UKC Forums - Oaks judges??

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Posted by StackemUp on 07-13-2009 03:08 PM:

Oaks judges??

With Oaks being 50 some days away, UKC has to know the judges. So who are they? Is it true Wayne and Mark?

Posted by coonhoundbabe on 07-13-2009 06:13 PM:

btt

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Posted by Priscilla Hooks on 07-13-2009 08:58 PM:

Re: Oaks judges??

quote:
Originally posted by StackemUp
With Oaks being 50 some days away, UKC has to know the judges. So who are they? Is it true Wayne and Mark?

Just curious - does it matter who they are? What I mean is does it affect a handler's decision on whether to show or not based on who they are? Asking only because we are new at this. Would a person who was planning to go actually not go to the 50th Anniversary AO if they didn't like the judge?

Priscilla

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Posted by Autumn Clements on 07-13-2009 10:48 PM:

Priscilla some people might also want to know in case they are the breeder or have previously owned or have some connection like that to a dog they are showing.

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Posted by wildbill on 07-13-2009 11:10 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by moon
Dont know the judges but i hope there are many more non hunting judges this year. I know its probably not possible but i think all casts should have non hunting judges in this event. those" whopper " scores would be trimmed down tremendously.

not really,,

with a good guide

and a good close/medium hunting COONDOG

these scores can be had..

with the coon that they have in indiana...

1st .you have to have a Coondog that dont head for the next county when turned loose before it starts hunting

2nd.. a good guide to dump you on top of the coon

3rd. a handler that knows if the dog is hung on a treetop or cant get thru a fence,,ect

all of the above with some luck that the coon are moving can get you big scores...

back several years ago i droped in a large cornfield that hadn't been hunted and i saw 15 coons in 1 hr.15 minutes shot out 13 that the dogs treed ....no i didnt have time to skin them till i got home,,
ps i saw 3 more sitting up after i put the dogs away and started walking the ditchline picking up the coons i carryed out to the road when i had to go back to the next tree the dogs treed on..

that dont happen often here ,,but in indiana with a good guide,and coon moving,,very easley happening..

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Posted by wildbill on 07-13-2009 11:13 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by wildbill
not really,,

with a good guide

and a good close/medium hunting COONDOG

these scores can be had..

with the coon that they have in indiana...

1st .you have to have a Coondog that dont head for the next county when turned loose before it starts hunting

2nd.. a good guide to dump you on top of the coon

3rd. a handler that knows if the dog is hung on a treetop or cant get thru a fence,,ect

all of the above with some luck that the coon are moving can get you big scores...

back several years ago i droped in a large cornfield that hadn't been hunted and i saw 15 coons in 1 hr.15 minutes shot out 13 that the dogs treed ....no i didnt have time to skin them till i got home,,
ps i saw 3 more sitting up after i put the dogs away and started walking the ditchline picking up the coons i carryed out to the road when i had to go back to the next tree the dogs treed on..

that dont happen often here ,,but in indiana with a good guide,and coon moving,,very easley happening..

ps..what kind of score would i have had here even sucking last strike/tree on a scorecard..

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Posted by Priscilla Hooks on 07-14-2009 12:42 AM:

Steve and Autumn,

Thanks for the explaination. Since I am new I am trying to learn as much as possible. I guess the time will come when we will have a certain judge we don't want to show under. LOL!! Just never looked at it that way before. The new has not worn off yet!!! HA HA

Priscilla

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Posted by StackemUp on 07-14-2009 02:04 PM:

Also have to consider

That some judges have a particular "LOOK" that they prefer in a hound. We have just an array to pick from anymore, so you keep a running list of what judges pick, and if you have dogs that don't fit the judges profile - - - why waste the money!?!

Ms. Autumn has a great point - with so many breeders it would be nice to know in case you've bought a dog, sold a dog, the judge is the breeder, maybe you've even showed dogs for that particular judge.... then you respect the sport and DON'T enter. This will control the "politics"!!!! So we hope!

Posted by RedBones4me on 07-14-2009 02:08 PM:

I wonder if Wayne C. is going to judge

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Posted by Todd K / UKC on 07-14-2009 02:50 PM:

I believe the announcement is scheduled for August 1. Good luck everyone!

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Posted by StackemUp on 07-14-2009 04:10 PM:

MY personal opinion

quote:
Originally posted by RedBones4me
I wonder if Wayne C. is going to judge

MY personal opinion.....I don't see that it would be good for the business! Could be a case to loose some customers!! With it being the 50th anniversary... be nice to see someone that has supported the event for a long period of time! Maybe someone not so much "in the show" circle.... but has kept with the changing times and promotes both conformation judging and bench showing.

Posted by skyblu on 07-14-2009 06:02 PM:

HUH?

