UKC Forums - Wow....would this ever change the game!

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Posted by on 09-30-2009 08:56 PM:

Wow....would this ever change the game!

Just try to imagine a rule that minuses a dog anytime it covers a closed tree. Period! Doesn't matter if the tree is plussed, minused or circled. Dog gets there after the 5 is up, MINUS STRIKE POINTS!
I'd venture a guess that such a rule would change the outcome of half the hunts ever hunted. And i can imagine that I might hate such a rule if it ever came about but I would sure like to try it and see. And then again....maybe not.

Posted by Casey_Lee on 09-30-2009 09:19 PM:

Re: Wow....would this ever change the game!

quote:
Originally posted by JiM
Just try to imagine a rule that minuses a dog anytime it covers a closed tree. Period! Doesn't matter if the tree is plussed, minused or circled. Dog gets there after the 5 is up, MINUS STRIKE POINTS!
I'd venture a guess that such a rule would change the outcome of half the hunts ever hunted. And i can imagine that I might hate such a rule if it ever came about but I would sure like to try it and see. And then again....maybe not.

There would be lots of people who said "man if she just hadn't came in to that tree" LOL!!!

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Posted by larrypoe on 09-30-2009 09:19 PM:

I kinda like the idea.

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Posted by Chris Roady on 09-30-2009 09:20 PM:

I dont think that could be done with the new option to release rule. It is hard to think that a dog, which is a pack animal by nature, would not honor a dog that is treed in a very close vacinity.

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Posted by Rough Northern on 09-30-2009 09:25 PM:

You wanna really change the game....................................

Get rid of circle tree points! +++++ or -----

Posted by Dan Dogs on 09-30-2009 09:34 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Rough Northern
You wanna really change the game....................................

Get rid of circle tree points! +++++ or -----

i like this idea better!!

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Posted by truly on 09-30-2009 09:51 PM:

DD- dont you do that for your club hunts? How has it worked?

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Posted by Maniac on 09-30-2009 10:14 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Rough Northern
You wanna really change the game....................................

Get rid of circle tree points! +++++ or -----

ALL THIS WOULD DO IS BRING THE SLING SHOT OUT MORE!!
OR THEIR IT IS DONT YOU SEE IT. YA YA YA THATS HIM!!
DONT YOU THINK ENOUGH OF THAT GETS DONE NOW???
LETS JUST LEAVE THE RULES ALONE!!

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Posted by James200 on 09-30-2009 10:33 PM:

LOL...How about after a dog is called treed...anything that covers is minus accordingly how tree is scored?

Me-too...covering solved.

Posted by wade lucking on 09-30-2009 10:34 PM:

what ever happen to trying to have the fastet dog (strike , track, and tree)in the pack(becasue that what coonhounds were bred for to be pack hounds) intead it seems like every wants the alone or bythemselfs, i guess it's easier to get a 1st tree that way. i think it's funny how people try and suggest changing the rules to fit their dogs instead of breeding for a dog that fits the rules, i guess it is easier to change ink on paper than it is to breed a good hound.

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Posted by Rough Northern on 09-30-2009 10:40 PM:

Wade

Because more often than not, your first and first dogs beat the coon to the tree.

Posted by Okie Dawg on 09-30-2009 10:40 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Maniac
ALL THIS WOULD DO IS BRING THE SLING SHOT OUT MORE!!
OR THEIR IT IS DONT YOU SEE IT. YA YA YA THATS HIM!!
DONT YOU THINK ENOUGH OF THAT GETS DONE NOW???
LETS JUST LEAVE THE RULES ALONE!!

First comp. hunt I ever went on was like that but just the opposite. There were 4 that couldn't see the possom and the dog that won that cast won the hunt and is now a nite ch. Made a heck of a first imperssion. Oh when I pointed it out I wa reminded that a spectator couldn't shine the tree.

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Posted by Randy Tallon on 09-30-2009 10:45 PM:

There would sure be a ton of dogs beat off the tree everytime they came in second while pleasure hunting. There's enough of that now. Another tool in the anti's hands..... That's good for the sport......

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Posted by GA DAWG on 09-30-2009 10:48 PM:

Re: Wow....would this ever change the game!

quote:
Originally posted by JiM
Just try to imagine a rule that minuses a dog anytime it covers a closed tree. Period! Doesn't matter if the tree is plussed, minused or circled. Dog gets there after the 5 is up, MINUS STRIKE POINTS!
I'd venture a guess that such a rule would change the outcome of half the hunts ever hunted. And i can imagine that I might hate such a rule if it ever came about but I would sure like to try it and see. And then again....maybe not.

We were just talking about this at work yesterday!!!!!! I think any dog that covers should be minused!!!!!

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Posted by otown on 09-30-2009 10:58 PM:

after all dogs made 1 tree the hunt would be over , becouse in the south you would have to walk 10 miles to score all 4 trees. this is one of the dumbest things posted on here in awhile . The dogs in the hunts are hounds , hounds hunt in packs , or at least they used to , you will spend a life time trying to completely breed that out of them .

