UKC Forums - Drifting&Tunging tacks

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Posted by Ray&Luie on 06-03-2009 05:10 PM:

Drifting&Tunging tracks

Loud is ok, but often is Good too, i know some like there hounds to get deep, get treed and get the meat, but what about barks?
do you want your hounds to call all to come along or do you want them to say i have this , go get your own

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Posted by Cody Carroll on 06-03-2009 05:33 PM:

id rather have one deep and lonely with a coon. and not say a whole lot on the ground gettin there

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Posted by Dan Dogs on 06-03-2009 05:40 PM:

i like a well balanced hound...one that can stand on there head without falling over!!!LOL j/k i like them to drift out on a cold track just opening here and there until it gets lined out then they can open more...but they must be loud and fast..

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Posted by Justin Smith on 06-03-2009 05:53 PM:

99% of everything a hound knows about where a coon has went or is ... comes from his nose , ergo .. nose is extremely important.

Nose = Mouth , dogs with good to cold noses are gonna open ... that's how a dog tells you he smells a coon.

Silent to semi-silent dogs just don't have the nose ... you never hear of someone bragging about a semi-silent tree-er ? You'd call that a weak treedog ... same as a weak track dog is one that doesn't open much.

Posted by Larry Atherton on 06-03-2009 05:58 PM:

I want a dog that barks the second he or she smells coon. They need to open their mouth according to track. They need to be telling me what exactly is going on so I can enjoy the race. They need to have a distinctive locate so this ole dummy can call them. Then they need to stay put. 40 or 60 barks is enough for me as long as they stay. Everything above that is just plain ole gravy.

If my goal was to just kill coons, I would own a silent dog.

I coon hunt because I actually believe it to be a sort of romantic pursuit. Picture if you may my wife and I on one of our first 6 dates. We cut the dogs loose on a hardwood ridge over looking a winding creek bottom. We laid back on the top of the ridge and just listened to the race.

In the middle of the race, I asked her how many times do you think someone sat on this ridge listening to their hounds through the years? She said what do you mean, and I told her I would show her. I let the dogs tree a while before I told her was time to go to the dogs. On the way to the tree I showed her one of many beech trees in the bottom. There were actually dates carved into the bark going back to the early 1900's. I said see we are far from being the first people here. I wonder how many enjoyed the solitude and beauty of the night listening to their ole hounds work out a cold feeder track.

That to me is the embodiment of coon hunting.

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Posted by jculler8 on 06-03-2009 07:01 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Justin Smith

Silent to semi-silent dogs just don't have the nose ... you never hear of someone bragging about a semi-silent tree-er ? You'd call that a weak treedog ... same as a weak track dog is one that doesn't open much.

WOW! Come hunt with me sometime and I'll show you one helluva semi-silent treedog! LOL

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Posted by Ray&Luie on 06-03-2009 08:31 PM:

semi silent & silent

quote:
Originally posted by Justin Smith
[

Silent to semi-silent dogs just don't have the nose ... you never hear of someone bragging about a semi-silent tree-er ? You'd call that a weak treedog ... same as a weak track dog is one that doesn't open much. [/B]

Justin, iv seen some open every breath hounds that had nose but didnt know if it was between their legs or between their ears.
remember stupid is as stupid does

just because he dont open dosent mean he dont smell either, some dogs just ant gona expell the oxigen it takes to bark.
take a Blood hound for instance,they will trail a man over a paved parking lot but might not open a time doing it.

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Well Stanley,this looks like another fine mess you've gotten us into

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Posted by Justin Smith on 06-03-2009 09:13 PM:

Bloodhounds , beagles or foxhounds aint coonhounds ... let's take .. ummmm .. coonhounds for instance ...

How you gonna prove how old a track a silent dog is running ? How you gonna tell if he's in front or behind an open trailing dog ... how do you know he aint just riding the coat tail of another dog and scooping up first tree ?

Coonhounds open when they smell scent strong enough to excite them ... when they aren't opening then they aren't smelling . If they could be scenting coon and silent ... then at least now and then you'd get a silent tree dog .

It's impossible to have a silent track dog but never a silent tree dog IF ... those silent dogs are smelling coon on the ground like they do on the tree.

... even "silent" dogs bark .. when the track gets hot enough to excite them .

Posted by Ray&Luie on 06-03-2009 09:22 PM:

silent

quote:
Originally posted by Justin Smith
Bloodhounds , beagles or foxhounds aint coonhounds ... let's take .. ummmm .. coonhounds for instance ...

How you gonna prove how old a track a silent dog is running ? How you gonna tell if he's in front or behind an open trailing dog ... how do you know he aint just riding the coat tail of another dog and scooping up first tree ?

Coonhounds open when they smell scent strong enough to excite them ... when they aren't opening then they aren't smelling . If they could be scenting coon and silent ... then at least now and then you'd get a silent tree dog .

It's impossible to have a silent track dog but never a silent tree dog IF ... those silent dogs are smelling coon on the ground like they do on the tree.

