UKC Forums - CLARIFY: In line at deadline.

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Posted by R.lee prater on 05-19-2013 03:17 PM:

CLARIFY: In line at deadline.

I have away's understood standing in line at the deadline meant just that. Not on a cell phone mile's away. If i'm wrong please let me know. THANK'S

Posted by Milner on 05-19-2013 06:31 PM:

You are correct.

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Posted by Pat Bizich on 05-19-2013 06:56 PM:

I think it has been covered in the past ,say you are running late.You can have someone at the club do a conditional entry for you .You or the dog do not necessarily have to be on the grounds at deadline.But you best be there when the casts are drawn and ready to roll or you will be scratched .

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Posted by Ricky L Hovis on 05-19-2013 07:20 PM:

2nd that Pat

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Posted by HistoryNutt on 05-19-2013 09:16 PM:

A DEADLINE IS A DEADLINE What's the difference??

quote:
Originally posted by Pat Bizich
I think it has been covered in the past ,say you are running late.You can have someone at the club do a conditional entry for you .You or the dog do not necessarily have to be on the grounds at deadline.But you best be there when the casts are drawn and ready to roll or you will be scratched .

Maybe Todd or Alan or someone from UKC can weight in on this. An entry deadline is so EVERYONE knows what time they have to be at an event to enter. I remember some times driving like a bat out of hecko to make an entry deadline.

That is WHY I try to allow more then enough time so I can get to the event before the entry closes.

It is my understanding that to enter a dog in a UKC event you either have to show the papers or the easy entry card. So can an entry be taken without seeing the Card OR Papers? I realize that with today technology that a person could send a picture from their phone but what if the person taking entries has a dumb phone instead of a smart phone?

How many minutes late does the person get to get to the clubhouse with their dog? 1 minute? 5 minutes? 10 minutes? 30 minutes?

Once you start not following the rules, that opens up all kinds of potential problems.

Also while on the subject what time does a club go by? The clubhouse clock OR cell phone time? Not a silly question. Most people have cell phones. Many use their phones any more for a watch. In theory all cell phone times should be the same or REALLY close.

But what if the clubhouse clock is 5 minutes fast? In theory they would be closing entries before the actual deadline or if it was slow closing after the deadline.

If a club closes their entries by the club house clock then the people coming don't know if that clock is going to have the right time or fast or slow time.

Not making an entry deadline line in time is the breaks of the game. Things happen sometime where that happens. Either poor planning to not allow enough time, hard time finding club house, detour or accident etc.

So if it is OKAY to take an entry on the phone because a party is running late, THEN is it okay for guys in a hunt that AREN'T going to make the hunt deadline to call in with their scores??

What's the difference??, a deadline is a deadline.

Can someone from UKC address this please??

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Posted by LIL-E on 05-19-2013 09:25 PM:

I don't know if it's the right thing to do or not but have been seeing people call in their entry and pay $5 extra when they arrive.

Posted by Cleo on 05-19-2013 10:22 PM:

We drove from SC to OH and were 10 minutes late. Missed the deadline.

Part of it.

If you can help each other out and the entry fee is PAID by deadline, what does it hurt? If you aren't there by draw out then you missed out and lost your entry fee.

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Posted by HistoryNutt on 05-19-2013 10:37 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Billy Beckham
I believe all rules should be enforced but with the way numbers are down at hunts, I think we can give a little on this.

But if you give a little what is the purpose of having a deadline? What if one club gives 5 minutes and another gives 10 minutes? By NOT following the rules OPENS up a whole lot of things happening and people's noses getting bent out of shape. If a club gives a little on this THEN why not give a little on the hunt deadline?? Numbers aren't down at the hunts or shows because of enforcing deadlines. If one rule is not enforced then why does another rule have to be?? Just seems like to me by not enforcing the rules we be asking for trouble.

MAYBE Todd or Alan can address this when they get in Monday

Posted by Jim Frederick on 05-19-2013 10:50 PM:

its called a conditional entry perfectly legal if you dont have your card or papers you can enter for an extra 5 bucks

Posted by HistoryNutt on 05-19-2013 10:53 PM:

What Is The Purpose Of A Deadline??

quote:
Originally posted by Jim Frederick
its called a conditional entry perfectly legal if you dont have your card or papers you can enter for an extra 5 bucks

But do you have to be there by entry deadline? If Not what is the purpose of a deadline?

