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-- Coondogs vs Beardogs at tree. (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928340689)

Coondogs vs Beardogs at tree.

I get videos from friends all the time of dogs treeing bear. I am talking six to a dozen dogs treeing. I don't see the aggression between bear dogs like I do between some coon hounds.
1. Is it their and I am not seeing it.
2. Is it not there in the coon hounds either and I am just seeing things.
3. Is it because the dogs see that big ole bear and concentrating on him while the Coondogs is treeing on the tree and guarding it.
4. Is it the concentrated breeding of coon hounds compared to generally more cross breeding in bear hounds.
Would to love hear what some bear hunters think also.

I dunno... Dogs are dogs.

If a bear dog wakes up on the wrong side of the bed and gets grouchy treeing with 15 others.....There is going to be some big problems.

I think bear hunters are less tolerant of aggressive tree dogs, but I think that's about the only difference.

__________________
Bad decisions make good stories.

im not a expert

but i think it's in the blood line that they came from some bloodlines throw aggrisive dogs and my other thing is you can take a good temperment dog when it's young and put it in the hunt's and it get jumped on a few times and next thing you know it's picked up a bad habit then you breed that mean dog and theres gonna be a pup or 2 turn out agrgrisive jmo

I've been on a few bear hunts, and those dogs are bred for different traits than our coondogs. One of those, being out of necessity, is the desire to stay in a pack. A bear hound that is a loner, eventually finds themselves with more than they can handle on their own!

Many coon hound lines are bred for independence, and when a dog spends the majority of their life off on their own, they tend to not develop certain social skills.

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David Schmidt
219-614-0654

Im just a coonhunter but im gona takena stab at this.

I belive most succesfull big game guys run alot of the same dogs together all the time and in some cases kennel them and raise them together. Not dumping strange outside dogs into the pack. I think sleeping, eating , hunting and raising them as a pack they would have very little trouble amongst them. But bring in the stranger and the aggresion could very well come out.

On the coondog side of it I belive we are a hundred percent to blame ourselves. In this day in age in the competition coonhound world we are all breeding and training for that dead loaner independent coon dog that lays its belly on the tree and barks every breath and it cant budge an inch or we might get minused for bein off the tree. Take a cast of 4 dogs with this mentality and god forbid a couple of them happen to end up on the same tree on a hot coon and its a small tree how can we blame them when theres some ocasional aggresion issues. We bred/trained them to want to be alone and not budge for nuthin. Im guilty of it my self and due to point hunts at least in my area the dogs have changed and some negatives come with it. Around here it seems if yur dogs a few feet off the tree then yur gettn minused. So if yur gona spend the time and money to go to town yur gona have a dog that wont move at all costs. And then we ask ourselves "gee wonder why they cant get along??"

These are traits that the big game guys dont look for and in alot of cases breed or train away from. They dont care if a dog greets them 30 yards back or runs big circles around the tree barkin. As long as they did there job and held the game at bay.

Im sure some will disagree with me but this is just my opinion for what its worth

quote:

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Originally posted by LUKE SOLMES
Im just a coonhunter but im gona takena stab at this.

I belive most succesfull big game guys run alot of the same dogs together all the time and in some cases kennel them and raise them together. Not dumping strange outside dogs into the pack. I think sleeping, eating , hunting and raising them as a pack they would have very little trouble amongst them. But bring in the stranger and the aggresion could very well come out.

On the coondog side of it I belive we are a hundred percent to blame ourselves. In this day in age in the competition coonhound world we are all breeding and training for that dead loaner independent coon dog that lays its belly on the tree and barks every breath and it cant budge an inch or we might get minused for bein off the tree. Take a cast of 4 dogs with this mentality and god forbid a couple of them happen to end up on the same tree on a hot coon and its a small tree how can we blame them when theres some ocasional aggresion issues. We bred/trained them to want to be alone and not budge for nuthin. Im guilty of it my self and due to point hunts at least in my area the dogs have changed and some negatives come with it. Around here it seems if yur dogs a few feet off the tree then yur gettn minused. So if yur gona spend the time and money to go to town yur gona have a dog that wont move at all costs. And then we ask ourselves "gee wonder why they cant get along??"

