UKC Forums (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/index.php)
- UKC Coonhounds (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=4)
-- How should this be handled? (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928537696)

How should this be handled?

Scenario: 4 dog cast

All dogs are struck in, dogs A, B, and C are treed together. Tree is scored and cast moves away from tree to listen for dog D before recasting. Dog D is determined to be nearing a busy road and in potential danger so the cast decides to call time out to recover dog D. During time out, the handlers of dogs C and D both leave on foot to retrieve dog D. 75 minutes after time was called both handlers return to cast with Dog D.

Rules for reference:

6. SCRATCHING OFFENSES
Dog Related Offense:

(e) For delaying completion of cast for one hour after
time out is called during the hunt in accordance
with Rule 7.

7. TIME OUTS
Judge or majority of cast if hunting Judge is used, may
call time out in accordance with the following:

(a) When dogs are getting on highway, trail onto posted
land or trail into a place where there is danger to
dogs or hunters.

bad break for dog C but there both scratched

__________________
JACK BINGHAM
MOSQUITO CREEK REDBONES
641-750-4457

A screw up on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part.



HOME OF

GRNitech PKC Platinum CH PR Mosquito Creek Danno's Buggs 2018 American Redbone Champion. 2019 World Champion Female. 2020 PURINA NATIONALS CH.

GRNITE CH Mosquito Creek Hank 2020 and 2022 top 100

Platinum CH GRNITE CH Jersey Girl 2020 Top 100



R.I.P.
GRNitech PKC CH GRCH Awesome Mosquito Crk. Lick 2016 World Champion Redbone Female


Look us up on Facebook: Mosquito Creek Redbones

When time out is called, a meeting place needs to be set. Most generally is where the cast started at. If three cast members are together , they are not delaying the cast. At the end of one hour anyone not at meeting place is scratched for delay of cast.

__________________
Get deep or Get Beat!

Originally posted by Sonny Phipps

"When time out is called, a meeting place needs to be set. Most generally is where the cast started at. If three cast members are together , they are not delaying the cast. At the end of one hour anyone not at meeting place is scratched for delay of cast."

Clarification:

2 cast members, 3 spectators, 4 trucks, and 3 dogs were present at the agreed upon meeting place. 2 handlers and 1 dog were not present after the hour was up.

As Jack said, bad break for C but he is scratched. Handler of C should have left D and gone back to meeting place so that he would not get scratched. Getting scratched is actually his fault for not doing so.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tillery
Originally posted by Sonny Phipps

"When time out is called, a meeting place needs to be set. Most generally is where the cast started at. If three cast members are together , they are not delaying the cast. At the end of one hour anyone not at meeting place is scratched for delay of cast."

Clarification:

2 cast members, 3 spectators, 4 trucks, and 3 dogs were present at the agreed upon meeting place. 2 handlers and 1 dog were not present after the hour was up.

---

__________________
Get deep or Get Beat!

Official Ruling

Master of hounds made the decision that ONLY dog D was scratched. Dog C was allowed to continue hunting.

I understand the rules but I tip my hat to handler C for being a sportsman and showing the compassion to help a fellow Hunter, that's what's it's really all about, the friends we make and people we meet!
Congratulations handler C you are the real winner.

__________________
home of
BLUE GHOST MEMPHIS
BLUE GHOST WHITE TRASH
BLUE GHOST HAUNTED SKY

Master of hounds made the wrong call

__________________
If You Don't Have A Tree Dog Then You Ain't Got $hit

Master of Hounds may have made the wrong ruling but he got it right when it comes to sportsmanship.

__________________
John Smith
Ohio Valley Bluetick Kennel

If one of the spectators was a back up handler for dog c he was good to go at the end of the hour because dog c was there.

__________________
Grnite.ch.Grch.Hicks Rusty .GRNITECH.GRCH.SIMPSONS COON CRAZY COOTER .GRNITECH(2)GRCH.SIMPSONS COON CRAZY DAZY. .NITECH.GRCH.SIMPSONS COON CRAZY JUNEBUG GR.NITECH.GRCH.SIMPSONS RUSTY RED CUDA . GRNITECH.PKC CH. CHKC CH. TANK. CH.GRNITECH.MYATT CREEK LUCY.CH.GRFDCH.GRNITECH.WADES TREE TIGHT TINA.CH.NITECH.RUSTY RED RUTH

Sportsmanship

All cast members had been actively trying to help retrieve dog D. The dog hadn't got treed and was trailing/running back and forth of about a half mile section of woods. No one just sat at the truck and let the time tick. I understand what some are saying about sportsmanship, and tend to agree but does that mean it's ok to bend/ignore/break clearly written rules as long as we are being sportsman-like? If so, which rules are optional and which ones are not?

quote:

---

Originally posted by okreddog56
If one of the spectators was a back up handler for dog c he was good to go at the end of the hour because dog c was there.