... even "silent" dogs bark .. when the track gets hot enough to excite them .

There all just Dogs Justin and after fooling with hounds of all kinds for the last 35 or 40 years iv come to understand just as sure as you start saying what they will or wont do you will find out that they like to make you out a liar more than anything.
remember there all just dogs

Hey and besides that they know when there on posted land too lol

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Well Stanley,this looks like another fine mess you've gotten us into

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Posted by Cody Carroll on 06-03-2009 09:34 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Justin Smith
Silent to semi-silent dogs just don't have the nose

i definately dont agree with that. im huntin a dog for a man right now that is really tight on the ground but have seen him work out cold tracks and tree coons other dogs cant smell. that theory is rediculous

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Posted by Justin Smith on 06-03-2009 10:16 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Cody Carroll
i definately dont agree with that. im huntin a dog for a man right now that is really tight on the ground but have seen him work out cold tracks and tree coons other dogs cant smell. that theory is rediculous

You can see cold tracks ? When a dog is sniffing the ground you now it's a coon track and how old it is ?

.. and .... you've got a dog that doesn't open but opens on the tree and trees coon ..... and you wanna argue that he's cold nosed because there are other dogs there that don't open or tree that same coon at all ?

You are comparing silent but trees ... to silent and doesn't tree ? Are you sure that your scenario is what you were going for ?

I've never , ever seen a dog that proved they were cold nosed , extra good track dogs that could tree coon and weren't junky .... that didn't open and open plenty .

I've never heard anyone that had alot of the right kind of experience with hounds voice a different opinion either .

But .. now I have heard someone say that I'm supposed to be impressed with a silent dog that put it on other dogs that couldn't even run and tree a coon .. so , I did learn something new .

Posted by Morgan Richard on 06-03-2009 10:20 PM:

my gyp ,is wide open ,catch me if you can

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Posted by jculler8 on 06-03-2009 10:29 PM:

Justin you are missing the point that A LOT of these semi-silent or silent dogs are not barking on track because they are SMART!

These dogs understand that the more they bark, the faster the coon runs when they are behind him!

They know that if they are tight on the ground, they are tracking to CATCH on the ground!

I can show HARD EVIDENCE of a dog that trails over a 1/2 mile and falls treed with the meat on my Garmin every night I take her out.

I can show you when she's trailing and when she's just running to find a track. The evidence is on the screen!

Now I'd like you to come and see that so you will understand what everyone is talking about with a tight nosed dog.

You CANNOT sit there and say the dog is not cold nosed just because it is or is not opening on the track.

Statements like you've made above makes the dogs look smarter than some of their handlers.

Posted by MikeO on 06-03-2009 11:51 PM:

i gotta agree with culler i got one that don't open much so he can avoid hitch hikers. some dogs are much smarter than you give them credit for. i don't think its got anything to do with their nose.

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Posted by Justin Smith on 06-04-2009 12:01 AM:

How can a dog be trailing AND just fall treed ?

How does a Garmin know the dog is trailing , and not winding or just running around ?

Posted by tycon on 06-04-2009 12:40 AM:

I hunt mountain lion and comp coon hunt I use the same dogs for both. From what I have seen semi silent doesn't mean hot nosed. I have watched semi silent dogs work an old lion track other dogs couldn't, and yes I can see the tracks and know how old they are. The semi silent dog I'm talking about is that way on most every track. He just bawls every so often, not after sticking his nose in the track. Does this on hot or cold tracks.

Posted by Cody Carroll on 06-04-2009 01:04 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Justin Smith
You can see cold tracks ? When a dog is sniffing the ground you now it's a coon track and how old it is ?

.. and .... you've got a dog that doesn't open but opens on the tree and trees coon ..... and you wanna argue that he's cold nosed because there are other dogs there that don't open or tree that same coon at all ?

You are comparing silent but trees ... to silent and doesn't tree ? Are you sure that your scenario is what you were going for ?

I've never , ever seen a dog that proved they were cold nosed , extra good track dogs that could tree coon and weren't junky .... that didn't open and open plenty .

I've never heard anyone that had alot of the right kind of experience with hounds voice a different opinion either .

But .. now I have heard someone say that I'm supposed to be impressed with a silent dog that put it on other dogs that couldn't even run and tree a coon .. so , I did learn something new .

no... what im sayin is that when im huntin a dog and they strike a track..... i can usually tell you what kind of track they are runnin whether it be a hot track or a cold one. if you go to the woods and listen to your dog you will be able to as well. mine aren't silent, but they dont say much on the ground. thats the type of dog i like and how much mouth they use on track has nothing to do with being hot nosed

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Posted by jackbob42 on 06-04-2009 01:19 AM:

I like a dog that strikes right off , and then opens accordingly.

