UKC Forums - Walker dog Inaccuracy????

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Posted by josh on 12-26-2005 04:31 PM:

Walker dog Inaccuracy????

quote:
Originally posted by sheepster
Heres a poll to get some folks opinions. What is the worst tracking or most inaccurate treeing line of walker dogs you have seen???????????????? Remember folks, I'm asking which line trees the hardest, or barks the loudest, or even runs the track the fastest neccessarily or is the quickest to tree. I'm just talking tree for tree and turnout for turnout the most INACCURATE bloodline overall. Thanks guys.

Posted by GOBRedbones on 12-26-2005 06:32 PM:

I say every walker dog is inaccurate. Thats just cause I like redbones. However I will say that hunt for hunt by the records, most World Nite Champions are walker dogs. And I don't think the books lie. SO obviously there is some pretty accurate TW's.

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Posted by elvis on 12-26-2005 07:24 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by GOBRedbones
I say every walker dog is inaccurate. Thats just cause I like redbones.

Posted by sheepster on 12-26-2005 07:28 PM:

hey elvis, at least the man was Honest about his feelings. I feel like 9 out of 10 walker dogs of certain particular bloodlines are inaccurate. However, I have came to learn that if you can find a walker dog that has some brains and nose then you really have something. Hopefully thats what I'm gonna get with this next puppy I'm gonna try from Joe. I got a good feeling about this one.

Posted by GOBRedbones on 12-26-2005 08:34 PM:

Thanks

Sheepster said:
at least the man was Honest about his feelings

Thank you Sheepster. I meant no harm. I really didn't say anything bad about TW's. I just gave my opinion and also gave the TW breed a praise.

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Posted by GA DAWG on 12-26-2005 10:21 PM:

Well I really dont know which one is.Also I've hunted with lots of different breeds.I've seen many inacurrate dogs in all breeds!It aint just the walker dogs!!!!!!!All of em are bred to tree nowadays!

Posted by Daisy on 12-27-2005 04:24 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by GOBRedbones
I say every walker dog is inaccurate. Thats just cause I like redbones. However I will say that hunt for hunt by the records, most World Nite Champions are walker dogs. And I don't think the books lie. SO obviously there is some pretty accurate TW's.

Ok, take your dang blinders off. Just because you like redbones, doesn't mean that all walkers are inaccurate, what does one have to do with the other?
Guess what, I have NEVER hunted with a redbone I have liked everyone I've seen has run ole red and slick trees. Does that mean there aren't any good ones? Prob not?
Ok, I like walkers, so therefore that means every other breed of dog is a slick-treeing, trash-running, boo-hooing, mealy-mouthed, track idiot. Makes about that same sense. duh.
If you wanna see an accurate walker, just come for a hunt. My female and her daddy will surely show you some coon, and my female will get them treed in a hurry for sure. You CAN have speed and accuracy.

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Posted by texhog on 12-27-2005 10:42 AM:

One of the MOST ACCURATE dogs I have ever seen is a Walker. He may miss one ever once in awhile but not often enough to even take notice. Dog is Dual Grand Ch. Lippers Stylish Rank.
If a dog dont miss every now and then, he probably isnt getting treed quick enough to suite me( I am talking young dogs under 3 years)

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Posted by chopper5 on 12-27-2005 01:15 PM:

I HAD A CLOVER BRED DOG ONCE THAT WOULD TREE ON 1 TREE WITH THE MEAT AND THE NEXT BE SLICK AS A PIN.YOU NEVER KNEW WHAT YOU WHERE GOING TO SEE WITH HIM BUT HE WASNT TO ONE EXTREME TO THE NEXT IT WAS LIKE GET ONE ,MISS ONE.HE WAS CONSISTANT IN THAT SENSE,LOL

Posted by slick slider on 12-27-2005 01:17 PM:

Years ago I handled a dog in the hunts for a guy by the name of Don Strubberg. Alot of you fellows might remember him from way back in the hunts. He has been breeding, raising and campaigning his line of dogs since way back in the 60's. One of the dogs I handled for him and finished into a dual gr. was a dog by the name of Hardwwod Drifter. This dog to this day is my measuring stick to compare other dogs to. The most accurate dog that ever laid a foot in the woods --bar none! When he treed he had the meat and it didnt matter what the other dogs were doing.Would give my left arm for him today! The most balanced,track driving ,go hunting stay put pressure tree dog I've ever hunted.

