UKC Forums - Bad Luck At The Autumn Oak's

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-- Bad Luck At The Autumn Oak's (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=166679)

Posted by TONYBRAZELL on 09-05-2007 07:07 PM:

Bad Luck At The Autumn Oak's

I HAD A FRIEND GO UP TO AUTUMN OAK'S THIS PAST WEEKEND FROM SOUTH CAROLINA. HE HAD TO WITHDRAW HIS DOG FACE BARKING. HE TOLD ME THAT HE HAD 1ST AND 1ST ON THE FIRST TWO COONS. THE NEXT DROP HE HAD 1ST STRIKE AND 2ND TREE. LEADING BY OVER 2OO POINTS, THE CAST TOLD HIM HIS DOG WAS TO BE WITHDRAWN OR SCRATCHED FOR FACE BARKING. HE SAID THAT WHILE ARRIVING AT THE 3RD TREE, HIS DOG TURNED HIS HEAD BARKING A FEW TIMES AND CAME OFF THE TREE TO HIM. THEN WENT BACK UP ON THE TREE WITH NO PROBLEMS. THEY TOLD HIM TO PUT HIS DOG IN THE BOX OR GET A SCRATCH. BEING FROM OUT OF STATE AND HUNTING A YOUNG DOG(19 MONTHS OLD) HE WITHDREW HIM. THIS TREE ALSO HAD A COON IN IT. THAT WOULD HAVE GIVEN HIM 625+ WITH AROUND 45 MINS TO HUNT. THE VERY NEXT DROP THE OTHER DOGS GOT TREED RIGHT OUT THE TRUCK. TWO MALE DOG'S WERE FIGHTING LIKE NO END WHEN THE CAST GOT TO THE TREE. THEY TOO WERE PUT IN THE BOX. NEVER THE LESS, THEY DIDN'T TREE ANY MORE COONS ONCE THEY PUT MY FRIENDS DOG IN THE BOX. JUST WANTING TO NO WHAT YOU GUY'S THOUGHT MIGHT HAVE WENT ON OR IF HE SHOULD HAVE GOTTEN A WARNING.

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Posted by jda on 09-05-2007 07:12 PM:

no way should dogs be allowed to withdraw if they are fighting...scratched and wrote up..thats bottom line.

Posted by Daniel Fitzko on 09-05-2007 07:14 PM:

unlucky

Just depends on who you draw. They knew they were beat so don't sweat it because I look at it like this you will probably meet up with him some other time.

Posted by warn on 09-05-2007 07:17 PM:

It is really hard to make an informed opinion on a blanket statement but if he was face barking in my opinion should have been scratched (not given the option to withdraw) If he wasn't face barking and they were just using that to get him outta the way then i would have told them to scratch me and head back to the master of hounds and let him decide it. Chances are they were just trying to get him out of the way and it worked!

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Posted by Fox Valley on 09-05-2007 07:41 PM:

I would have went back the master of hounds, stated my case and added that there was also no interferance with all the dogs staying tree'd, at least you would have a say & chance to get to hunt out the 2 hours

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Posted by cowboyjones on 09-05-2007 08:01 PM:

FIRST OFF, THERE HAS TO BE INTERFERNCE WITH ANOTHER DOG, TWO, THERE IS NO WARNINGS, YOUR SCRATCHED FOR FIGHTING

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Posted by cowboyjones on 09-05-2007 08:05 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by cowboyjones
FIRST OFF, THERE HAS TO BE INTERFERNCE WITH ANOTHER DOG, TWO, THERE IS NO WARNINGS, YOUR SCRATCHED FOR FIGHTING

DOGS WILL BE SCRATCHED:
(a) If a dog has a total of 400 minus points, regardless of how many plus
points the dog has.
(b) Fighting or attempting to fight during the authority of the Judge. Dog’s
name, UKC number and owner’s name will be reported to UKC on Nite Hunt
report form. No handler will be allowed to scratch his dog to avoid dog from
being scratched for fighting.
When the aggressive dog is known, scratch the aggressor
only. If not known, scratch dogs involved.
(c) Attempting to fight is defined as follows: when dog(s) are
interfering with other dog(s) during the authority of the Judge
by aggressive behavior.

Posted by pogo56 on 09-05-2007 08:28 PM:

"interfering with others" i look at it this way my rights end where your face starts..... if the dog is just face barken alittle and it aint bothern the other dogs....let him hunt.....i understand rules are rules.....i was in a hunt last week.....dogs were treed....a blue dog was winnen.....we got to the last tree....the blue dog was still under the canapoy but drinking out of a little pocket in the bottom of the tree.....the guys wanted to minus the dog for not treeen.....it was 78 degrees.....dogs had ben treed 20 minuts...the rules say to minus him...what would you do??

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Posted by jda on 09-05-2007 08:32 PM:

there is no canopy of tree when it cmes to coon hunting..

Posted by cowboyjones on 09-05-2007 08:45 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by pogo56
"interfering with others" i look at it this way my rights end where your face starts..... if the dog is just face barken alittle and it aint bothern the other dogs....let him hunt.....i understand rules are rules.....i was in a hunt last week.....dogs were treed....a blue dog was winnen.....we got to the last tree....the blue dog was still under the canapoy but drinking out of a little pocket in the bottom of the tree.....the guys wanted to minus the dog for not treeen.....it was 78 degrees.....dogs had ben treed 20 minuts...the rules say to minus him...what would you do??

