UKC Forums - would you try to fix this if this was your dog?? how?

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-- would you try to fix this if this was your dog?? how? (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=220790)

Posted by smokey7 on 07-29-2008 04:01 PM:

would you try to fix this if this was your dog?? how?

Allright, I gave up on this dog and let a guy have him. He's still the same dog last i talked to the guy. The dog was a bluetick male that was 18 months old when i gave him away. Beautifull dog. Huge bawl mouth. Hunted great, ran track fantastic, and would tree a coon with other dogs or on his own. Trouble is, with or without other dog's he wouldn't stay on the tree more than maybe 5 or 10 minutes at the very most. He'd just take off and run another track off somewhere else. Truth is, MOST of the time he'd only stay treeing 2 or 3 minutes. Nothing but a headache all the way around. The guy that has him still has not got it fixed. Would any of you guys try and if so how???

Posted by JONAH on 07-29-2008 04:23 PM:

My suggestion........you did the right thing.

Had a Bluetick just like that once. Tried everything form running to the tree and tying him to shooting coon out that were pi$$ed off when they hit the ground... He loved to kill a coon too but he would not stick around for more than 5 minutes!!!

Posted by Brady harper on 07-29-2008 04:38 PM:

I agree you did the right thing.

No sents beeting a dead horse

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Posted by jackbob42 on 07-29-2008 07:00 PM:

What do you mean " You did the right thing"?
Pawning him off on someone else is what you'd call " the right thing "? The only thing worse would have been to pawn him off on a kid.

What I would have done was make sure the dog came to me when I called him. And then , every time he left the tree I would call him back and tell him to " get on that tree " ( or whatever ). After 2 or 3 times ( letting him know what you want ) , I'd start with the shock collar when he left.
Then , if that didn't work , I would do the " really " right thing.

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Posted by Maniac on 07-29-2008 07:13 PM:

THAT PART POUNDING HIM OF TO SOME ELSE I WOULD NOT DONE . HE STILL CAN BE FIX. YOU JUST GOT TO BE SMART ENOUGH TO KNOW HOW TO DO IT. I HAVE FIX ALOT YOUNG HOUNDS LIKE HIM. I WISH YOU WOULD OF POUNDED HIM OFF ON ME. IM NOT A BLUETICK MAN BUT IM ALSO NOT COLOR BLIND.

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Posted by Ron Brickles on 07-29-2008 07:20 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by jackbob42
What do you mean " You did the right thing"?
Pawning him off on someone else is what you'd call " the right thing "? The only thing worse would have been to pawn him off on a kid.

What I would have done was make sure the dog came to me when I called him. And then , every time he left the tree I would call him back and tell him to " get on that tree " ( or whatever ). After 2 or 3 times ( letting him know what you want ) , I'd start with the shock collar when he left.
Then , if that didn't work , I would do the " really " right thing.

IM WITH YOU ON THIS !!

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Posted by rangerman on 07-29-2008 07:24 PM:

try him on bear, some dogs would rather see something bigger in the tree and I know a few guys who picked up coon dogs like the one you mentioned and became world class bear dogs.

Posted by mjflores on 07-29-2008 08:01 PM:

The only right thing to do would have been to take him for a walk with you and your pistol, and only you and the pistol come back. Treeing is an instinct, not a learned trait. If you have to beg and teach a dog to tree...you've got a very poor dog on your hands. If you wanted to be mother teresa you could have had him fixed, sent his ukc papers back with dead written on them, and found him a pet home but...good luck doing that.

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Posted by on 07-29-2008 08:11 PM:

It's hard to shock or thump genetic's into a hound & there's a bunch of coondog's born every single day!!

Posted by JONAH on 07-29-2008 08:37 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by jackbob42
What do you mean " You did the right thing"?
Pawning him off on someone else is what you'd call " the right thing "? The only thing worse would have been to pawn him off on a kid.

What I would have done was make sure the dog came to me when I called him. And then , every time he left the tree I would call him back and tell him to " get on that tree " ( or whatever ). After 2 or 3 times ( letting him know what you want ) , I'd start with the shock collar when he left.
Then , if that didn't work , I would do the " really " right thing.

OK Bob, guess you just like shooting your gun huh? He didnt say it was a kid that he gave it to now did he? And I can tell you haven't to much experience with this type of dog either. And just because he wasn't a stay put tree dog dosent mean he couldnt be someones pet !! Good thing they dont shoot people for not doing what they are suppose to do !!!!!! Why would anyone want to shoot MANS BEST FRIEND if they werent terminally ill or mean? Coondogs in general are the most friendly and loyal dogs their are !! So I hope not everybody handles things your way !!!!!!!!!!!!!Rangermans idea was ten times better than yours IMO !

Posted by Cole Adams on 07-29-2008 09:40 PM:

Coon dogs are born, not made. You have to cull out the ones aren't.

