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Split tree ruling ??????

Dog A gets 125, dog B trails in and trees for 75 with three minutes left on tree , dog C trees with 1 minute left . Cast gets to the tree dog A has left and dog B and C are split 10 yards apart ? Do the tree points stay the same???????

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No the tree points don't stay the same but that's the easy question. The difficult question is wich tree did dog A leave.

....

Don't know which tree dog a left they were to close together , who knows she might ve been split too

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B stays at 75. C moves up to 125.

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Michael Ghorley

quote:

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Originally posted by GA DAWG
B stays at 75. C moves up to 125.

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Johnny yoder 816 529 3257
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quote:

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Originally posted by barker-creek
Just cause c treed later than b doesn't give it anymore right to move up than b............??????????

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"Believe Nothing You Hear and Only Half of What You See."

Always thought they stayed the same as they were called unless the split tree was obvious then dog c would move up to 125

quote:

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Originally posted by WEBBER
Your right, But UKC has given DAWG's Interpretation of the rule this way. DAWGS answer is correct per UKC.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Joe~mcavoy
Always thought they stayed the same as they were called unless the split tree was obvious then dog c would move up to 125

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quote:

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Originally posted by Rob Reid
Wich rule is this under?

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__________________
"Believe Nothing You Hear and Only Half of What You See."

Re: Split tree ruling ??????

quote:

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Originally posted by barker-creek
Dog A gets 125, dog B trails in and trees for 75 with three minutes left on tree , dog C trees with 1 minute left . Cast gets to the tree dog A has left and dog B and C are split 10 yards apart ? Do the tree points stay the same???????

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__________________
Tree Jar'n Black and Tans
Home of Tree Jar'n Coonhound Kennels


319-201-8445

Re: Re: Split tree ruling ??????

quote:

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Originally posted by berger
No

Dog C will move up to 125 on tree. As no split tree was declared B & C were considered treed with A. Since dog A left before you got there B was still showing tree that means dog C was showing split tree when you arrived. Which tree A was on is a mute point.

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__________________
Johnny yoder 816 529 3257
Grntch Johnsons So. blue kitt>>>>>
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quote:

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Originally posted by WEBBER
Coonhound Advisor Interpretation of Rules.......

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Re: Re: Re: Split tree ruling ??????

quote:

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Originally posted by barker-creek
dog a was still considered treed when c treed ........ There is no way to prove which dog split. Just cause c treed later does nt mean he was the one that split

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Split tree ruling ??????

quote:

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Originally posted by Rob Reid
There is no way to prove any two dogs were ever on the same tree.

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__________________
Johnny yoder 816 529 3257
Grntch Johnsons So. blue kitt>>>>>
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Grnitech barker creeks blue poncho>>>>
Barker creeks blue Polly>>>>

Re: Re: Re: Split tree ruling ??????

quote:

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Originally posted by barker-creek
dog a was still considered treed when c treed ........ There is no way to prove which dog split. Just cause c treed later does nt mean he was the one that split

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__________________
Tree Jar'n Black and Tans
Home of Tree Jar'n Coonhound Kennels


319-201-8445

dog A left -125
Dog B & C are split both tree in at 125

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Split tree ruling ??????

quote:

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Originally posted by barker-creek
exactly!!!!!!! Where in the advisory do you find it???

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__________________
"Believe Nothing You Hear and Only Half of What You See."

http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthrea...mp;pagenumber=1

Allen w/ UKC Posted:::::::::
Seems like I may have some of you very confused. Possibly because of my terminolgy or lack thereof. Please allow me to make this very clear. First, I am well aware of page 99 in the Advisor. What Todd Kellam wrote there has not changed. Not one bit.

My question is this; how is the situation on page 99 of the Advisor and the scenario posted by Mr. Hagood even related? Please read both of them again. The difference in the two is that in Darrell’s scenario dog C is “obviously” split from A.

Again, I guess I wasn't clear enough. We're talking about situations where you have dogs declared treed, then, when you get to the tree you find one or more has left and the rest are on separate trees. (split wasn’t "obvious" until you got there and "saw" it.) You don't really know which tree the running dog(s) actually left, therefore, making it a confusing or difficult situation to score.

What I am "trying" to get across is that in situations where it was never "obvious" that any of the dogs were split (until you got to the tree and "saw" it), and to have a consistent way of scoring these difficult situations, use dog A's tree as the "root". Why? Because according to Rule 11 a judge never declares a dog split unless it is obvious or until at a point when it does become obvious. In some instances it doesn’t become obvious until you get there and see it; as in Darrell’s scenario and in the examples shown below.

