UKC Forums - Tired of gators at the tree

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Posted by gnblues13 on 03-10-2010 02:11 AM:

Tired of gators at the tree

Seems like every nite hunt i enter if not in my cast. Someone comes back to the club house talking about how some dog is running other dogs off of tree. I think the U.K.C. should consider cracking down on the agrressive behavior before more good dogs get ruined by worthless gators.

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Posted by Velocity on 03-10-2010 02:30 AM:

Re: Tired of gators at the tree

quote:
Originally posted by gnblues13
Seems like every nite hunt i enter if not in my cast. Someone comes back to the club house talking about how some dog is running other dogs off of tree. I think the U.K.C. should consider cracking down on the agrressive behavior before more good dogs get ruined by worthless gators.

Well one simple question???? did anyone in the cast write them up? What i have noticed lately is everyone lets it slide here and there because they don't want there dogs wrote up as well. If you think that there is a problem when you are waiting on the 5 or when you get close to the tree tell the judge you want the whole cast to see for 20 seconds whats going on at the tree instead of everyone jumping in and handling there dogs. I have a few guys that always want to know why my NT CH does not tree belly up to the tree LOL i always tell them there is more room and less teeth 4 ft from the tree.... Besides she always seems to want to look at the coon for some reason instead of bellying up. I guess what i'm trying to say is if NO ONE HAS THE "YOU KNOW WHATS" TO WRITE THEM UP THEN YOU WILL HAVE TO DRAW OUT WITH THEM NEXT WEEK......

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Posted by tree_dogs on 03-10-2010 02:45 AM:

gators

It is not UKC responsibility , it is up to the judge and cast members to stop it. The rules are there use them !!!

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Posted by Lowell Lynn on 03-10-2010 02:46 AM:

You gotta realize too, that normally the first thing a person says when they draw minus due to there dog leaving a tree is "They got run off". This I witnessed. We had a real good cast,a real good hunt. However, One boys dog set up about three trees by himself. Every time a dog would bark through the country his dog would pull.He took minus three times for the same reason. There was never an off bark,no face barking,blowing etc. When he got back to the club house he told different ones that his dog got ran off. Before long his dad gets back and he tells him the same thing. His dad comes to me all mad and wants to know why the aggressor was not scratched. What I had to say didn't make Daddy very happy. He was embarrassed by his son to say the least. Pretty much if you don't see it, remember there are two sides.

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Posted by Prime Time 29 on 03-10-2010 02:48 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Lowell Lynn
You gotta realize too, that normally the first thing a person says when they draw minus due to there dog leaving a tree is "They got run off". This I witnessed. We had a real good cast,a real good hunt. However, One boys dog set up about three trees by himself. Every time a dog would bark through the country his dog would pull.He took minus three times for the same reason. There was never an off bark,no face barking,blowing etc. When he got back to the club house he told different ones that his dog got ran off. Before long his dad gets back and he tells him the same thing. His dad comes to me all mad and wants to know why the aggressor was not scratched. What I had to say didn't make Daddy very happy. He was embarrassed by his son to say the least. Pretty much if you don't see it, remember there are two sides.

Well said, they are mean dogs but ALOT of talk as well which we all know people get carried away sometimes.

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Posted by gnblues13 on 03-10-2010 02:54 AM:

the problem is that most of the dogs ive seen are very well light broken. and usually the only proof i can ever see are the holes in the dogs. usually im the judge in the cast and i do everthing in my power to keep the aggressive dogs out but sometimes that just cant be avoided. without seeing these dogs doin it you cant scratch the dog. but when one dog is treeing and another dog ends up coming into the tree and the other dog is backed off bleeding with obvious fang marks what in the rulse can you do to that dog at all??

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Posted by jay brademeyer on 03-10-2010 02:27 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Lowell Lynn
You gotta realize too, that normally the first thing a person says when they draw minus due to there dog leaving a tree is "They got run off". This I witnessed. We had a real good cast,a real good hunt. However, One boys dog set up about three trees by himself. Every time a dog would bark through the country his dog would pull.He took minus three times for the same reason. There was never an off bark,no face barking,blowing etc. When he got back to the club house he told different ones that his dog got ran off. Before long his dad gets back and he tells him the same thing. His dad comes to me all mad and wants to know why the aggressor was not scratched. What I had to say didn't make Daddy very happy. He was embarrassed by his son to say the least. Pretty much if you don't see it, remember there are two sides.

i have seen this happen 20 times to 1 actual gator . if your dog is getting pushed around by some blowing by 2 or 3 intense tree dogs wanting on that sweet spot , get a dog that will get by himself or get out of the way. i have been comp hunting for almost 25 years and i have only actually seen a handfull of true alagators. lots of dogs will blow and push for that sweet spot. that doesn't make them a gator. all ukc has to do is have a progressive tree rule , and more of these ukc dog would be trained or bred to be by them selves . that would solv alot of fighting problems.

