UKC Forums - got a ?

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Posted by damon shivers on 03-19-2012 04:15 AM:

got a ?

I was judging my cast first tree was quick heard some fighting or face barking not sure 5 wasn't up yet but I ran in about 50 yards from tree and threw my bright light seen nothing.tree closed I said handle dogs.my female was tied up beside other blue female I kept hearing growling but every time I looked they weren't near each other.went to another spot turned loose I got first and first called treed for 3 min and moved I minused my female then other blue female treed same area my female came back after we went to tree and treed 50 yds from that female I retreed her she went to other female took minus only went to tree then I handled.Had to turn loose to other dogs that were struck in we struck in for 25 a piece walker male tree my female backed they were treeing hard till other blue female came in.We were about 300 yrds away we started to walk towards them 5 was up so going in we heard some fighting ran in 50 yrds threw my bright light on other blue was on tree my female came around from back to get on tree and all I seen was a ball of blue and some yeps my female came to me with her tail between her legs so i asked if other cast members seen what I seen they said yes I asked if they could tell who the agresser was they said no so i scratched both dogs my? Did I do this right?my female has been in alot of hunts and I've hunted with pup adults never seen a mean hair on her I knew it was the other female just made me sick!

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Posted by Rolin Blues on 03-19-2012 04:34 AM:

Tough Break

But for this night only, don't let it get you down. You did what had to be done. If majority didn't see the "agreeser", both had to be written up. Had it happen a couple times in 40+ years of comp. hunting. Never worried about it because I knew it was not my dog that started it & didn't figure it was an issue. Surprising that the other dog involved will usually have 'issues' at other hunts & then seems to disappear from the hunts. Take care, Ron.

Posted by Bill(Chew) on 03-19-2012 04:40 AM:

I agree with Ron. I've writen up my own dogs before just so I can get the ill dog. If your dog is not ill it will probably not get written up again but the ill dog probably will.

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Posted by damon shivers on 03-19-2012 04:44 AM:

agree

I'm not worried about my dog he said she won't be in another!I say good!

Posted by patches9452 on 03-19-2012 05:52 AM:

if you were the judge you are the only one had to see it... if you scratched your dog when you seen the other dog jump on her you were wrong... aggressive behavior isnt a voting thing... you make the call

Posted by damon shivers on 03-19-2012 06:56 AM:

not sure

I couldn't honestly say which one was which two dark blues in a ball just know my dog never seen her look at another dog at anytime no matter what treed with her the only thing I've seen her tree straight up treeing 130 bpm

Posted by Outback1 on 03-19-2012 01:31 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by patches9452
if you were the judge you are the only one had to see it... if you scratched your dog when you seen the other dog jump on her you were wrong... aggressive behavior isnt a voting thing... you make the call

I dont think thats right, I belive it is a majority, if I'm wrong the master of hounds at the Grand American was wrong.

Posted by Rip on 03-19-2012 01:48 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Outback1
I dont think thats right, I belive it is a majority, if I'm wrong the master of hounds at the Grand American was wrong.

The judge makes the call.

UKC Rules "2. The Hunting Judge has complete authority and
will be responsible for scoring all situations." He scores it.

The cast can then vote to overturn the call or not.

If the judge only scratches one they can question not scratching the other and then vote on that too.

But the judge makes the call. The cast can then question the call after the fact.

There are three things if I remember correctly that are not just a judges descision. One is scoring the tree, two is calling time out and the third is determining that the dogs have went back to the same tree. There may be another one I am missing but the point is there are very few times a cast vote is used in a cast. The majority of the time the judge rules and the cast can question it.

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Posted by Charles Pullen on 03-19-2012 02:49 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Rip
The judge makes the call.

UKC Rules "2. The Hunting Judge has complete authority and
will be responsible for scoring all situations." He scores it.

The cast can then vote to overturn the call or not.

If the judge only scratches one they can question not scratching the other and then vote on that too.

But the judge makes the call. The cast can then question the call after the fact.

There are three things if I remember correctly that are not just a judges descision. One is scoring the tree, two is calling time out and the third is determining that the dogs have went back to the same tree. There may be another one I am missing but the point is there are very few times a cast vote is used in a cast. The majority of the time the judge rules and the cast can question it.

Yes Rip there's only 3 and you're right on these too.

Posted by Outback1 on 03-19-2012 03:58 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Rip
The judge makes the call.

UKC Rules "2. The Hunting Judge has complete authority and
will be responsible for scoring all situations." He scores it.

The cast can then vote to overturn the call or not.

If the judge only scratches one they can question not scratching the other and then vote on that too.

But the judge makes the call. The cast can then question the call after the fact.

There are three things if I remember correctly that are not just a judges descision. One is scoring the tree, two is calling time out and the third is determining that the dogs have went back to the same tree. There may be another one I am missing but the point is there are very few times a cast vote is used in a cast. The majority of the time the judge rules and the cast can question it.

So if I read this right, I see the agresor, scratch the dog , the other guys want both scratched when I clearly see the dog jump on the other dog,so tthey can question my call, vote on it, you have a 2-2 tie becaulse the other two guys want them both scratched so your down to a two dog cast then, go back to the club house and the MO say's both are scratched, while neither of the dog's involved belong to the judge so it would be a benfit if the judge did scratch both dogs, why then would the judge bother to be put in that situation when a vote can over turn his decision?

Posted by JSTARR on 03-19-2012 04:20 PM:

btt

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Posted by Rolin Blues on 03-19-2012 08:28 PM:

patches9452, CAREFUL

I could agree that the judge only needs to see aggressor, but a lot of arguements get started that way or a 'shifty' judge tries to eliminate cast members. Best to have whole cast together so everyone sees the same thing, so only 1 dog gets scratched. Take care, Ron.

Posted by Slough on 03-19-2012 09:02 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Outback1
I dont think thats right, I belive it is a majority, if I'm wrong the master of hounds at the Grand American was wrong.

Not gona say which way, but a ukc rep at the zones a few years ago said no voting, judges decision.

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Posted by buffaloriver on 03-19-2012 10:45 PM:

found this on ukc website under the advisor

There is one other situation in which UKC has enacted a policy that is not directly covered in the rules. We have supported the right of a non-hunting Judge to go into a tree alone with his or her light off in an attempt to determine if a dog is interfering with other dogs by aggressive behavior. Other than those situations described, a hunting Judge has the same authority as a non-hunting Judge. As an example, when it comes to scratching a dog for any reason, including fighting, it is the decision of the hunting Judge.

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