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-- the 8 (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928505333)


Posted by nextcoonhunters on 06-12-2018 12:46 AM:

the 8

while looking into the other post I was looking at the eight min rule. I was in a hunt one night all dog struck two out of the three dogs treed other dog went the other way (2 mile walker style) it was the judges dog. after scoring the tree, we walked out into a field he looks at his garmin and knows the dog can't be heard. he then tells us it's his eight minutes and he has the right to walk in way he wants for eight min. I've heard a lot of people say you go back to the last place you heard the dog a listen but can't find that rule anywhere. anyone know where it is? thanks ps after walking at the pace of Richard Petty's fasts lap for six min. we could hear his dog treed about another grand deep. yeah welcome to some of my comp. huntin fun.


Posted by Richard Lambert on 06-12-2018 01:09 AM:

If a dog is trailing out of hearing, do you walk in that direction or do you stand in one spot and then put the 8 on him when you cant hear him any longer? It is the same principle. And besides, Mr Gingerich has said on several occasions that you walk in the direction that the handler wants to walk. If it was your dog, would you not want to try to get closer so that you could hear him? The 8 minute rule is in place to penalize dogs that shut up and don't open for 8 minutes. It is not for dogs that trail out of hearing and you don't hear for 8 minutes.


Posted by andycanada on 06-12-2018 01:51 AM:

!!

Itís his 8 if he wants to walk u walk he wants to listen u listen , same as it would b for u.

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Posted by nextcoonhunters on 06-12-2018 01:56 AM:

I went along and didn't argue, only because I had never read anywhere in the book to tell him he was wrong. but I've been in other cast where they said no you have to stand until the 8 is broke, and read it more than once on here.do you happen to know where I could find a couple of spots that he says go to ward them thanks


Posted by Rester on 06-12-2018 01:53 PM:

He talking about walking ya half a mile then put n the 8 on him. Which 8 should been put on were last heard him at


Posted by andycanada on 06-12-2018 10:08 PM:

!

Yes u go back to last place trailing dog was heard start the 8 then u walk or listen depending on handlers choice

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Posted by shane_atchison on 06-13-2018 02:39 AM:

The 8 is 2-3min to long. it should be the 5 or the 6..

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Posted by thomasg on 06-13-2018 05:38 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
If a dog is trailing out of hearing, do you walk in that direction or do you stand in one spot and then put the 8 on him when you cant hear him any longer? It is the same principle. And besides, Mr Gingerich has said on several occasions that you walk in the direction that the handler wants to walk. If it was your dog, would you not want to try to get closer so that you could hear him? The 8 minute rule is in place to penalize dogs that shut up and don't open for 8 minutes. It is not for dogs that trail out of hearing and you don't hear for 8 minutes.
humm if you would have been on cast 8 at the ark state hunt sat. night your might a different opinion .leash locked for 50 minutes . walking back to where a dog was last heard is a courtesy. after seeing it abused no more mr nice guy for me . just like going to a split tree 10 minutes hunting time is all that should ever be allowed before starting the 8 . if you cant hear you dog in 18 minutes time out should have been called for your dog trailing out of hearing . i can not find one rule that says i have to go anywhere and waste my hunting time before putting the dog on the 8 . i can find a rule that says to call time out for such occasions. if you want to run 50 minutes to your dog looking at your garmin it will not be on my time it will be to beat the hour i will be resting waiting for ya.lol my courtesy days are over until i see a rule making me extend it . a rule with a set time limit on how much hunting time can be allowed used before starting the 8 to prevent abuse would be nice . i have no problem with walking the 8 minutes as long as i dont feel lm being takin advantage of .


Posted by johnny reb on 06-13-2018 06:24 AM:

Sometimes it works like that you were leash locked for 50 min. One day the rest of the cast may be leash locked walking to you're dog. It's not a hard rule to follow you go back to last place dog was heard and start the time. If the handler wants to stand and listen you stand and listen if he wants to walk you walk.


Posted by Donnie Stevens on 06-13-2018 06:28 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by johnny reb
. It's not a hard rule to follow you go back to last place dog was heard and start the time.


Which rule is that ?

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Posted by Philip on 06-13-2018 11:46 AM:

I always like all these clear answers. Lol
This one is missing the , in $kc you do this. Lol


Posted by ssgied on 06-13-2018 02:51 PM:

Most everyone in the hunts nowadays has a Garmin,before the Garmin days it was correct to go to the last place you heard the dog and start the eight. Now we know which direction and how far away our dog is. Why would you want to possibly walk away from a dog just to go back to where he opened last? Listen for the dog if you don't hear him start the time. The handler has the option of telling you the direction and distance of their dog and can use the eight to walk that direction. Remember the cast should stay together and maintain a pace attainable by all handlers.


Posted by Rester on 06-13-2018 03:10 PM:

Can agree with that but start the 8. Don't walk me n the direction for half a mile or so then start it. That's situations I have ran into.


Posted by thomasg on 06-13-2018 03:46 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by johnny reb
Sometimes it works like that you were leash locked for 50 min. One day the rest of the cast may be leash locked walking to you're dog. It's not a hard rule to follow you go back to last place dog was heard and start the time. If the handler wants to stand and listen you stand and listen if he wants to walk you walk.
and some times the handler and judge are buddies and walk you 3/4 of a mile farther than where the dog was struck a before starting the 8 knowing the whole time it is treed from the garmin so the dog can be scored .lol next time a judge says we are walking anywhere before starting the 8 he is going to have to show me a rule saying it is required . if we have to walk anywhere it would mean the dog has trailed out of hearing and time out needs to be called .