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Posted by oklared on 03-10-2010 03:09 PM:

IF COUGHT, UKC SHOULD WRITE UP OWNER, HANDLER, AND THE DOG, THREE TIMES AND DOG IS OUT FOR GOOD, OWNER AND HANDLER IS OUT FOR ONE YR., SECOND OFFENCE LONGER, ETC. IT WILL STOP IT. THE OWNER AND HANDLER KNOWS IF THIER DOG IS FUSSY OR NOT.

Posted by wildbill on 03-10-2010 04:51 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by oklared
IF COUGHT, UKC SHOULD WRITE UP OWNER, HANDLER, AND THE DOG, THREE TIMES AND DOG IS OUT FOR GOOD, OWNER AND HANDLER IS OUT FOR ONE YR., SECOND OFFENCE LONGER, ETC. IT WILL STOP IT. THE OWNER AND HANDLER KNOWS IF THIER DOG IS FUSSY OR NOT.

that would get the message out,the owner could get different handlers but if the owner was written up and had the same fate as the dog,3 scratchs and your out ,and if the handlers got warning letters for being handler of more than one dog scratched for fighting,then they might stop entering rough dogs for other people..

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Posted by Larry Atherton on 03-10-2010 05:23 PM:

Plain and simple, if you aren't part of the solution you are part of the problem.

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Posted by Cheyenne on 03-10-2010 05:35 PM:

I have seen some that were gators, seen some that just got caught up in the moment and have seen 3 dogs tree their guts out on a little tree falling all over and never one off bark. I had a dog that did not have one mean hair on him but every cast he was on sooner or later somebody got scratched because he jaked a tree so bad it would start dog fights, he would be running the tree with dogs chasing him he would fall down they would attack him and he just get back up trying to jump some more. Most what I hunt now just stand back on all 4 and tree out of trouble.

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Posted by harper english on 03-10-2010 05:42 PM:

I agree with Jay train your dog to be alone or get back a TRUE competition dog should have no problem avoiding trouble
I will not hunt a truly mean dog but if i hunt it it will not be pushed off the tree period

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Posted by coonsmen on 03-10-2010 05:47 PM:

Went to a hunt in Columbus il last weekend and before the cast even went out they had people withdraw because they didn't want their dog bit up by a certain dog. When the cast came back in all dogs were bloody and they just let the fighter withdraw. I'm just glad I pulled out a decent cast.
I would have been one that withdrew also. no need having my dog chewed up for a yellow slip of paper.

Posted by Russell Boyette on 03-10-2010 06:14 PM:

If there was a dog fight on every cast i went on, then Id be looking at mine own dog! Sometimes the dog that wins the fight, Aint the one that started it.

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Posted by Cheyenne on 03-10-2010 06:22 PM:

Russell, I know what a mean dog is I have been doing this for 30+ years and have run alot of hunts and trained alot of dogs, I promise the dog I mentioned would never fight or facebark. But he sure would try to go to the top of a big oak tree. Great disposition and a nice young dog. Only reason I sold him another man wanted him more than I did!

Posted by jay brademeyer on 03-10-2010 06:24 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Russell Boyette
If there was a dog fight on every cast i went on, then Id be looking at mine own dog! Sometimes the dog that wins the fight, Aint the one that started it.

GOOD POST. SOME ROUGH DOGS ARE NOT ALWAYS TOUGH.

Posted by Okie Dawg on 03-10-2010 06:30 PM:

Re: gators

quote:
Originally posted by tree_dogs
It is not UKC responsibility , it is up to the judge and cast members to stop it. The rules are there use them !!!

LMAO.........YEP

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Posted by Okie Dawg on 03-10-2010 06:33 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by coonsmen
Went to a hunt in Columbus il last weekend and before the cast even went out they had people withdraw because they didn't want their dog bit up by a certain dog. When the cast came back in all dogs were bloody and they just let the fighter withdraw. I'm just glad I pulled out a decent cast.
I would have been one that withdrew also. no need having my dog chewed up for a yellow slip of paper.

Don't leave when you withdraw. STAY AND VOTE!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by smokin-1-mo on 03-10-2010 06:40 PM:

IM WITH RUSSELL......

IF YOU DRAW ONE ON A REGULAR BASIS ODDS ARE ITS NOT THE OTHER GUYS DOG.......

Posted by Ray Lilly on 03-10-2010 07:26 PM:

The problem is that most are light broke because people know what there huntin. What sucks is when you get there and you got one that is'nt mean but can get scratched for defending himself. I've been lucky over the years drawing pretty good dogs and people and have only had one dog scratched one time. That was at Grand American and the fight broke out between my dog and another. The problem is that I know my dog and know he's not mean but others dont know that. Both dogs got scratched not knowing which one started it which is the only thing you can do. What did prove which was the mean dog is the other dog got scratched the next night and then again at Winters Classics a couple of weeks later. Thats 3 hunts in a row and was scratched from the other *kc also. IMO the owner should have been barred because he was the one putting the dog in hunts and knew what he had. The worse part is that he was a stud dog that had alot of pups on the ground just like him.
I tried to give him a .22 bullet that night and told him what I would do if it was my dog.lol A few months later I heard that he took my advice.