Posted by Ron Brickles on 07-29-2008 09:56 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by JONAH
OK Bob, guess you just like shooting your gun huh? He didnt say it was a kid that he gave it to now did he? And I can tell you haven't to much experience with this type of dog either. And just because he wasn't a stay put tree dog dosent mean he couldnt be someones pet !! Good thing they dont shoot people for not doing what they are suppose to do !!!!!! Why would anyone want to shoot MANS BEST FRIEND if they werent terminally ill or mean? Coondogs in general are the most friendly and loyal dogs their are !! So I hope not everybody handles things your way !!!!!!!!!!!!!Rangermans idea was ten times better than yours IMO !

YOU HAVE TO CULL IF YOU WANT TO BETTER THE BREEDS!!!! GO TO THE ANIMAL SHELTERS SOME TIME YOU WILL SEE MORE PEOPLE SHOULD DO A LITTLE MORE CULLING!!!IF THERE WERE MORE CULLING , THERE WOULD BE A WHOLE LOT LESS POST CRYING THEY WERE SOLD A CHITEATER!!!! JMO

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Posted by JONAH on 07-29-2008 10:27 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Ron Brickles
YOU HAVE TO CULL IF YOU WANT TO BETTER THE BREEDS!!!! GO TO THE ANIMAL SHELTERS SOME TIME YOU WILL SEE MORE PEOPLE SHOULD DO A LITTLE MORE CULLING!!!IF THERE WERE MORE CULLING , THERE WOULD BE A WHOLE LOT LESS POST CRYING THEY WERE SOLD A CHITEATER!!!! JMO

I agree Ron, for breeding purposes you are correct. And some people pay big bucks for chiteaters but whose fault is that the buyer or the seller? If all dogs were good ones then there would be alot of guys that wouldnt be hunting! I dont like it when I buy one! (a chiteater that is) LOL

Posted by jackbob42 on 07-29-2008 10:41 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by JONAH
OK Bob, guess you just like shooting your gun huh? He didnt say it was a kid that he gave it to now did he? And I can tell you haven't to much experience with this type of dog either. And just because he wasn't a stay put tree dog dosent mean he couldnt be someones pet !! Good thing they dont shoot people for not doing what they are suppose to do !!!!!! Why would anyone want to shoot MANS BEST FRIEND if they werent terminally ill or mean? Coondogs in general are the most friendly and loyal dogs their are !! So I hope not everybody handles things your way !!!!!!!!!!!!!Rangermans idea was ten times better than yours IMO !

1. - Nope , don't like shooting my gun. But , after seeing how the " give away " dogs usually wind up , it's alot quicker and easier on the dog.
2. - I never said he gave it to a kid either. Re-read my post.
3. - " Good thing they dont shoot people for not doing what they are suppose to do !!!!!! ". Well , that's just a matter of opinion. LOL
4. - I don't know about the " most friendly and loyal " part either. Most of the coondogs ( not culls ) I've seen weren't to awful particular about who took them hunting. All they cared about was that they got to go hunting !

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Posted by wv blue hunter on 07-29-2008 10:50 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Two toes
It's hard to shock or thump genetic's into a hound & there's a bunch of coondog's born every single day!!

Aint that the truth! It's easier to get the genetic's to come out of a real coon dog, than it is to try & put them in one that's not.

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Posted by JONAH on 07-29-2008 11:57 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by jackbob42
1. - Nope , don't like shooting my gun. But , after seeing how the " give away " dogs usually wind up , it's alot quicker and easier on the dog.
2. - I never said he gave it to a kid either. Re-read my post.
3. - " Good thing they dont shoot people for not doing what they are suppose to do !!!!!! ". Well , that's just a matter of opinion. LOL
4. - I don't know about the " most friendly and loyal " part either. Most of the coondogs ( not culls ) I've seen weren't to awful particular about who took them hunting. All they cared about was that they got to go hunting !

1. Sorry Bob, for misunderstanding your shooting habits.
2. Sorry again, I don't like the idea of giving a youth a dog that has problems an adults cant fix. You brought up the kid thing.
3. Ditto,.... but that gun thing again..LOL
4. One example and I am sure there are others. I hunted with a dog one time the owner raised from a pup that flat bushed a coon and was a good stay put tree dog. Saw the dog go many times. Other people saw the dog go also and said the same thing.
Guy decided to sell the dog so I took him on a weeks trial. First night I took him out didnt even strike a coon. Didnt think to much of that so....Second night struck but never finished a track. 2 tracks no trees. Third night struck then treed. Tree was as bare as a babies butt. Called the guy the next morning he said he never saw him be that way before.
Guy came over the next night and the dog struck and treed 3 times and had the meat. Next night took him by myself again. Dog looked like crap. Made 2 trees no coon. Guy ended up keeping the dog after a couple more people tried him with the same results I had.
Now probably if I had keep the dog he probably would have came around but my point is that he was loyal to the guy that raised him but he wasnt quite so willing to do a good job for me.

IMO, Here is the thing. If I bought the dog off the chain and had never hunted with him before and he did what he did the first three nights I hunted with him I probably would have swore the guy had sold me a piece of crap and if I did what some have said on here "I WOULD HAVE SHOT HIM "....but if I gave him to somebody (not to breed or head their kennel) and told him the truth (what I saw)and he hunted him a few more nights than I did he (and I have seen it happen before) might have got the dog that I saw go with the guy that owned him said he was. Maybe not ! But he was only out his time and some dog food. I think that most everybody that coon hunts wants the same thing a COONDOG. And I think the trigger gets pulled way to fast sometimes. IMO

Sorry again Bob if I am way off base its JMO.