These are traits that the big game guys dont look for and in alot of cases breed or train away from. They dont care if a dog greets them 30 yards back or runs big circles around the tree barkin. As long as they did there job and held the game at bay.

Im sure some will disagree with me but this is just my opinion for what its worth

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quote:

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Originally posted by deschmidt27
I've been on a few bear hunts, and those dogs are bred for different traits than our coondogs. One of those, being out of necessity, is the desire to stay in a pack. A bear hound that is a loner, eventually finds themselves with more than they can handle on their own!

Many coon hound lines are bred for independence, and when a dog spends the majority of their life off on their own, they tend to not develop certain social skills.

---

I will tell you what it is coon hunters like to hold on to dogs and thinks they will grow out of it, bear hunters load the gun take care of problem and go back to the pen and get another pup. Bear hunter bred what they hunt and keep all the pups and if its a cull to him its a cull to anyone.

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Mostly all the same breeding ain't it.. Personally I think this aggressive coonhound nowdays is a bunch of bull. I don't see it. Maybe folks up here do cull cause usually if a rough dog is around. Its been bought and brought here.

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Michael Ghorley

Having been successful in both,I can tell you its really not that difficult to figure out. Bear hunters don't make excuses for a growly one. He gets taken out of the gene pool,period. You won't ever hear a true bear hunter blame it on a tree jacker,because believe me when a bear is sitting on a limb about twelve feet off the ground your going g to have lots of tree jacking with no fights. How many times have you heard someone say old so and so can't have anybody in his side of the box. There again yard his a$$ out and let him know he doesn't get to decide who rides with him. When I was a kid I had a full size box cap dog box with a divider in it. I had an old bounty hunter admiring it. He then asked me why I had a divider in it. I thought well Thats a no brainer. He then said wouldn't you rather know you had a personality conflict here in the box where you can do something aboutit than at a tree that might take you hours to get too? WOW was all iI could think. For the person that said its about the dogs being used to each other Thats not really it as different guys will pack strange dogs in all the time. Again I really believe the main thing is that its what people will put up with.

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I know a lot of bear hunters and have been told that if you have an aggressive dog at a bear tree you will have dead dogs from the dog fight. They absoultly can not tollerate ill dogs at a tree. They loose enough dogs to the bears, no need to loose dogs because of one ill dog.

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Bill Harper
Washington, NC
252-944-5592

Travis pretty much shut the coffin and nailed it shut.

It does happen, but it only happens once and the problem is taken care of. No excuses, no tolerating it because they can get away with it......take em out of the pack, and take em out of the gene pool..... Simple as that.

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Joe Newlin
UKC Cur Advocate
Home of Oak Ridge Kennels

I've brought some coon dogs out west and had them do just fine on bear and lions.

Currently I've got a 7/8 Cameron hound that will go nose to nose with any bears that we've got in this area. I've also just recently replaced a dog that I put down last winter with a coon hound puppy from an elite bloodline.

Now here is a question. Can you take a tough, aggressive bear dog and have success in competitions? There is not one finished dog in my Cameron's pedigree.

quote:

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Originally posted by deschmidt27
I've been on a few bear hunts, and those dogs are bred for different traits than our coondogs. One of those, being out of necessity, is the desire to stay in a pack. A bear hound that is a loner, eventually finds themselves with more than they can handle on their own!

Many coon hound lines are bred for independence, and when a dog spends the majority of their life off on their own, they tend to not develop certain social skills.

---

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I have a friend that bear hunts and i have been with him a couple times. He had a problem with agression in his male pack he does not hunt males and females together. He was so mad he casterated every male dog on the place to take care of the problem. People don't understand what these big game dogs go through run 20 mile sections with swamps with a bear just in front of their noses who may stop in the swamp and and try to kill them once in a while. In most part these packs grown up together and they work together everyday. If you have independit bear packs you have nothing. Unlike our coondogs we want independit dogs. And yes Bruce their is still a little walker female running bear in Wisconsin all summer long that is a littermate to that dog of yours.

Hello Bruce,

Over the years I have hunted with 7 different crews. I will try to answer your questions as i have witnessed in my limited exposure.