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Posted by Ray Walburn on 03-11-2010 12:32 AM:

we have had the problem here

We have had guys withdrawl just to keep there dog from being scratched. Then others play dumm saying I dont know what you mean mine wasnt doing that honstely I never seen it . ( yea right) but your right if you dont write them up you draw them again !!!

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Posted by wildbill on 03-11-2010 01:59 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by harper english
I agree with Jay train your dog to be alone or get back a TRUE competition dog should have no problem avoiding trouble
I will not hunt a truly mean dog but if i hunt it it will not be pushed off the tree period

you need to read what you said real slow.you could be part of the problem too.a dog that wont share the tree is as bad as a dog wanting all to its self.

i judged one nite ch. cast at the first tree,we had noise and a male dog met us and went back to the tree ,the handler said his dog dont normal leave the tree like that and their must me a mean dog,,lol.told him i heard the noise but they were angels when we got to where they sen our light coming,

2nd drop dogs treed and noise again ,we got half way to tree and i told the handlersto turn off headlamps and use walking light andstay their till i got halfway to tree and then start to tree with walking lights ,when i got halfway to tree i shut my walking light out and i could hear plain as day someone say "o'sh!t" ,

well the dry leaves warned the dogs and they got like angels and i didnt catch them but 2 dogs were withdrawed at that tree and no more trouble the rest of the night,,

i think the club drew me to that cast for a reason ,lol
i will catch a mean dog if possable,maybe thats why i always got stuck judgeing,,lol

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Posted by psiskjr on 03-11-2010 02:56 AM:

Anyone that tolerates a mean dog at the tree ought to be barred. I know that dogs can be light broke as I hunted with one that a friend got sold and the owner knew it. It took several months to catch him in the act as he was an angel when he saw a light. I had a redbone at the time that was to smart for him. When I caught him we heard him and all the young dogs quit the tree. I turned my light out and slipped in on him. He was trying to fight my redbone but ole red would just move around the tree and keep on treeing. He did manage to jump on some pups that had come back to the tree with me, just before I commenced stomping a mudhole in him.

It is worse when bear hunting. I had a Plott that would meet me fifty yards out and you could bet your house that there was a mean dog at the tree. I didnt tolerate anybodys dog jumping on dogs at the tree on bear. I especially wouldnt even hunt with a walker as most fights started with those dogs.

I know that will rile some feathers but if the shoe fits, wear it.

What really frightens me is the adds that call dogs "pressure tree dogs". To me that means he will fight, and the old saying "jumping on a down dog" wasnt just made up.

Paul

Posted by smokin-1-mo on 03-11-2010 03:11 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by psiskjr

What really frightens me is the adds that call dogs "pressure tree dogs". To me that means he will fight, and the old saying "jumping on a down dog" wasnt just made up.

Paul

PAUL ,PRESSURE TREEDOG MEANS HE WILL STAYED TREE IF THEY ARE SPLIT AND OUR IF ANOTHER DOG IS RUNNING HE IS NOT GOING TO PULL TO THEM....PRESSURE TREEDOG........

Posted by wildbill on 03-11-2010 03:15 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by psiskjr
Anyone that tolerates a mean dog at the tree ought to be barred. I know that dogs can be light broke as I hunted with one that a friend got sold and the owner knew it. It took several months to catch him in the act as he was an angel when he saw a light. I had a redbone at the time that was to smart for him. When I caught him we heard him and all the young dogs quit the tree. I turned my light out and slipped in on him. He was trying to fight my redbone but ole red would just move around the tree and keep on treeing. He did manage to jump on some pups that had come back to the tree with me, just before I commenced stomping a mudhole in him.

It is worse when bear hunting. I had a Plott that would meet me fifty yards out and you could bet your house that there was a mean dog at the tree. I didnt tolerate anybodys dog jumping on dogs at the tree on bear. I especially wouldnt even hunt with a walker as most fights started with those dogs.

I know that will rile some feathers but if the shoe fits, wear it.

What really frightens me is the adds that call dogs "pressure tree dogs". To me that means he will fight, and the old saying "jumping on a down dog" wasnt just made up.

Paul

i like walkers from the coonhunting boodlines and think you are right about the last statement ,,

""What really frightens me is the adds that call dogs "pressure tree dogs". To me that means he will fight, and the old saying "jumping on a down dog" wasnt just made up."""

the only pressure there should be is to put the coon up the tree..not each other,,

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