---

Hunt

Bad break for handler trying to help the real issue is with handler of dog not handled he lacked sportsmanship he should have withdrawn and let the other dogs finsh the cast the rule is clear and this is why ukc has problems arise in hunts because master of hounds make wrong decisions

Dogs

If my dog is acting like an idiot and can't be handled I'm withdrawing and letting the others finish the cast

Re: Dogs

quote:

---

Originally posted by wart
If my dog is acting like an idiot and can't be handled I'm withdrawing and letting the others finish the cast

---

It isn't very sportsmanlike to expect or ask another handler or handlers to risk getting scratched themselves just because you can't handle your dog.

Was the handler of Dog C a novice to coon hunting or an older guy? Was there a reason that the other handler went back to assist the handler of Dog C catch his dog?

__________________
John Smith
Ohio Valley Bluetick Kennel

..

just curious did dog c go on to win the cast?

Additional Information

quote:

---

Originally posted by ov_blues
Was the handler of Dog C a novice to coon hunting or an older guy? Was there a reason that the other handler went back to assist the handler of Dog C catch his dog?

---

Re: ..

quote:

---

Originally posted by larry geesling
just curious did dog c go on to win the cast?

---

Let me get this straight at the 45 minute mark all dogs was present with handlers except dog D. Handler C walks in with Handler D to catch his dog and returns 30 minutes later. I not sure I would not side with the master of hounds on this call. Technically handler C delayed the cast 30 mins

__________________
CoalDust Kennels
Pound VA
Anthony Sturgill & Family
Home of:

CH NT CH Sturgill's White River Bell(4 CH Wins, 2nd Runner-up JR Young Guns 2014 BBOA Bluetickdays
CH GR NT CH Coaldust's Boomin Blue Ug (10th 2014 Reunion RQE, 2nd Saturday Night 2014 Reunion(6th Saturday Night 2015 BBOA Bluetickdays)
NT CH Coaldust's Shinnin Blue Jax
NT CH Sturgill’s White River Lucy II
NT CH Coaldust’s Boomin Blue Zeus
RIP
UKC/AKC CH NT CH Coaldust's Raisen Kane
NT CH Sturgill's White River Clyde 2010 BBOA Young Guns SR Winner
NT CH Sturgill's White River Cindy
UKC/AKC NT CH Coaldust's MC Blue Bonnie

Dogs C and D should have both been scratched. If the MOH is going to ignore the written rules and let dog C finish the hunt, he may as well let dog D hunt too. If I am wanting to win the cast with 15 minutes left to retrieve a dog, I am personally not leaving the cast to help anyone and jeopardizing my own eligibility to continue. If we had a whole hour to retrieve the dog I would gladly help anyone, friend or not.

__________________
Wayne Musgrave

Home of:
A couple old plugs

quote:

---

Originally posted by CoalDust
Let me get this straight at the 45 minute mark all dogs was present with handlers except dog D. Handler C walks in with Handler D to catch his dog and returns 30 minutes later. I not sure I would not side with the master of hounds on this call. Technically handler C delayed the cast 30 mins

---

__________________
Donald Bergeron

Dog c

Didnt delay cast or handler dog D and handler did.

__________________
Ntch PR Shivers Rushcreek Shelly-Ntch Perry's Rushcreek OppyXMichells Val(passed)
Grnitech CH Wch PR Shivers Magic Buckeye-Grch Gnitech PR Dillions Smoken Blue MagicXNtch Shivers Rush Creek Shelly(passed)
ChPR Shivers Blue Belle-HoochX Shelly
Nitech Ch PR Shivers Magic Lead-MagicXHooker
Breeder and handler and half owner of Nitech Grch Grwch Grfch PR Rock Acres Brutus HTX sire MagicXShelly
Cali- Ch Wch Grnite Shivers Magic Buckeye x Dual Grand Tuff