Posted by Todd_Miller on 06-13-2018 03:49 PM:

If the judged looked at his Garmin and the dog was last heard any other direction from what that Garmin said at that point we would stay put!!! and then Id let him walk in that direction and scratch him for the use of a Garmin.


Posted by thomasg on 06-13-2018 04:29 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by ssgied
Most everyone in the hunts nowadays has a Garmin,before the Garmin days it was correct to go to the last place you heard the dog and start the eight. Now we know which direction and how far away our dog is. Why would you want to possibly walk away from a dog just to go back to where he opened last? Listen for the dog if you don't hear him start the time. The handler has the option of telling you the direction and distance of their dog and can use the eight to walk that direction. Remember the cast should stay together and maintain a pace attainable by all handlers.
depending on the interpretation of the garmin rules one could also say that looking at a garmin while the 8 is running would be using the garmin to determine the scoring of a dog and you are scratched . lol


Posted by ssgied on 06-13-2018 04:56 PM:

The use of a Garmin as a scoring aid has already been discussed in another thread, and using it in this situation is not considered " scoring ". Definitely not a scratch able situation!


Posted by Richard Lambert on 06-13-2018 05:07 PM:

It sounds like y'all are saying that if a dog trails out of hearing and trees a coon then you don't think that he should be scored. I dont understand this. Why should a dog be penalized because his coon travels a long way or in a different direction? Y'all want to minus him or call time out and not score his coon because you are too lazy to walk to his tree.


Posted by POTOMAC on 06-13-2018 11:01 PM:

Sounds like somebody got beat by that deep and lonely ,,


Posted by Rip on 06-14-2018 12:10 AM:

If you walk out of hearing of a dog then then UKC has officially stated you have to walk back to where you last heard the dog to start the 8.

Every effort is to be made to score the dog. If they trail over a ridge you should go to the top of the ridge to start the 8 too because you KNOW the physical barrier is the only thing keeping you from scoring the dog. By the same token if you walk down in a valley and go out of hearing of the treeing dogs on the way there you can't start the 2.

At the same time you don't walk anywhere to start the 8 if they just hush or whatever.

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Posted by nextcoonhunters on 06-14-2018 12:24 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by POTOMAC
Sounds like somebody got beat by that deep and lonely ,,
no just want to know so if I go to a hunt I know the right way be nice if instead of opinion someone could show me in black and white, when it's that way it clears up the error I'd just like to be a good judge and in accordance with the rules if I ever do judge thanks


Posted by Redneck Mafia on 06-14-2018 02:58 AM:

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Dean, I see no good reason why the cast cannot walk in the direction of that hound, given your scenario? It's his (handler's) 8 minutes and you have no other dog struck in that is being judged?_

I'm going to assume the question really surrounds Telemetry Rule #3, which states:_
At no time may an handler demand the cast walk in the direction of a hound that has not been heard opening. The judge, or majority of cast when hunting judge is used, may agree to walk in that direction.

The purpose of Rule 3# is for dogs blowing out of pocket that have not been struck in or heard, unless the majority of the cast agrees to do so._

Your situation doesn't quite fit that rule because the dog was declared struck. However, the dog hadn't been heard since he was declared struck nearby. So the argument could definitely be made that the rule should apply and it be a majority of cast decision whether or not the cast walk in that direction. Regardless, the 8 minutes comes into play and consideration should be granted to walk in that direction. UKC has stated, in the past, that the handlers whose dogs are on the clock may choose to walk during that time period. So, I'd say that applies here even though it may be waste of walking time in your situation.



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Posted by thomasg on 06-14-2018 03:49 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
If a dog is trailing out of hearing, do you walk in that direction or do you stand in one spot and then put the 8 on him when you cant hear him any longer? It is the same principle. And besides, Mr Gingerich has said on several occasions that you walk in the direction that the handler wants to walk. If it was your dog, would you not want to try to get closer so that you could hear him? The 8 minute rule is in place to penalize dogs that shut up and don't open for 8 minutes. It is not for dogs that trail out of hearing and you don't hear for 8 minutes.
the rule for dogs that trail out of hearing would be to call time out .lol why dont we just get rid of rule 7 e.? with the garmin we dont have any use for it anymore.. lol we can always find the dogs and score them with the garmin. just make a new rule at the changing meeting to where 10 minutes of hunting time must be used to find a dog on trail and call time out till ya hear him .lol


Posted by Rester on 06-14-2018 12:46 PM:

Problem being is walking the direction of hound with garmin that cast cannot hear opening or treed. Walking cast to the point to were cast can hear hound. Without the 8 minutes running. If hounds trail opposite directions and splitting diffrence to judge hounds cannot be done. Time should be called to retrieve hounds


Posted by Rester on 06-14-2018 12:46 PM:

Problem being is walking the direction of hound with garmin that cast cannot hear opening or treed. Walking cast to the point to were cast can hear hound. Without the 8 minutes running. If hounds trail opposite directions and splitting diffrence to judge hounds cannot be done. Time should be called to retrieve hounds


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