I've got another question. I think my dog is literally goin huntin for deer. Y'all got any ideas? I don't know what to do about this.

__________________
Andrew Jones
662-603-5924

GrNiteCh GrCh 'PR' Tree Slammin Magnum(Grnitech Tree Slammin Hammer x Grnitech Grch Black Creek Slamin Lucy HTX)
~2016 PKC Winter Classic Cast Winner

Andrew
Have you done any trash breaking of any kind yet?

__________________
Chris Nidy


Give me a call anytime and we can cut loose some black dogs. 330-553-0148

You can take a collar and force a dog to NOT run junk..... But if they're natural at it the propensity to do so is always there....and they may learn to tree coon in the process. You can break em with a collar, but I've found that most get smart to that collar. And the first time you leave it at home they'll revert back to old habits. They know when that collar is on their neck. The best coondogs I've been around took to coon naturally, and were never really interested in anything that didn't climb a tree.

I don't know of any other way besides break em with an e collar.

__________________
Midnight Black and Tan Kennel
GRNITECH Midnight Gunner
GRNITECH PKC CH Midnight Super Crow
Nathan Nantz
nantz54@msn.com

I'd agree with Nathan ... it's a hard lesson to learn.


You can hightail it in there and get between the dog and the deer and have a " come to Jesus' meeting with them .... it's more powerful than a shock collar ... if given the choice between death and leaving deer alone ... a dog will choose to leave it alone ... all dogs that are to reach the highest levels will have some quirk or willfull streak in some area and will have to have that talk to be their best.

But unless a young dog is just super talented and is treeing coon in style every night after he runs deer ... it's foolish to try and seperate dog or man from their true love.

I agree with ya Ron. There first tree no matter what it is I pat them on the ribs a couple times and try again. I have a 6 month old pup that is crossed up out of my own stuff and what ever he trees is coming out. I don't care what it is its dead. But that's why I made that cross I wanted an all purpose dog to walk into the tree and not knowing what's up there but there will be something there. I like competition hunting but I think sometimes a man gets away from what it really is. And that's what I'm going back to. Ill see you all in about 2 or 3 years with a string of dogs. I'm going to try two or three different things to see how it pans out. But good luck to you all with your hounds and hopefully ill see you at Black and Tan days when I get what I'm looking for.

To Andrew

If you have a shocker going out on morning hunts is the way to break a dog off deer because you can actually watch them chase and catch them in the act. I know some of my best training has come during day light hours...to include pups not pissing with livestock which is a must in this area.

My humble opinion I have had more bad than good come from whooping a dog for treeing slick tails so now I snap em up and walk em away from the tree with out saying a word, deer are a different story I wont put up with that crap, I shock them and if that don't work, well I start lookin for their replacement. Im out there to go to my hounds on a tree, more times than not they got a coon, but slick tails are good for a laugh once in a while. A wise old man told me "there are to many good coon dogs out there so why feed one that doesn't make you happy." moral of the story is: its all about what YOU are willing to deal with night after night. happy huntin.