I do know of a dog that will rig a bad track and you can watch him leave out on a track. Not saying a word till he's less than 50 yards from the tree.
How do I know this? Because I've hunted him enough. With other dogs and alone. It's amazing what you can learn if you spend enough time in the woods. LOL

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Posted by jculler8 on 06-04-2009 07:05 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Justin Smith
How can a dog be trailing AND just fall treed ?

How does a Garmin know the dog is trailing , and not winding or just running around ?

When you hunt a dog over 300 nights in a year, you know every move they make whether their mouth is open or closed!

I can tell you what my dog is doing just by hearing the tag on her collar jingle and that's no lie.

Posted by Justin Smith on 06-04-2009 11:12 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by jculler8
When you hunt a dog over 300 nights in a year, you know every move they make whether their mouth is open or closed!

I can tell you what my dog is doing just by hearing the tag on her collar jingle and that's no lie.

Then why'd you waiste your money on a Garmin and why bother watching the video game screen to see what she's doing ?

Your cur breeds known for warmer noses are silent , all your yard dog breeds that don't have trailing ability but might get after some varmints are silent ....

.. YOu ever hear of a silent rig dog that is cold nosed , just doesn't actually bark off the rig .. his owner can just ' tell" he's smelling an old track ?

Coondogs bark when they smell something that is strong enough to excite them or strong enough that they think they have found where the coon went .... that's just how it is and silent dogs are hot nosed .

There might be one out of a thousand that are the exception .. but that has nothing to do with anything ..... because those exception are just someone being silly.

Posted by jackbob42 on 06-04-2009 11:20 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Justin Smith

.. YOu ever hear of a silent rig dog that is cold nosed , just doesn't actually bark off the rig .. his owner can just ' tell" he's smelling an old track ?

This dog does open on the rig Justin. Then won't say another word till he's almost treed.
Like I said , I've put him up there and rigged him with open dogs enough to know what he's doing. And I've rigged him enough alone to know what he's doing.
Hate to break the news to ya , but you don't know half as much as you think you do. You prove it with every thing you post ! LOL

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Posted by Doug Adams on 06-04-2009 11:57 AM:

LOL! I've heard for years silent dogs are "hot nosed" I would have to disagree! The best dogs I have owned or seen go have been mostly Semi-silent. I've seen many of hounds that were suppose to be cold nose, run all night and get blown out by the semi-silent dog. I've personally owned dogs that rarely barked on the ground and were supposedly "hot nosed" that could tree coon all winter long while the "cold nosed" bark every time my feet hit the ground dog, ran all night.

Posted by jculler8 on 06-04-2009 12:19 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Justin Smith

Coondogs bark when they smell something that is strong enough to excite them or strong enough that they think they have found where the coon went .... that's just how it is and silent dogs are hot nosed .

There might be one out of a thousand that are the exception .. but that has nothing to do with anything ..... because those exception are just someone being silly.

That statement is ABSOLUTELY WRONG! Barking is NOT the only thing dogs do when they smell a track that excites them! I cut my dog last night 3 times on the edges of fields. 2 out of the 3 times she left in a straight line for the nearest woods.

The other time she had her nose to the ground, tail wagging 100 mph, and raced back and forth from the field to the woods. Wouldn't you have to agree the dog was just a lil bit excited???

Yes she was, however, she never ever ever said a word! She worked into the woods and down the creek about a 1/4 mile. She opened with a big locate and began to tree on a tree WITH A KITTEN COON IN IT!!!

Fact is, the track was COLD! No kitten coon that small would cover that much ground in less than an hour!

I looked at the GARMIN and saw on the VIDEO screen that it would be much easier and save much more time to drive around to her and walk a PATH to her rather than crawl up a steep cliff. I saved about 20 minutes in doing so and was able to cut 1 more time while you were in bed sleeping.

Posted by Lakeland Kennel on 06-04-2009 01:05 PM:

If I were a modern day competition hunter, I would want a hot nosed, almost silent, go yonder by himself, loud mothed tree dog like so many breeders are breeding these days. But, I hunt in January with snow and ice on the ground, I want a dog with enough nose and brains to be able to work out a cold track fairly quickly, tree with a coon in the tree, not have to go into the next county to do it, and have a loud bawl mouth with a ringing chop on the tree. Folks, these kind of dogs are getting to be real scarce these days. Lots of modern competition hunters do not hunt in the winter, they don't have the dog power to get the job done. They are only out for the titles.

I don't have any problems with silent, hot nosed dogs, my Mt Curs are great at that style of treeing coon! But, I love a good, cold nosed hound that can get the job done right. They are few and far between these days

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Posted by jculler8 on 06-04-2009 02:32 PM:

Dave, you make a good point.

Justin, if I counted correctly on the Garmin... my "hot-nosed" semi-silent dog treed 55 raccoons from January 23 to March 23 on many cold and snowy nights. That's not 55 trees, that's 55 trees with a coon sitting in them!

Please please please come for a hunt. I think that would be the only way to change your opinion, or hard headedness (for a lack of a better term) on these kinds of dogs!

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