Posted by GA DAWG on 09-30-2009 11:00 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by otown
after all dogs made 1 tree the hunt would be over , becouse in the south you would have to walk 10 miles to score all 4 trees. this is one of the dumbest things posted on here in awhile . The dogs in the hunts are hounds , hounds hunt in packs , or at least they used to , you will spend a life time trying to completely breed that out of them .

Did you not read the question? It says after the tree is closed..Crap what was the dog doing to not be there in 5 min anyhow!!!

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Posted by on 09-30-2009 11:01 PM:

I just think it would be very interesting to see how it would effect the hunts and the outcome if it was tried. But I doubt I would ever vote for such a rule without some sort of trial run. In the back of my mind I'm thinking the majority would hate it. Kinda like the talk about going back to the old way with babblers, no minute, strike on or before the 3rd right off the chain. It gets alot of paper support but I bet it would be hated in the hunts.

Some year back John Walkup tried to start a new KC and that was one of his rules. His deal never really got going so I don't know that it was ever used in the woods.

Posted by larrypoe on 09-30-2009 11:40 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by wade lucking
what ever happen to trying to have the fastet dog (strike , track, and tree)in the pack(becasue that what coonhounds were bred for to be pack hounds) intead it seems like every wants the alone or bythemselfs, i guess it's easier to get a 1st tree that way. i think it's funny how people try and suggest changing the rules to fit their dogs instead of breeding for a dog that fits the rules, i guess it is easier to change ink on paper than it is to breed a good hound.

I have to dissagree with you on a couple points. First, coondogs were not bred TO BE pack dogs. They were bred FROM pack dogs (running dogs). Packing (me too) is a fall back to those running dogs.

The first "tree" dogs were independant enough to leave the pack to tree game instead of running it all night, as well as independant enough to stay there while the others were running. They sure didnt spend all night seeing what the other dogs were up to.

From the beginning it was 1 or 2 dogs and a hunter catching fur.
The 'pack' came in with night hunts when it was decided for 4 dogs to hunt agianst each other. Not with each other AGIANST each other. Having quick strike and tree dogs came with the hunts, having dogs that had the meat was the main priority before that.

Either way the goal has always been to have the dog that trees the most coons.

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Posted by Clay Lautzenhiser on 09-30-2009 11:55 PM:

Re: Wow....would this ever change the game!

quote:
Originally posted by JiM
Just try to imagine a rule that minuses a dog anytime it covers a closed tree. Period! Doesn't matter if the tree is plussed, minused or circled. Dog gets there after the 5 is up, MINUS STRIKE POINTS!
I'd venture a guess that such a rule would change the outcome of half the hunts ever hunted. And i can imagine that I might hate such a rule if it ever came about but I would sure like to try it and see. And then again....maybe not.

I have always been and will always be for this change!

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Posted by Todd Miller on 10-01-2009 12:57 AM:

Covering ?

What is covering ?

1. Dog that trees 2nd or 3rd ?
2. Dog that leaves a track to cover cause he can''t handle his own track ?

Posted by Okie Dawg on 10-01-2009 01:31 AM:

Use to people wanted a dog to get his own track BUT if a dog opened on a track the other was to go help (not follow but help on that track) most people I think still want this kind of dog. That isn't a me to dog. That is a pack dog. He will run his own track and won't come off track or tree BUT if he doesn't have a track or tree he will go help on one that is allready being worked. After all second strike in thin coon beats no strike or out of hearing distance. Yote hunters wouldn't have a dog that won't honor another. They may have 15 dogs out there running the same yote BUT they are all working the track and they are very fast at it.

Posted by GA DAWG on 10-01-2009 01:37 AM:

I dont mind em packing but DANG if its after the 5 is up..Where in the world has it been for 5 min? It evidently was not packing if it takes em that long to get there...Its a covering me to dog that cant run a coon Jim why would you not vote for the rule? What could it hurt?

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Posted by Mike S Hoag on 10-01-2009 01:45 AM:

Re: Covering ?

quote:
Originally posted by Todd Miller
What is covering ?

1. Dog that trees 2nd or 3rd ?
2. Dog that leaves a track to cover cause he can''t handle his own track ?

EXACTLY TODD 9 TIMES OUT OF 10 ANY DOG COM INTO A CLOSED TREE LEFT HIS TRACK AND SHOULD BE MINUSED!!!!!!!!!!!!!...

Posted by Steve Gilland on 10-01-2009 02:00 AM:

I agree with that dog coming into a closed tree should be minused!!!

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Posted by john nannemann on 10-01-2009 02:10 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by wade lucking
what ever happen to trying to have the fastet dog (strike , track, and tree)in the pack(becasue that what coonhounds were bred for to be pack hounds) intead it seems like every wants the alone or bythemselfs, i guess it's easier to get a 1st tree that way. i think it's funny how people try and suggest changing the rules to fit their dogs instead of breeding for a dog that fits the rules, i guess it is easier to change ink on paper than it is to breed a good hound.

i gotta agree with this guy. i've had/ still have hounds that will split and stay put. i had one that would be by himself 80% of the time. but the best scores will come from casts that stay closer together. i like a straight up "race" myself.

i think this rule change would FAVOR a slick treeing idiot. especially with the recast rule.

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