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Posted by GumSwampWalkers on 12-27-2005 02:51 PM:

Grnite Hicks Hardwood Hammer was/is deadly accurate when he starts a choppin load the gun because he's got the coon

but i dont think the inaccuracy of a breed can be blamed on one dog i think alot of it is where a trainer did not correct where correcting was needed though i still believe that 60% of it is genetics the other 40% is of trainer error wether known or not it just seems impossible to me to blame O N E dog for inaccuracy in a breed its a collection from the Gene Pool there may/probally needs to be more selective breeding in the walkers this is JMO

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Strike and Tree em thats TIMBER!
Coming Soon too a Hunt near You

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Posted by sheepster on 12-27-2005 02:56 PM:

I agree on the "selection" thing there gumswamp. I think more breeders need to understand that there is more to a dog than just how fast he chops on a tree and how loud he is and how good looking the dog is. MUCH MORE. Just my opinion.

Hey Gumswamp, by the way, found yer dogs yet????????

Posted by GumSwampWalkers on 12-27-2005 03:04 PM:

nope from what weve gathered we believe they were picked up ...the person that took my dogs better pray to god that i dont find them because their gonna be seeing the world from a diffrent point of view when their laying in the hospital

__________________
GumSwamp Kennels- Striving For Exellence

Strike and Tree em thats TIMBER!
Coming Soon too a Hunt near You

Keep Em Treed Boys

Posted by sheepster on 12-27-2005 03:06 PM:

did they have tracking collars on???? Have you recovered them??????

Posted by GumSwampWalkers on 12-27-2005 03:16 PM:

yep tracking collars on both and one had a shock collar on we cant track the collars nope we havnt even found the collars were gonna look some more today they may have drown in the river but they were heading the complete opposite direction of it they were tracking onto some plant land they were ona coon then they just went cross country i dont know if they jumped a deer or what but the've never ran a deer nor messed with a possum but they will mess with a dilla every once in awhile so i have no idea what they were doing unless they jumped a red hot coon then they ran him and shut up and i havnt been able to find them since ive rode that plant all i can and all around

__________________
GumSwamp Kennels- Striving For Exellence

Strike and Tree em thats TIMBER!
Coming Soon too a Hunt near You

Keep Em Treed Boys

Posted by Oak Ridge on 12-27-2005 04:41 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by chopper5
I HAD A CLOVER BRED DOG ONCE THAT WOULD TREE ON 1 TREE WITH THE MEAT AND THE NEXT BE SLICK AS A PIN.YOU NEVER KNEW WHAT YOU WHERE GOING TO SEE WITH HIM BUT HE WASNT TO ONE EXTREME TO THE NEXT IT WAS LIKE GET ONE ,MISS ONE.HE WAS CONSISTANT IN THAT SENSE,LOL

This right here is the problem with this type of Poll.....

What's the saying? "One bad apple doesn't spoil the whole barrell" Folks we are talking about families of dogs...lines of dogs...not individuals. How many people have hunted with 15 or 20 dogs out of each one of the "lines" listed above? I'm not talking about grand pups or great-great-great grandpups...but direct decendants? How can you really pick if you have not put in the boot leather behind the dogs?

In looking at the choices in this poll, just like the "Most Accurate" poll, I can find and name dogs at both ends of the extreme for most of these lines. I can name some "slick treeing idiots", to use Sheepster's phrase, and some tack drivers as well.

Here is the way I see it. If you take a dog that "misses" and you breed it to a dog that "misses" and you sell those pups at six weeks old to someone that really doesn't know how to deal with a young dog that "misses" but is a "nice treedog"......you have a complete recipie for dogs that miss. It doesn't matter what line they come from.....

Simple as that!

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Joe Newlin
UKC Cur Advocate
Home of Oak Ridge Kennels

Posted by josh on 12-27-2005 04:45 PM:

I couldent agree more Joe.

Its a stupid poll that proved a stupid point...

Posted by SilverRockTW on 12-27-2005 05:52 PM:

I wanted to vote for two of them, but I couldn't. I would have to go with the Yadkin Tar Rattler dogs and Rat Attack dogs. I know there are some very nice ones out there out of them, but for the most part they like to tree a little much for me. Just my opinion.