Hey "Stack"
I believe Wayne and/or Mark would be GREAT judges. Mark's seminars on judging are based on his many years of experience and I believe Wayne has judged at Crufts. They'd take a good, qualified look at MOVEMENT and the way the dogs gait. Would be a good education on CORRECT ANGULATION with correct drive and reach and overall balance for many coonhound exhibitors. We might see winners better suited to HUNT because of their overall structure.
I don't see how decisions coming from the head of UKC would lose customers - it could bring bench shows up to a higher standard and possbily bring in a few of the hunters to bench show competition when they see that straight-shouldered statues aren't the prefered type.

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Posted by cpeters30705 on 07-14-2009 06:14 PM:

Re: HUH?

quote:
Originally posted by skyblu
Hey "Stack"
I believe Wayne and/or Mark would be GREAT judges. Mark's seminars on judging are based on his many years of experience and I believe Wayne has judged at Crufts. They'd take a good, qualified look at MOVEMENT and the way the dogs gait. Would be a good education on CORRECT ANGULATION with correct drive and reach and overall balance for many coonhound exhibitors. We might see winners better suited to HUNT because of their overall structure.
I don't see how decisions coming from the head of UKC would lose customers - it could bring bench shows up to a higher standard and possbily bring in a few of the hunters to bench show competition when they see that straight-shouldered statues aren't the prefered type.

AMEN Sky Blu. I don't show on no bench but am personally tied of the same ole same ole winning show after show. Ready to see some judges that know how a "hunting" dog is supposed to look and act and get around. Some of these straight legged dogs I see ain't no way they can do it in the woods. And how the pres can cause lost biz I don't know. That may be the dumbest thing I ever heard.

Besides, I seen some results a while back where the judge picked a dog that the same judge used to handle. Same judge also handled other dogs for this person in the past. Then picked the "friends" dog at a big show. Tell me how that's fair.

Posted by kd11 on 07-14-2009 06:20 PM:

I would love to see wayne judge! Either way the outcome cant be worse than the judges they had last year!

Posted by Rough Northern on 07-14-2009 06:39 PM:

Cant they select 3 judges for the final round and each keep a separate card and the dog with the most votes wins, kinda like a MVP ballot for baseball? I'd rather lose with 3 different opinions than 1 persons opinion.

I guess that's why I dont get worked up over shows. I dont get into shows much but I see a lot of "politics" even at the local level.

Posted by byfaithhounds on 07-14-2009 07:03 PM:

I believe the judges will adhere to the breed standard more than ever and there will be a strong emphasis on angles and gait. I may be wrong but that is my opinion. I am very excited to see what will happen. We may see some win that don't usually win....

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Posted by StackemUp on 07-14-2009 09:05 PM:

Thought

Skyblu - at NO TIME have I said that either Wayne nor Mark were UNCAPABLE of being a highly qualified judge! I for one know that both of these men bring a very very long list of not only winning but judging from their previous handling/breeder experiences in the other organization. I've watched both men show and judge. I wish they would do MORE seminars on judging and breeding quality coonhounds. We can ALL learn from their knowledge.

My point being - business! If you are the owner/president of a registration would playing the role of "judge" favor or hurt ? We've become so cut-throat jealous among ourselves who knows what would happen with such a situation. There are several individuals that will remark that neither man actually owns or breeds coonhounds... and would follow by asking what gives either of these men the qualification to judge this historical UKC event!

Posted by Buckshot on 07-14-2009 09:23 PM:

Re: Thought

quote:
Originally posted by StackemUp

My point being - business! If you are the owner/president of a registration would playing the role of "judge" favor or hurt ? We've become so cut-throat jealous among ourselves who knows what would happen with such a situation. There are several individuals that will remark that neither man actually owns or breeds coonhounds... and would follow by asking what gives either of these men the qualification to judge this historical UKC event!

I believe it's the 2008 March issue of Dog World mag that has the article on Wayne and his dogs.........He states he owns English Coonhounds along with other breeds..........so I reckon seeing as he own coonhounds, owns the Registry, is President of the Registry, long list of achievement of judging and showing different breeds, I think he would be well qualified to be the show judge.

Perhaps some are worried he may choose a dog that is not in the "click" and not devulge in the BS political coonhound show junk.

How wonderful would that be for the 50th AO to have that happen.

I hope Wayne is the Judge of this special 50th event.

Posted by lgcoondog1 on 07-14-2009 10:36 PM:

Re: Re: Thought

quote:
Originally posted by Buckshot
I believe it's the 2008 March issue of Dog World mag that has the article on Wayne and his dogs.........He states he owns English Coonhounds along with other breeds..........so I reckon seeing as he own coonhounds, owns the Registry, is President of the Registry, long list of achievement of judging and showing different breeds, I think he would be well qualified to be the show judge.

Perhaps some are worried he may choose a dog that is not in the "click" and not devulge in the BS political coonhound show junk.

How wonderful would that be for the 50th AO to have that happen.

I hope Wayne is the Judge of this special 50th event.