Posted by LIL-E on 05-19-2013 10:54 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Jim Frederick
its called a conditional entry perfectly legal if you dont have your card or papers you can enter for an extra 5 bucks

Yes that is right and I have had to do it but can you call someone at the club to sign you up and pay the $5 when you arrive?

Posted by HistoryNutt on 05-19-2013 11:01 PM:

When Is A Rule Not A Rule??

Common Sense says something is not right with this. "When is a Rule Not A Rule"? If it is okay for this then say you have a 3:00 AM hunt deadline. A casts gets in at 3:05 AM. Why can't there card still be good? Especially if they call in before the deadline is up and report the scores. If it is okay to give on one rule WHY NOT on another rule??

Posted by LIL-E on 05-19-2013 11:05 PM:

Re: When Is A Rule Not A Rule??

quote:
Originally posted by HistoryNutt
Common Sense says something is not right with this. "When is a Rule Not A Rule"? If it is okay for this then say you have a 3:00 AM hunt deadline. A casts gets in at 3:05 AM. Why can't there card still be good? Especially if they call in before the deadline is up and report the scores. If it is okay to give on one rule WHY NOT on another rule??

AGREE 100%

Posted by R.lee prater on 05-19-2013 11:31 PM:

Re: When Is A Rule Not A Rule??

quote:
Originally posted by HistoryNutt
Common Sense says something is not right with this. "When is a Rule Not A Rule"? If it is okay for this then say you have a 3:00 AM hunt deadline. A casts gets in at 3:05 AM. Why can't there card still be good? Especially if they call in before the deadline is up and report the scores. If it is okay to give on one rule WHY NOT on another rule??

Is it about the money or the sport. Why hold up other handler's and hunter's just for a few more dollar's.

Posted by HOBO on 05-19-2013 11:35 PM:

IF your not in line at dead line your not hunting.

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Posted by Christy on 05-20-2013 12:27 AM:

UKC has addressed this time and time again.

You can call someone and have them enter your dog under conditional entry while u are on your way but u had better be there when the cast leaves or your scratched.

In line to me means inside the building getting ready to or sitting there filling out the entry slip at deadline.

At our club we will holler out 15 minutes to deadline! 10 minutes. 5 minutes. 4 3 2 1 and deadline.

We have had it happen where someone conditionally entered and paid for the dog and the other person was just getting off work and was only about 15 minutes away. So once the casts were drawn they agreed and called the guy and told him to meet them that there was no sense in him driving there just to leave when they were going that same direction anyways.

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Posted by Pat Bizich on 05-20-2013 12:54 AM:

Re: Re: When Is A Rule Not A Rule??

quote:
Originally posted by R.lee prater
Is it about the money or the sport. Why hold up other handler's and hunter's just for a few more dollar's.

But do you have to be there by entry deadline? If Not what is the purpose of a deadline?

Guys
1.You are not holding anyone up.
2. No one is signing up past the deadline.
3.The dog WAS signed up before the deadline AND the extra 5 bucks is paid at that time because obviously the papers are with the guy that is running late.

Posted by HOBO on 05-20-2013 01:03 AM:

The $5.00 rule does not say you can be on the way to the club and have a buddy enter your dog.

*3. CONDITIONAL ENTRIES
A Conditional Entry is one where the participant
is not in receipt of the form of entry required by the
rules to enter their dog in the event. Those include
the following:
a. Not in possession of current Easy Entry� Card
or Registration Papers.
b. Non-Updated Category Easy Entry� Card
after having been notified by UKC.
c. UKC Registration Certificate. (New owners not
yet transferred Registration Papers).
d. Previous owner�s Easy Entry� Card.
The participant may enter their dog as
Conditional with an additional fee of $5. It is the
responsibility of the owner and/or handler that the
information given and recorded on the Event Report
is accurate. Otherwise, UKC may not award
Championship points or wins for that specific entry,
should they place in the event.
The Entry Taker will accept the entry and the
additional $5 fee. They will make record of such on
the Event Report and mail them to UKC with all other
Event Fees.