Cole Vanover

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Posted by Hiphop on 12-27-2005 05:57 PM:

Arent most of these so called lines related? Rat out of Sackett Jr., Nailor out of Rattler. Lipper in Nailor and Whitey.

Posted by Oak Ridge on 12-27-2005 06:23 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Hiphop
Arent most of these so called lines related? Rat out of Sackett Jr., Nailor out of Rattler. Lipper in Nailor and Whitey.

Your close....

Rat is Sackett Jr, Sackett Jr has it's root in Yadkin River.....Nailor has roots in Yadkin River as well.....

Whitey was a grandson to Lipper....., but I don't necessarily classify "Clover" as Stylish Clover or Whitey...but rather Lee Logan's Wild Clover dog that was Hardwood Bozo and Finley River bred with some Lone Pine thrown in for good measure!

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UKC Cur Advocate
Home of Oak Ridge Kennels

Posted by GA DAWG on 12-28-2005 03:09 AM:

I guess I'm doomed!I got pup here thats got the top 3 votes on his papers.I guess I'll just have to hunt him in the summer time.

Posted by chopper5 on 12-28-2005 01:01 PM:

THE DOG I HAD WAS A NT CH OFF CLOVER X NT CH SACKETT JR FEMALE.THE ONLY REASON I EVEN FED THE DOG IS BECAUSE HE WOULD TREE A COON.THE POLL WAS ABOUT ACCURACY AND HE WAS THE MOST INACCURATE DOG THAT I HAVE EVER OWNED.HE GOT ON MY NERVES SO I SOLD HIM.IF I CANT SEE MEAT IN THE TREE AT LEAST 80% OF THE TIME ,THEY WILL NOT MAKE IT HERE.I AM SORRY IF I HAVE OFFENDED YOU OAKRIDGE AND I DO UNDERSTAND THE FACT THAT I HAVE NOT STUDIED THE CROSSES THAT WORK WELL ON THE WHITEY DOGS AS I AM SURE THAT YOU HAVE. GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR LINES FOR YEARS TO COME.

Posted by Philip on 12-28-2005 05:14 PM:

I would get rid of a dog if it had both sacket and nailor. it might be a good pop up, corn field machine, if it has to hunt on out? Need some balance thrown in there.

Posted by Oak Ridge on 12-28-2005 06:04 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by chopper5
THE DOG I HAD WAS A NT CH OFF CLOVER X NT CH SACKETT JR FEMALE.THE ONLY REASON I EVEN FED THE DOG IS BECAUSE HE WOULD TREE A COON.THE POLL WAS ABOUT ACCURACY AND HE WAS THE MOST INACCURATE DOG THAT I HAVE EVER OWNED.HE GOT ON MY NERVES SO I SOLD HIM.IF I CANT SEE MEAT IN THE TREE AT LEAST 80% OF THE TIME ,THEY WILL NOT MAKE IT HERE.I AM SORRY IF I HAVE OFFENDED YOU OAKRIDGE AND I DO UNDERSTAND THE FACT THAT I HAVE NOT STUDIED THE CROSSES THAT WORK WELL ON THE WHITEY DOGS AS I AM SURE THAT YOU HAVE. GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR LINES FOR YEARS TO COME.

No offense taken! Let me ask you this, though Since Sackett Jr and Clover (Whitey) were standing at stud at the same time, and Sackett Jr died early, was the pups daddy Whitey, or off a Whitey bred male?

Another question, is the possibility that the pup took after the mamma's line and not the sire? That was my point. Here we have a dog that is deemed as innacurate, yet the sire gets all the "blame"..... the other poll about accuracy puts the clover line at the top of the list...

I'm not defending any line of dogs here, just don't think that this type of poll should be taken to heart by someone that has not really done the homework.....

__________________
Joe Newlin
UKC Cur Advocate
Home of Oak Ridge Kennels

Posted by Jerry Moll on 12-28-2005 06:15 PM:

I have hunted with both accurate and inaccurate hounds off every stud listed and many more that are not listed.

When evaluating stud dogs and their reproducing abilities, many times folks forget two HUGE points:
#1 Every litter has a momma, think about it
#2 The trainers of the pups sired by the stud dog in question have a huge impact on the finished product if it is ever finished at all

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