UKC Forums - What's Your Opinion?

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Posted by adlj on 12-28-2011 04:07 AM:

What's Your Opinion?

Which dogs typically turn out to be the best dogs, early starters or late bloomers? Any top winning hounds you can name to back up your opinion?

Posted by Rocketman55 on 12-28-2011 05:15 AM:

In my opinion, the majority of early starters (pups that start running & treeing and I mean get open and get bellied up ) before 6 months of age, the majority of them will end up being a little rough around the tree.

The late bloomer ( pups that start running and treeing after 12 months of age, Bellied up) are not what I like either.

It is my opinion that the pup that starts around 9-12 months that makes the best all around, (pleasure or competition) dog. Again thats just my opinion and I'm dumber than a rock.

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Posted by adlj on 12-28-2011 07:56 PM:

Thanks for your input, but can anyone name any top hounds that fit either one of these catagories?

Posted by Tim Trone on 12-28-2011 08:29 PM:

Im not gonna say my dog is a top hound but he was started on coon at 5 yrs old ( hog and bear dog for his first 5 yrs )and is a very solid coon dog . It doesnt matter to me when they star because i have them at different ages here and dont really start messin with them till i see that they act a little more like an older dog in the way they act in the kennel . I show all a coon when they are young and when they start showin more interest i start puttin more time in . I believe a lot depends on the dog , their trainer and the dogs they hunt around . jmo

Posted by old ben on 12-28-2011 08:47 PM:

imo breed plays a big part i have 2 walkers that started early one is 2.5 now slick treeing quite a bit .other 1.5 wont get out over 150 yrds ..red dog 1.5 showed no intrest untill 3 or 4 months ago again jmo

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Posted by Dwils on 12-28-2011 09:10 PM:

There is really no proof in percentages or numbers to give any solid opinion on this. "i think when its all said and done , there are people that are very good at starting dogs, and there are people that are excellent at finishing dogs. and i believe thats what it boils down to more than anything.

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Posted by adlj on 12-29-2011 02:37 AM:

I just gave up on a Skuna River/local bred female. She was about 2.5-3 yrs old and had been to a starting facility along with lots of time in the woods around feeders and she hated a coon but would not hunt. Treed one coon on her own about a year ago and nothing since. I got tired of feeding her and staying out till day light for nothing. Some may say I quit too soon, but I want a coon dog not a pet.

Posted by Dwils on 12-29-2011 03:02 AM:

Some dogs just do not have it. If they aren't started by 12-16 months I move on

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Posted by Cody farned on 12-29-2011 03:59 AM:

I agree with old ben

The bred plays a big part in it. I hunt walkers myself and have hunted with all breeds of all ages and it seems to me blueticks start young I mean hitting cold tracks and driving them 3/4 mile and belly rubbing treers at a young age and end up making a great hound pleasure/comp dog JMO

Posted by walker1978 on 12-29-2011 05:01 AM:

i agree 100%

quote:
Originally posted by Dwils
There is really no proof in percentages or numbers to give any solid opinion on this. "i think when its all said and done , there are people that are very good at starting dogs, and there are people that are excellent at finishing dogs. and i believe thats what it boils down to more than anything.

Posted by adlj on 12-31-2011 04:56 AM:

Anybody else

Posted by Dirtdevil on 12-31-2011 05:06 AM:

Starting before puberty shows they have alot of genetics telling them to do something ... but it don't mean they have many well rounded , top dogs behind them .

A dog that matures early ,also finishes early ... and that often times mean they are more one dimensional dogs .

A dog that starts too slow is telling me they got some cold dogs in their pedigree and the genetics will have to be compensated for with alot of training.

I prefer them to start at puberty , come on strong ... but keep learning and improving until they are mature and their adult teeth have set ... about 1 1/2 yrs old .

Posted by Kevin Self on 12-31-2011 05:09 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Dwils
There is really no proof in percentages or numbers to give any solid opinion on this. "i think when its all said and done , there are people that are very good at starting dogs, and there are people that are excellent at finishing dogs. and i believe thats what it boils down to more than anything.

exactly

Posted by Lowell Lynn on 12-31-2011 05:29 AM:

There is no formula on this.What happens on one occasion can turn out complete opposite next time around and both be off the same dam and sire.