Posted by Jeff Eaves on 07-30-2008 12:02 AM:

smokey 7 i think you did the right thing in my book seen a lot of good fox an coyote hounds culled from coon hunters. grandmother always said every thing you do good will come back to you. i miss her . think most of the ones on here that sell pups are the ones that think ? you can't buy a good coon dog you have to make them takes a little time. my dogs get pet every day unless its storming bad but i only have 8 . four 4 coon ,4coyote an fox well one of the english's likes bob cats but i will send to bill boatmans get some break scent then if he doesn't stop he will be sold as a coon an cat dog with his papers because he has a lot of go in him started treeing with big dogs 4 months he's 15 months now but last 2 years bobcats been moving in i live on ny, pa line.try doing something nice today

Posted by GA DAWG on 07-30-2008 12:33 AM:

I know some young kids that would love to get one like that as a starter dog! If it would go tree with other dogs it would tickle them to death..They are not gonna hunt alone yet anyhow..

Posted by jackbob42 on 07-30-2008 02:10 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by JONAH

Now probably if I had keep the dog he probably would have came around but my point is that he was loyal to the guy that raised him but he wasnt quite so willing to do a good job for me.

Yup , I've seen good dogs like that too.
But your talking about a coondog , not a cull. LOL

Also , I've only bought one dog on trial and that's why I told the guy I wanted 2 weeks , not one.
The first week was for time to spend with him in the pen. The second week was for hunting him. I bought him and would take 10 more just like him if I could find them.

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Posted by tnmountaincoon on 07-30-2008 02:12 AM:

the last one i had like that is no longer with us

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Posted by GA DAWG on 07-30-2008 02:17 AM:

I read it wrong..He would not stay treed with another dog even! Hes a cull or a yard dog one.....

Posted by JONAH on 07-30-2008 02:38 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by jackbob42
But your talking about a coondog , not a cull. LOL

I'm not trying to be a pain in th a** Bob but what you are saying is that an 18 month old dog that runs a track and trees by himself but doesnt stay more than 5 minutes is a "cull" and after trying your techniques to break him and they dont work then he is sent to doggie heaven?
Maybe someone else could get him to stay using different techniques. Maybe...maybe not but to put him to sleep at 18 months old and the guy said HE is tired of messing with him and then you get him and YOU are tired of messing with him is he still considered a "cull"? And deserves that fate....

He didnt sell him he said he gave him to a guy. I just think he still could be saved maybe if the right guy got him. But he wasn't the one. And neither was I. LOL Again JMO

Posted by Moyers RocknRed on 07-30-2008 02:50 AM:

DOG LEAVING TREE

NOT THE RIGHT THING TO GIVE HIM AWAY I HAD A RED BONE FEMALE DID THE SAME THING BROKE HER FROM IT SHE IS A ALL NIGHT STAY PUT TREE DOG KNOW U HAVE TO TEACH THEM WHAT U WANT WHEN IT COMES TO THE TREE THE TRACK WILL COME NATURAL
JOHN N JUANITA MOYER

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Posted by jackbob42 on 07-30-2008 04:07 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by JONAH
I'm not trying to be a pain in th a** Bob but what you are saying is that an 18 month old dog that runs a track and trees by himself but doesnt stay more than 5 minutes is a "cull" and after trying your techniques to break him and they dont work then he is sent to doggie heaven?
Maybe someone else could get him to stay using different techniques. Maybe...maybe not but to put him to sleep at 18 months old and the guy said HE is tired of messing with him and then you get him and YOU are tired of messing with him is he still considered a "cull"? And deserves that fate....

He didnt sell him he said he gave him to a guy. I just think he still could be saved maybe if the right guy got him. But he wasn't the one. And neither was I. LOL Again JMO

It's been my experience that the only folks that would take a dog like that on are newer hunters that think they can cure everything.
Guys who have been into hounds for as many years as I have wouldn't take him because we've learned.
The biggest problem I have is when a dog ( hound or otherwise ) , becomes a dog that's not " fun " anymore. It gets stuck out on a cjain or kenneled and the only time it sees anybody is when/if it gets fed and watered and that's it. I will not sentence a dog to a life like that.

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Posted by James200 on 07-30-2008 04:10 AM:

I'm no expert by any means...however...from what you have told...he leaves tree and starts another track....i assume you hunt where there is a very good coon population.

I would stay as close to the hound as possible while he is working his track and try to not interfere with him. When he gets hooked, snap him to the tree and allow him to tree for a minimum of 15 minutes....I wouldn't over-do praising him...it could cause him to come to you when he sees the light coming..if this doesn't work....I'd not hunt him til hide season...then, I would do the same as stated but now I would let other dogs chew on the fur while he is tied back. Take the coon, place it high enough in the tree where he can't jump and get it..tie him so he cannot get his back feet off the ground...let him tree...you show approval...if this didn't fix him...I myself would give him away..castrated w/o papers or shoot him.

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