I think Wayne would be a great judge. I read his article in CB and wished that I attended more shows where the judge looked beyond who was showing the dog and judged the dog to the breed standards set by the UKC rule book. As everyone who attends bench shows regulary knows this does not happen enough and people leave confused and irritated. Now I know some people do not take losing well and in any sport winning and losing are part of it, but again with any sport it must be fair. I think to most of us we hope that the judges who are picked for any show (national or local) must be held to a higher standard and expected to be professional and fair. I hope with this being Autumn Oaks 50th that we will see just that. It would be great to see a renewed interest from young to old, showmen to hunters, and all in between in this wonderful sport. Lets support UKC and have faith they will pick judges best suited for this historic year at AO.

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Posted by padfoot on 07-14-2009 11:48 PM:

Re: HUH?

quote:
Originally posted by skyblu
Hey "Stack"
I believe Wayne and/or Mark would be GREAT judges. Mark's seminars on judging are based on his many years of experience and I believe Wayne has judged at Crufts. They'd take a good, qualified look at MOVEMENT and the way the dogs gait. Would be a good education on CORRECT ANGULATION with correct drive and reach and overall balance for many coonhound exhibitors. We might see winners better suited to HUNT because of their overall structure.
I don't see how decisions coming from the head of UKC would lose customers - it could bring bench shows up to a higher standard and possbily bring in a few of the hunters to bench show competition when they see that straight-shouldered statues aren't the prefered type.

I agree skyblu, I think it will be beneficial for Wayne & Mark to judge. They are both well qualified judges. I can't say it any better!

quote: orginially posted by stackemup "There are several individuals that will remark that neither man actually owns or breeds coonhounds... and would follow by asking what gives either of these men the qualification to judge this historical UKC event!"

What does owning a coonhound have to do with knowledge (of correct angulation, movement, balance, gait, reach & drive) & ability to determine the best specimin presented to them? How many times have we seen or heard about judges that own coonhounds that are not qualtified & or knowlegable to judge? Owning a coonhound is not a pre-requisit to judging them.

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Posted by Wmagicwebb on 07-15-2009 03:07 AM:

just cant make everyone happy ,one thing for sure there will be a winner

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Posted by Dale Young on 07-15-2009 04:32 AM:

Re: after attending.....

quote:
Originally posted by lauraroeder
32 of the 50 autumn oaks, and showing and winning and losing....makes no difference on who the judge is. some folks are happy. some are pissed. some are dsappointed. some are glad. point being...forget about the judges and the other bull that goes at any event and or level....say hi to friends. go out to dinner. have fun and let the wins fall where they will. because there is always next year....

There you go , that's the way it is and I suspect will always be regardless of who judges.
If you go looking for something bad you'll likely find it or THINK you did which is even worse. Throw your hat in the ring and go for it but expect the best in the country to be there after the same win and know the odds are against you . Those odds are what make the wins special and memorable. Besides the trophy 's gathering dust before you get out of the ring with it, just enjoy being there and being a part of it while we still can.

Posted by Junior L on 07-15-2009 03:39 PM:

I agree with Dale and Laura, if you are going to Oaks and going to particpate why does it matter. You are paying your money to get one mans opinion of your dogs, and that is what you will get.
If you are looking for an excuse not show or hunt then stay home.
Don't come just looking for an excuse to complain about something and then start rumors.

I have payed as much in entries at A.O. shows as anyone and , last year is the first year I haven't hunted because of my shoulder. I have won as big a percentage of the classes I have been in as anyone. I have lost as much as anyone also. I have disagreed with the judges a few times but most of the time we need to remember everone likes a different type hound and if that is what they, think they are right.
Who ever U.K.C. gets for judges if you don't want to know what they think of you dogs, DON'T SHOW!!
If all is healthy at the Lasseter house we will see you there and we will particapate.
SEE YOU ALL THERE!

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Posted by dual walkers on 07-15-2009 06:03 PM:

judges

hey ever judge likes somewhat a differant dog , if you have a good one enjoy it take your wins and be a good sportsman when you loose . iits all in fun . we just like to know whos judgeing so we can get our dogs in the shape the judge likes for some judges like a heavier dog and some like a slim dog .. hope to see ever one there and yes im going to enjoy it if i show it will probley be a new prospect for my little girl is due in heat last of aug...lets all just go and enjoy the fellowship, with friends for life is very short .

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Posted by Junior L on 07-15-2009 06:59 PM:

Thats Right,
I agree Steve, it is the most fun you can have at a hunt or show.
Joan and I like to be there with friends that we enjoy being around. I have got many friends oround the coonhound world and we are pround of them all.
We have traded winning and losing and had a good time for many years, and we hope the Lord blesses us with many more.
We look forward to seeing all of you and having a blessed weekend at A.O.
Say a prayer for us please joan is going in for some surgery a week from today and be out of comission for six weeks. We hope she is able to travel by then.
My Grandpa told when I was a kid,
A FRIEND IS LIKE A DIAMOND THEY ARE WORTH KEEPING, IF THEIR STILL IN THE ROUGH JUST POLISH THEM!

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