Nowhere in there does it say you can enter someones dog just because they are running late.

Posted by HistoryNutt on 05-20-2013 01:11 AM:

When Is A Deadline NOT A Deadline??

quote:
Originally posted by Pat Bizich
But do you have to be there by entry deadline? If Not what is the purpose of a deadline?

Guys
1.You are not holding anyone up.
2. No one is signing up past the deadline.
3.The dog WAS signed up before the deadline AND the extra 5 bucks is paid at that time because obviously the papers are with the guy that is running late.

What about a bench show? What if the person doesn't get there until 15 or 20 minutes later or more? Is that not holding people up. If a Bench Show deadline is 6:00 PM there is no reason for that show to not get started VERY shortly after that deadline.

And again what about the nite hunt deadline is 3:00 AM, the cast is running late, calls in BEFORE the deadline to report the scores. Then pulls in at 3:05 AM, WHY can't that card be honored? After all there not really holding anyone up. They are reporting the score BEFORE the deadline. Why can't that exception be made TOO??

Posted by HistoryNutt on 05-20-2013 01:13 AM:

When Is A Rule Not A Rule??

quote:
Originally posted by HOBO
The $5.00 rule does not say you can be on the way to the club and have a buddy enter your dog.

*3. CONDITIONAL ENTRIES
A Conditional Entry is one where the participant
is not in receipt of the form of entry required by the
rules to enter their dog in the event. Those include
the following:
a. Not in possession of current Easy Entry� Card
or Registration Papers.
b. Non-Updated Category Easy Entry� Card
after having been notified by UKC.
c. UKC Registration Certificate. (New owners not
yet transferred Registration Papers).
d. Previous owner�s Easy Entry� Card.
The participant may enter their dog as
Conditional with an additional fee of $5. It is the
responsibility of the owner and/or handler that the
information given and recorded on the Event Report
is accurate. Otherwise, UKC may not award
Championship points or wins for that specific entry,
should they place in the event.
The Entry Taker will accept the entry and the
additional $5 fee. They will make record of such on
the Event Report and mail them to UKC with all other
Event Fees.

Nowhere in there does it say you can enter someones dog just because they are running late.

Posted by Pat Bizich on 05-20-2013 01:24 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by HOBO
The $5.00 rule does not say you can be on the way to the club and have a buddy enter your dog.
cNowhere in there does it say you can enter someones dog just because they are running late.

Alright then answer this ?what is the difference if say you are working and you send your buddy down to enter your dog because you won't make the deadline but you will be there before the casts leave ?
The only difference is he has your card in his pocket.

Posted by HOBO on 05-20-2013 01:30 AM:

I don't think that should be allowed aither.

Posted by GA DAWG on 05-20-2013 01:53 AM:

It is allowed though same as me calling somebody and having them sign up my dog.

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Posted by R.lee prater on 05-20-2013 02:40 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by HOBO
The $5.00 rule does not say you can be on the way to the club and have a buddy enter your dog.

*3. CONDITIONAL ENTRIES
A Conditional Entry is one where the participant
is not in receipt of the form of entry required by the
rules to enter their dog in the event. Those include
the following:
a. Not in possession of current Easy Entry� Card
or Registration Papers.
b. Non-Updated Category Easy Entry� Card
after having been notified by UKC.
c. UKC Registration Certificate. (New owners not
yet transferred Registration Papers).
d. Previous owner�s Easy Entry� Card.
The participant may enter their dog as
Conditional with an additional fee of $5. It is the
responsibility of the owner and/or handler that the
information given and recorded on the Event Report
is accurate. Otherwise, UKC may not award
Championship points or wins for that specific entry,
should they place in the event.
The Entry Taker will accept the entry and the
additional $5 fee. They will make record of such on
the Event Report and mail them to UKC with all other
Event Fees.

Nowhere in there does it say you can enter someones dog just because they are running late.

THANK'S HOBO and HISTORY NUT. I maybe old and slow and even ask dumb question's but I can read this and understand.

Posted by Paul Frederick on 05-20-2013 03:11 AM:

Go back and read the Advisor column in Coonhound Bloodlines for the last 6 months or so. I'll answer the question fully in the morning from work. I have written about it in the Advisor and Allen wrote about it before I did as well.

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