MINUS HIM......RULES ARE RULES.........THAT'S WHY WE HAVE THEM, YOU BEND THEM ONCE DURING THE NIGHT, YOU MIGHT AS WELL PLANE ON BENDING THEM FOR EVERYBODY ELSE, I WAS IN A HUNT A COUPLE WEEKS AGO AND WE DIDNT SEE A COON, ONE GUY ASKED IF WE WOULD GIVE HIM A COON ON THE LAST TREE, GUESS WHAT WE DIDNT!!!!IF YOU HAVE TO BEND THEM TO WIN JUST STAY AT HOME AND CRY!!!!JMO

Posted by cowboyjones on 09-05-2007 08:51 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by jda
there is no canopy of tree when it cmes to coon hunting..

ONLY WHEN ITS RAINING......LOL

Posted by jda on 09-05-2007 09:16 PM:

ONLY WHEN ITS RAINING......LOL

thats true..lol

Posted by Otis Spunkmeyer on 09-05-2007 09:22 PM:

sounds like your buddy got homered by some hoosiers

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Posted by kybluetickman on 09-05-2007 09:25 PM:

RULES ARE RULES

THATS RIGHT ,BUT SEEMS LIKE THEY ALLWAYS GET BENT AND NOTHINS EVER DONE ABOUT IT, THATS WHY MORE AND MORE PEOPLE DONT COMP. HUNT ANYMORE, AND THE NEW ONES THAT DONT KNOW MUCH ABOUT IT ,OR THE RULES DONT STAND A CHANCE, THATS WHY THEY NEVER COME BACK, IF THEY CANT WIN FAIR AND SQUARE HONESTLY ,THEY SHOULDNT EVEN BE THERE , THIS IS JMO. RULE OUT THE CHEATERS .

Posted by on 09-05-2007 09:31 PM:

"DON'T KNOW MUCH ABOUT IT OR THE RULES........."

Ignoreance has always been a key factor in failure.
Are you saying those that know nothing about the hunts or the rules should have just as good a chance as those who do? I don't think so. Name me one single sport where you can compete without knowing the rules or how the game is played and still be a winner. There are none. Quit crying and educate yourself.

Posted by englishhandler on 09-05-2007 09:37 PM:

so you saying that a dog is at the tree but not on the tree it's minused even if it has it's nose to the ground. but never barks and is 5 foot off the tree. what if that coon pee's on the ground from the limb he is and the dog smells. we all know when a dog is showing treed a lot of dogs don't stand on the tree and tree. they back off the dog was on the and drinking out of a little hole in the tree ain't no way in he l l you minus that dog. well by the rules you can't but a cast can always vote

Posted by jda on 09-05-2007 09:39 PM:

fiesty today jim

Posted by ROCK N ROLL on 09-05-2007 09:43 PM:

That dog should not have been scratched for face barking, unless the other dog was so tramatized by being barked at that he left. That would be interference. The rule states now that if your dog has got lock jaw on my dogs head and my dog is still treeing that it apparently isnt interfering with my dog so he can not be scratched. This is not my opinion but it is what is read to all of us by the master of hounds before every hunt.

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Posted by on 09-05-2007 09:48 PM:

As for that dog at the tree, was the dog SHOWING THE JUDGE A TREE???? That is the only question you need to answer. If the judge feels the dog is showing treed, score the tree. If not, minus the dog.

Posted by jda on 09-05-2007 09:48 PM:

rock and roll... is there a difference in attempting to fight and fighting...i believe so...read the rule again...attempting to fight is defined has follows..if a dog has his jaws locked tight he is fighting not attempting to...

Posted by ROCK N ROLL on 09-05-2007 09:51 PM:

your stoping the rule in mid stream. there must be aggressive behavior and interference to scratch a dog.

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Posted by jda on 09-05-2007 09:55 PM:

(a) If a dog has a total of 400 minus points, regardless of how many plus
points the dog has.
(b) Fighting or attempting to fight during the authority of the Judge. Dog’s
name, UKC number and owner’s name will be reported to UKC on Nite Hunt
report form. No handler will be allowed to scratch his dog to avoid dog from
being scratched for fighting.
When the aggressive dog is known, scratch the aggressor
only. If not known, scratch dogs involved.
(c) Attempting to fight is defined as follows: when dog(s) are
interfering with other dog(s) during the authority of the Judge
by aggressive behavior.

attempting to fight.. not actually fighting...

Posted by ROCK N ROLL on 09-05-2007 10:02 PM:

your not reading the updated part of that rule. when is the last time you have been on a ukc hunt ?

__________________
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Gr Ch Skyline BoJo
Hill’s Rock N Roll Reacher ( ALH )

Posted by kybluetickman on 09-05-2007 10:06 PM:

JIM

AND WHAT ARE YOU SAYING, CHEATING HAS ALWAYS BEEN A KEY FACTOR TO WINNING? ALL I WAS TRYING TO SAY IS THOSE THAT ARE NEW AND DONT KNOW MUCH ABOUT THE HUNTS OR RULES SHOULDNT BE TAKIN ADVANTAGE OF BECAUSE OF THERE LACK OF EXPERIENCE, AND YES THEY SHOULD HAVE JUST AS GOOD A CHANCE OF WINNING OF THOSE WHO DO, IF EVERY ONE IS HONEST,MAYBE YOU NEED TO EDUCATE YOURSELF!

Posted by jda on 09-05-2007 10:11 PM:

ok your saying there is no difference between fighting and attempting to fight...

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