UKC Forums - Just a few points I'd like to make...

Show all 18 posts from this thread on one page

UKC Forums (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/index.php)
- UKC Coonhounds (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=4)
-- Just a few points I'd like to make... (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=301847)

Posted by anscox on 09-23-2009 08:59 PM:

Just a few points I'd like to make...

1) Just because you own a coon hound, or 10, does not make you a coon hunter.

2) Just because you have a dog with an all grand pedigree doesn't make it worth $$$$, I've never seen a pedigree perform.

3) Just because you have a dog that can stand on a bench doesn't make you a show person, or the dog a "show dog." Where's the title, show me the win slips.

4) Just because one pup is priced for $100 and another for $500 doesn't mean the $500 pup is any better.

5) Owning a hound doesn't make you an expert on hunting or showing. Show me your dog and what it can do!

6) Anyone can breed a dog and raise a litter. That doesn't mean everyone with a dog capable of breeding should do so.

7) If your selling dogs because you need to "thin down," then stop asking about other dogs for sell! Or at least be honest about why you are selling yours...

__________________
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do nothing."
__________________________
www.ansfarms.net

CH 'PR' Cox's Absolute Envy
CH 'PR' White Liar's Just A Digit
Hillbilly Bones

Gone but Not Forgotten:
CH 'PR' Cox's Sweet Mountain Magic 2005-2010

Posted by Hoo Hoo Hollow on 09-23-2009 09:39 PM:

Just got to ask is # 7 meant for anyone particular person,,,LOL!

__________________
Jamie Crigger

www.hoohoohollowredbones.net

Posted by intellectualist on 09-23-2009 10:34 PM:

Re: Just a few points I'd like to make...

quote:
Originally posted by anscox
1) Just because you own a coon hound, or 10, does not make you a coon hunter.

2) Just because you have a dog with an all grand pedigree doesn't make it worth $$$$, I've never seen a pedigree perform.

3) Just because you have a dog that can stand on a bench doesn't make you a show person, or the dog a "show dog." Where's the title, show me the win slips.

4) Just because one pup is priced for $100 and another for $500 doesn't mean the $500 pup is any better.

5) Owning a hound doesn't make you an expert on hunting or showing. Again, show me the title, where are the win slips?

6) Anyone can breed a dog and raise a litter. That doesn't mean everyone with a dog capable of breeding should do so.

7) If your selling dogs because you need to "thin down," then stop asking about other dogs for sell! Or at least be honest about why you are selling yours...

#1 Enlighten us on the definition then since you evidently know!

#2 I agree!

#3 Does not matter whether they are a show person or not, maybe they just enjoy it and are learning!!

#4 I agree!

#5 Just because a man's dog is not titled does not mean they know less than you!

#6 Glad to see we have a breeding monitor here!

#7 Maybe they need to thin down because they are adding other dogs! I do kind of agree with the premise though!

Posted by anscox on 09-23-2009 10:35 PM:

OH Criggers!

It's just been one of those days..

Posted by anscox on 09-23-2009 10:53 PM:

So fine, I'll bite... Intellectualist you did ask, so here you go!

1) I could own 10 fishing boats and not know a thing about fishing, or buy a plane but not know how to fly couldn't I? Simply owning a coonhound does not make you a hunter.

3) I'm not talking about an in-experienced handler or even an ugly dog here.. I'm talking about people who have never been in a show, don't have their dogs in shows, and yet give advice to others about showing a dog. Or, my personal favorite... sell litters from dogs they say are their "show stock" as dual purpose or national show level when they are not in fact "show dogs", as they have never been in a show. Before someone gives advice in something, they should at least have experience with it themselves!

5) Again... simple ownership does not qualify you to give hunting advice, or call yourself a "coon hunter." I myself am not a hunter. Blows that theory of me thinking I know more than someone else out of the water doesn't it? My husband is a hunter, I am not. Therefore I do not give hunting advice, or call myself a hunter even though 3 of these hounds are mine. Wouldn't be honest of me to do so in my opinion.

6) Can we not agree that many breed dogs simply to breed dogs with no thought or plan for their future, ability, or bloodline? I'm entitled to my opinion so here it is... I do not believe anyone should raise a litter of pups without first considering: Why do I want to breed these two dogs? Am I improving the breed by doing so, or improving my own stock at least? What will I do with the puppys I don't keep? Can I afford to properly raise this litter with food, water, shelter, and vaccinations?