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Posted by J-T Farms on 12-31-2011 02:22 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Lowell Lynn
There is no formula on this.What happens on one occasion can turn out complete opposite next time around and both be off the same dam and sire.

I think this is it all the way.

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Posted by Jerry West on 12-31-2011 03:01 PM:

JMO

Best dog I ever owned, grandson to Jet I, started treeing housecats, squirrels, and coon hides at 4 months old. Hunted by himself from 9 months to 16 months old. Trained easy, got better and better as he was hunted, very consistant, and very easy to correct. Matured at about 3 years old.
Have one right now, goes back to the same bloodlines. He is 12 years old now. He was much the same. Started at 4 or 5 months old. Hunted him a lot by himself. East to train and easy to correct. Made an excellent consistant hound, maturing around 2 1/2 to 3 years old.
Have had many others that made nice hounds. Most started early and were easy to train. I always look for smart dogs, that learn easy.
Seems to me the hardheaded ones, just never make the type of dogs I like.
To get a good insight into consistancy of early starting dogs, read both of Dave Deans books. Most all of the Hammers started treeing early, around 5 to 6 months old, and were easy to train.

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Posted by Lee Currens Jr. on 12-31-2011 03:27 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Dwils
Some dogs just do not have it. If they aren't started by 12-16 months I move on

that is little old for me.your getting into bigger dogs that cant get
around in the woods that start at that age.jmo

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Posted by knightrider955 on 12-31-2011 04:51 PM:

I was told that back in the old days, starting a dog before 12 monthes old was unheard of.

Posted by Cry Tough Blues on 12-31-2011 07:53 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by knightrider955
I was told that back in the old days, starting a dog before 12 monthes old was unheard of.

it more than likely still is. all these started dogs in the classifieds that are under a year are being called started cause they treed a caged coon. just read some of these so-called started dog threads, you will choke on your copenhagen.

Posted by Lee Currens Jr. on 12-31-2011 08:01 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by knightrider955
I was told that back in the old days, starting a dog before 12 monthes old was unheard of.

most of all the dogs i followed in the old days were dual ch by
17 mths.the rock dog won the ky st show and hunt at 2yrs
with over 100 dogs both nights.

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Posted by adlj on 01-01-2012 12:26 AM:

Come on guys name some names. I figure somebody knows something. I don't mean for bashing purposes, but the truth is the truth. If a dog started late and still went on to be famous it ain't a bad thing is it? He/She still made it, right? I've heard of some dogs winning major hunts at 1yr old so they must have started early. Just wondering.

Posted by Cry Tough Blues on 01-01-2012 03:31 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by adlj
some dogs winning major hunts at 1yr old so they must have started early. Just wondering.

hmmmmm interesting. and the only thing that ain't whipped that dog is a pencil

Posted by Hopkins/Lipper on 01-01-2012 04:28 PM:

HOUSE'S LIPPER...

"Thanks for your input, but can anyone name any top hounds that fit either one of these catagories?"

As someone said earlier, This post is not for bashing purposes...LOL...But, HOUSE'S LIPPER could scald a coon and bust your ear drums at the tree at 5 to6 mos. old. He was the worlds youngest Dual Grand Champion at a time when it did not come so easy as it does today. He won numerous hunts and LIPPER won the PCA National Championship with over 5,000 dogs entered as a 2 year old. I have been hooked on early starters ever since.

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Posted by adlj on 01-02-2012 07:13 AM:

Thank you Mr. Hopkins, this is exactly the type of info. I'm looking for. I believe Pac-Man won some pretty big stuff at an early age, so it would be logical to assume he started early, probably some others too. Do you know of any that were so-called late bloomers that went on to make top winning hounds?

Posted by David Gardin on 01-02-2012 11:20 AM:

PUPPYS

YOU ARE THE ONE THAT HAS THE MOST TO DO WITH THIS YOU CANT HUNT THE EARLY STARTERS SIX NIGHTS A WEEK YOU WILL BURN HIM OUT AND ALSO IF HE COMES UP SHORT AND DONT HAVE A COON YOU CANT INCOURAGE HIM TO TREE JUST BECAUSE TO TREE IF HE TREEING IN A EMPTY TREE I HAVE SEEN GUYS THAT WOULD PET A PUPPY NO MATTER WHAT HE TREED UP OR SHINE A BUSH WITH A BIG LIGHT JUST BECAUSE A PUP WAS TREEING

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