If we stick with that theory or rule of thumb that we score dogs as being on the same tree “unless or until” it becomes obvious then we have a consistent way of scoring these difficult situations. May not always be exactly what happened but neither are any other ways you might use to score them. At least we have a method to use that’s consistent and probably as fair as any other options if you really think about it. And, if you haven’t learned that the breaks don’t always go your way then you haven’t been huntin’ long enough.

Example 1 -
Dogs A, B, C and D are declared treed in that order. Upon arriving dog C is gone and dog D is on a separate tree.

Tree Points:
Dog A = 125
Dog B = 75
Dog C = 50-
Dog D = 125

Example 2 -
Dogs A, B, C and D are declared treed in that order. Upon arriving dogs A and D are treed together. Dog B is on a separate tree and Dog C is gone.

Tree Points:
Dog A = 125
Dog B = 125
Dog C = 75- (moved up one tree position because B is on separate tree)
Dog D = 50 (moved up one tree position because dog B is on separate tree)

Example 3 -
Dogs A, B, C and D are declared treed in that order. Upon arriving dog A is gone. B, C and D are treed together.

Tree points:
Dog A = 125-
Dog B = 75
Dog C = 50
Dog D = 25
( this example is similar to TK’s scenario on page 99 of the Advisor – difference is three dogs stayed instead of just the one.)

Example 4 -
Dogs A, B, C and D are declared treed in that order. Upon arriving dog A is gone. B and C are treeing together and D is on a separate tree.

Tree points:
Dog A = 125-
Dog B = 75
Dog C = 50
Dog D = 125

Example 5 -
Dogs A, B, C and D are declared treed in that order. Upon arriving A is on one tree. B and C are both gone. D is on separate tree.

Tree points:
Dog A = 125
Dog B = 75-
Dog C = 50-
Dog D = 125

Example 6 -
Dogs A, B, C and D are declared treed in that order. Upon arriving A is gone. B and D are treed together and C is on a separate tree.

Tree Points:
Dog A = 125-
Dog B = 75
Dog C = 125
Dog D = 50 (moved up one position because C is on separate tree.)

Example 7 –
Dogs A, B, C and D are declared treed in that order. Upon arriving dogs A and B are gone. C is on one tree and D is on a separate tree.

Tree points:
Dog A = 125-
Dog B = 75-
Dog C = 50
Dog D = 125
(this one will likely bring on the biggest argument, but again, it is staying consistent with the theory of using the root tree. Why? Because it was never obvious that the dogs were split until the cast arrived and “saw” D on a separate tree. We don’t assume A and B were anywhere else other than with C because it wasn’t obvious.)

Hopefully, these examples will help a little to get the idea and eliminate any confusion. Especially, in regards to page 99 of the Advisor as the two situations are not really related.

__________________
"Believe Nothing You Hear and Only Half of What You See."

Barker Creek

How would you score this?
Dogs A, B, C, D are treed in that order. When you get to the tree B is gone C is split treed 10 yards away. How would you score these dogs tree points.

__________________
Tree Jar'n Black and Tans
Home of Tree Jar'n Coonhound Kennels


319-201-8445

Re: Barker Creek

quote:

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Originally posted by berger
How would you score this?
Dogs A, B, C, D are treed in that order. When you get to the tree B is gone C is split treed 10 yards away. How would you score these dogs tree points.

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__________________
"Believe Nothing You Hear and Only Half of What You See."

Re: Re: Barker Creek

quote:

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Originally posted by WEBBER
where is D?

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__________________
Tree Jar'n Black and Tans
Home of Tree Jar'n Coonhound Kennels


319-201-8445

A = 125
B = 75-
C = 125
D = 50

__________________
"Believe Nothing You Hear and Only Half of What You See."

quote:

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Originally posted by WEBBER
A = 125
B = 75-
C = 125
D = 50

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__________________
Tree Jar'n Black and Tans
Home of Tree Jar'n Coonhound Kennels


319-201-8445

He may have been??? but dog B was placed on the paper as being on A's tree. If it's not obvious, that is where dog B stays unless you know otherwise. I don't make the rules! See my previous post on UKC's ruling.

__________________
"Believe Nothing You Hear and Only Half of What You See."