7) This one can be tricky.. I completely understand "up-grading" with better stock, younger dogs, or new bloodlines. However, i often see people on here every couple of months once again "Thinning Down." I'm not talking about selling a dog here and there, or buying a new one occasionally. When you list 5 dogs for sell one month because you have to many, but on the same day buy 3 more (just an example! No one in mind here...) and then go right back and do it again a few months later... that's a dog broker folks, not simply an "up-grade."

Hope that a bit clearer.

Posted by CountryMile on 09-23-2009 10:59 PM:

Re: Just a few points I'd like to make...

[5) Owning a hound doesn't make you an expert on hunting or showing. Again, show me the title, where are the win slips?

Win slips a hunter is not made from! Not meant to be be mean or arguementitive just my observation. Dave

__________________
Dave & Nicki Oswald

Posted by anscox on 09-23-2009 11:07 PM:

Good Point Dave...

I know many an experienced hunter who has never entered a competition hunt. There are probably more pleasure hunters out there than comp. hunters. I'm sure many of them have forgotten more about the sport than I will ever know.

Perhaps a better way of phrasing that would have been, show me your dog! Win slips aren't important, performance is. In fact, I may go edit that now...

Posted by intellectualist on 09-24-2009 12:13 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by anscox
So fine, I'll bite... Intellectualist you did ask, so here you go!

1) I could own 10 fishing boats and not know a thing about fishing, or buy a plane but not know how to fly couldn't I? Simply owning a coonhound does not make you a hunter.

3) I'm not talking about an in-experienced handler or even an ugly dog here.. I'm talking about people who have never been in a show, don't have their dogs in shows, and yet give advice to others about showing a dog. Or, my personal favorite... sell litters from dogs they say are their "show stock" as dual purpose or national show level when they are not in fact "show dogs", as they have never been in a show. Before someone gives advice in something, they should at least have experience with it themselves!

5) Again... simple ownership does not qualify you to give hunting advice, or call yourself a "coon hunter." I myself am not a hunter. Blows that theory of me thinking I know more than someone else out of the water doesn't it? My husband is a hunter, I am not. Therefore I do not give hunting advice, or call myself a hunter even though 3 of these hounds are mine. Wouldn't be honest of me to do so in my opinion.

6) Can we not agree that many breed dogs simply to breed dogs with no thought or plan for their future, ability, or bloodline? I'm entitled to my opinion so here it is... I do not believe anyone should raise a litter of pups without first considering: Why do I want to breed these two dogs? Am I improving the breed by doing so, or improving my own stock at least? What will I do with the puppys I don't keep? Can I afford to properly raise this litter with food, water, shelter, and vaccinations?

7) This one can be tricky.. I completely understand "up-grading" with better stock, younger dogs, or new bloodlines. However, i often see people on here every couple of months once again "Thinning Down." I'm not talking about selling a dog here and there, or buying a new one occasionally. When you list 5 dogs for sell one month because you have to many, but on the same day buy 3 more (just an example! No one in mind here...) and then go right back and do it again a few months later... that's a dog broker folks, not simply an "up-grade."

Hope that a bit clearer.

#1 I agree. But since you felt it necessary to state that opinion, it seems you should state some comparisons between people claiming to be hunters and what you see they are or are not doing that goes against your perceived grain of being a "real" hunter!

#3 Well, what you are talking about here is people being liars if they claim this or that about their "show" dogs and have never had a dog in a show! So I do not know how we could even address that here. Just saying they should not do it is not going to stop them!

#5 Maybe you think your husband knows more than other people, I dont know. You are a partnership right?

#6 It is not up to me to say whether any particular person has the financial or moral means to give a litter of pups the attention they deserve. Would you like for the government to regulate that now too? What is your idea of improving the breed? If it does not fall under your guidlines are you saying they should not be allowed to breed?

#7 I did say that I agreed with the premise!

Posted by Larry Atherton on 09-24-2009 01:25 AM:

What does having biscuit eating pot lickers get me????????

