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-- Rule: All handlers must stay with Judge… (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=223073)

Rule: All handlers must stay with Judge…

A few weeks ago I had the opportunity to judge my first cast. On the first drop of the night, first dog opened and went to the right and the other three dogs opened and went left. The first dog was called treed a few minutes later and the remaining dogs continued to run their tracks off to the left. The entire cast went to the first tree to score it and found the hound 20 plus feet up the tree.

I helped the handler at the first tree for several minutes while he coaxed his dog down from the tree. During this time I could not hear my dog because the dog up the tree never missed a bark. Over my shoulder I heard one of the handlers urge another handler to step away from the tree so that they could hear their dogs. They stood 60-70 feet away while I helped recover the dog in the tree.

I could not help but think the disadvantage it placed me in because there was no way I could hear my dog while under that tree. I felt the primary thing was to help recover the first dog from the tree. Get the dog out, then bring the cast back in order and score the tree.

Before we got the dog out of the tree, the handlers hanging back from the tree a short distance treed their dogs. A few minutes later we got the dog out of the tree, everyone back under the tree and then scored the tree. After we left the first tree I could finally hear my dog and treed him in fourth position.

My question is should I have insisted that everyone remain with me under the tree or was it acceptable to let a couple guys stand back a short distance where they could continue hearing their dogs. I felt they were close enough that I knew what they were doing and could control them but was undecided as to whether I should order them under the tree with me. After all, it was only me that was disadvantaged and I was willing to accept that in order to help get that dog safely out of the tree.

After the hunt I happened to read AKC rules for the first time and they are clear on this situation. Their rule says: No handler may remain outside general area of tree in order to hear dog not at tree. PKC and UKC are a little vague on this matter. It was not an AKC hunt. What should I have done: keep everyone close to the tree (but not too close because the dog could fall on someone) or let the guys stand back a bit even if it gave them an advantage? Maybe I should have said we split the score if the dogs tree while we score the first tree?

I’m not trying to find any fault with any handler. It was my first time to judge and I would just like advice on how to handle this situation.

As it turned out on that first drop we got three separate trees. The first tree was a den. The second tree with two dogs on it was slick. And the third tree with only my dog had two coons in it.

"I felt they were close enough that I knew what they were doing and could control them...."

There you answered your own question. The rule is that the cast must stay together. If you knew what they were doing and felt they were within your control, you would have a very hard time making a case that they had left the cast.

rick

i agree with jim i think you did the right thing......sounds like you was fair to the other members of the cast by letting the step out to see if the could here there dogs.......and a good sport for helping the other man get his dog out of the tree.........good job

Another thing to think about Rick, if you couldn't hear their dogs treeing, you can't accept their tree call.

Sounds like ol' Frito got the best of em anyway

In a case like this I feel all handlers should have been trying to help getthe other dog out of the tree. Once that was done you all could have walked a short way away and if the dogs were treed you should have slpit the tree points. That would be the only way to be fair about it.


But hey since when have the hunts been about being fair??????

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Josh has it right.
Rick sounds like you had the coondog. Do you guys draw many dogs up there?

Thanks for everyone's input. I've been second guessing myself since the hunt and your comments helped greatly.

Plott, I agree, Josh makes a real good subtle point I failed to see at the time. We do draw a fair number of dogs given our location off the beaten path seems to limit numbers of course.

This weekend we are holding a UKC RQE in Gwinner, ND (SE corner of the state by SD and MN). We are expecting a good turnout and would love to have more people attend.

I think you handled it fairly but probably shot yourself in the foot, somewhat. You could have requested they help get the dog out, be right at the tree and so on.

I agree with Josh's point that you probably could tell them that they can step out to listen but they need to make sure YOU can hear their dogs treed to take their call and keep the 2 minutes from getting them. If they have to come and tell you their dogs are treeing then they will probably be all for splitting the tree points when all 3 of you get to where you can listen, properly.

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Now could the dog in the tree be considered in danger by being in the tree? Could you call timeout in this situation, to get the dog safely out of the tree?

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With 2 dogs getting treed in the distance and their handlers straining to hear them, there's no way a majority of the cast will agree to call time out.

I guess getting a dog out of a tree is part of coonhunting anyway.

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quote:

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Originally posted by jculler8
Now could the dog in the tree be considered in danger by being in the tree? Could you call timeout in this situation, to get the dog safely out of the tree?

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