1. It is there.
2. You are not seeing things.
3. Most don't put up with it, but I have seen groups who were blind to it just as much as coonhunters.
4. Bear hounds are much more tightly bred than 90% of the coon hounds out there. The bear hunters also are extremely protective of their breeding stock, and if they don't know you you aren't going to get a pup from their stock. At least that is the way it is here in Michigan.

__________________
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Aim small miss small

Re: Coondogs vs Beardogs at tree.

quote:

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Originally posted by Bruce M. Conkey
I get videos from friends all the time of dogs treeing bear. I am talking six to a dozen dogs treeing. I don't see the aggression between bear dogs like I do between some coon hounds.
1. Is it their and I am not seeing it.
2. Is it not there in the coon hounds either and I am just seeing things.
3. Is it because the dogs see that big ole bear and concentrating on him while the Coondogs is treeing on the tree and guarding it.
4. Is it the concentrated breeding of coon hounds compared to generally more cross breeding in bear hounds.
Would to love hear what some bear hunters think also.

---

__________________
Al Tarantella

I think I had 12 or more on One coon !!!!



Better pic of all of them ...

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Bear dog,coon dog,sheep dog etc.Teach em young to share there food and they will share anything.Very good friend of mine has 12 bear hounds and i have seen em all eat together with no problem.I assure you they were not born that way.Sometime the tail wags the dog.Think about it.

__________________
paul

quote:

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Originally posted by gottabered
Bear dog,coon dog,sheep dog etc.Teach em young to share there food and they will share anything.Very good friend of mine has 12 bear hounds and i have seen em all eat together with no problem.I assure you they were not born that way.Sometime the tail wags the dog.Think about it.

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Neil Cash

The bear hunters I know cull with a iron fist, the coon hunters I know that own mean dogs always blame someone else...

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quote:

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Originally posted by CROOKED RIVER
The bear hunters I know cull with a iron fist, the coon hunters I know that own mean dogs always blame someone else...

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coon&bear dogs

i do not put up with ill dogs period. bear dogs have to get along sometimes treed together for hours before we get to them. no room for ill dogs coonhunting pleasure or compettion . who in right mind would want to hunt anything with ruff dogs. if people would cull or stop it before its problem. some are born that way some are man made.some can be corrected , some can't.no room in my kennel for ill minded. just my opinion...

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my buddy down south has bear dogs....


them little plotts are crazy...he cant kennel them together...cant feed them together....cant haul certain ones together....

but dump em out of the truck and they are FINE...get on a tree and they are fine...


odd...


buddy has the next kennel with deer dogs...beagles and running walkers and beagle/running walker crosses..they live together...eat together...and hunt together...they are all hauled together too...



i think we may be bring it out on our own...many coon hunters arent running packs anymore....

my dog hunts with other dogs a handful of times a year outside of competition hunting....

if i didnt competition hunt id rarely hunt with others....if i wanted to run a pack it wouldnt be for a dang ole coon...bear and deer hunting with packs is a BLAST...and not easy to do by the lone dog...coon hunting though one dog can do it alone...no need to feed more than one dog if you got one worth feeding...

so us hunting them alone now might bring out the aggressions/territorial responses etc...

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Finally a logical reply.bottom line Coon hunters hide it and bear hunters cull it...

quote:

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Originally posted by mauser06
my buddy down south has bear dogs....


them little plotts are crazy...he cant kennel them together...cant feed them together....cant haul certain ones together....

but dump em out of the truck and they are FINE...get on a tree and they are fine...


odd...


buddy has the next kennel with deer dogs...beagles and running walkers and beagle/running walker crosses..they live together...eat together...and hunt together...they are all hauled together too...



i think we may be bring it out on our own...many coon hunters arent running packs anymore....

my dog hunts with other dogs a handful of times a year outside of competition hunting....

if i didnt competition hunt id rarely hunt with others....if i wanted to run a pack it wouldnt be for a dang ole coon...bear and deer hunting with packs is a BLAST...and not easy to do by the lone dog...coon hunting though one dog can do it alone...no need to feed more than one dog if you got one worth feeding...

so us hunting them alone now might bring out the aggressions/territorial responses etc...

---

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