__________________
Larry Atherton

Aim small miss small

Posted by HOBO on 09-24-2009 01:53 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Larry Atherton
What does having biscuit eating pot lickers get me????????

Not very many left over biscuit????

__________________
Swampmusic Kennel
Remembering Our Past......
Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch.Dohoney's Lobo
Ch.Swampmusic Lil Bit Sassy
Ch.Swampmusic Misty Shadow
Gr.Ch.Swampmusic Boone
Gr.Ch.Swampmusic Pride
But Looking To The Future...

Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch.Swampmusic Big Hoss

Dennis Robinson
Cell 540-295-3892

Posted by intellectualist on 09-24-2009 02:16 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Larry Atherton
What does having biscuit eating pot lickers get me????????

So that is where my biscuits have been going!

Posted by T.Beyer on 09-24-2009 03:20 AM:

This just in....

Water is wet
The Sky is blue
The Sun rises in the east...

__________________
Rip Acorn Creek Black Swamp Jester

In Honor of Jim Sizemore, " This ain't no benchshow!"

Posted by anscox on 09-24-2009 04:48 AM:

Heck, biscuits are probably cheaper than dog food right now.

I'd say that makes you a smart man Larry! What brand of biscuit are you feeding?

I'm not digging at owners here, regardless of what you own or what you do with it. My main point is... people shouldn't portray themselves as experts in things they have no real experience or knowledge of. The other point is that people should be responsible owners and breeders, as well as educated buyers.

Posted by anscox on 09-24-2009 04:49 AM:

T. Beyer....

Um.. I think this may be more accurate!

Water is wet.
The sky is wet.
Everything is wet.

LOL. 10.4 inches of rain in 8 days, more to come.

Posted by shakethevine on 09-24-2009 01:11 PM:

My take!

This is what I live by in regards to comment #1

I am not the hunter or claim to be a expert coon hunter. My dog is the coon hunter. I follow him/her and shoot out the game for him or her. So if my dog could talk he/she could be the subject matter expert on coon hunting.

This goes for any dogs I have ever owned, beagles, curs and hounds. They are the experts, and I just enjoy their sport with them.

Now deer or turkey hunting thats all about me and I would be more then happy to give out advice.

Thanks,
Eric

Posted by kyle m on 09-24-2009 03:12 PM:

oh yeah

you almost forgot #11 : there are not and i repeat are not as money "coon dogs" as people would like to thing. people sling that world around like everyone has got one, guys coon dogs are a dying breed, alot of dogs will tree coons , but coondogs are just not very plentiful.

Posted by Larry Atherton on 09-24-2009 04:25 PM:

Hobo,

Actually with 2 teen age boys the dogs don't get many left overs any more, but given the chance the potlickers don't turn their noses up at anything.

Anscox,

I learned a long time ago to be wary of anyone claiming to be an expert. The thing is I have known some experts, and the first thing that jumps out at you about them is they don't claim to be experts.

In the long run, I believe most here are simply posting and sharing about some of their experiences. The bad part of the internet is that a key board will let anyone type what ever they want, and I beat we can agree that is not always a good thing.

__________________
Larry Atherton

Aim small miss small

Posted by intellectualist on 09-24-2009 11:27 PM:

Re: oh yeah

quote:
Originally posted by kyle m
you almost forgot #11 : there are not and i repeat are not as money "coon dogs" as people would like to thing. people sling that world around like everyone has got one, guys coon dogs are a dying breed, alot of dogs will tree coons , but coondogs are just not very plentiful.

Well, what is your opinion of a coondog? What may be a coondog to me may not be a coondog to you and vice versa!
This matter is very subjective. You may have a dog that will tree every coon in the woods five minutes ahead of mine and never runs a lick of trash. If that same dog you have blows through the country and trees five miles in there before I ever see him again, or does not listen to me when I call him, well you could not give him to me and I would not classify him as a coon dog. I would classify him as a dog that can tree a coon.
Others are different. They do not want a dog that checks in and you end up having to go pull them off a tree somewhere. That may be a coondog to them.Does not make them wrong or me right, were just different.
I looked for "coonhound" in my Websters dictionary and could not find it, so i guess it is open to interpretation!

All times are GMT. The time now is 06:54 AM.

Show all 18 posts from this thread on one page