UKC Forums - Will you feed and hunt Grade Dogs?

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Posted by on 03-03-2010 01:15 AM:

Will you feed and hunt Grade Dogs?

For you big game hunters, does a dog having papers matter? What about dogs that have a good pedigree and are out of good cooners but dont meet breed standard (due to color) and are given away because of it? How many of you do papers matter to?

Posted by Bear on 03-03-2010 02:13 AM:

Papers dont really matter(they dont really matter with coonhounds either)They are a tool for keeping track of parentage,know several guys with"crossed up" hounds that can show youa 3,4 5, even 7 gen pedigree they kept on their own.However,a good "coondog" pedigree dosent mean they will makea big game hound.

Posted by bloody redbones on 03-03-2010 02:20 AM:

blue stlye i have seen crossbreeds,blonde plotts,and a redbone that i had with a white chest and belly(beaaaar dog)without papers that were good.i know a man that had ukc plotts that had a house fire and i don,t know that he could paid to have all the paper work redone but his dogs were tops for bear,with or without the papers.a lot of the western hound are breed from some french blood that were start by single register which ukc will do.papers are to let one know about anchestors and degree of wins,thats all.papers also have been switched to a grade dog before. papers don't make a dog.know the truth on who bread the dog and what they come from only helps to pick pups.

Posted by bearman on 03-03-2010 02:38 AM:

If your Registration papers burn up in a house fire U.K.C will replace for free. Straight from Allen G's mouth!

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Posted by timberchuck on 03-03-2010 02:48 AM:

Grade dogs

When I first started Competition hunting years ago, there were more grade dog casts than reg. Oh and by the way.....the spectators were out watching the grade casts. Need I say more. Well yes. The reg hounds certainly did improve over the years. But I still have not seen a set of papers run a bear coon or anything else.

Vic

Posted by Rockcreek on 03-03-2010 04:52 AM:

Papers don't matter a **** bit! The recipe sure does though...

__________________
Mason Workman
702-686-5035

Posted by Melanie H. on 03-03-2010 05:22 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Rockcreek
Papers don't matter a **** bit! The recipe sure does though...

+1

I do like papers to keep track of the recipe though.. But will not base what I get on papers or make my decisions on papers..

I just need to figure my own system out to keep track LOL

__________________
~Melanie Hampton~
OutWest Big Game Hounds

You've only got 3 choices in life, give in, give up, or give it all you got.

Posted by Matt Jones on 03-03-2010 12:53 PM:

Papers don't get game, but we should all try to keep them registered for future generations. My best Cat Dog is a little english female who probablly had puppy papers at one time, sure would like to know her bloodlines, would try some more out of that stock.

Posted by glynnsdawgs63 on 03-03-2010 02:04 PM:

I don't any grade dogs at this time.My felling on grade or registered is a good dog is a good dog wether its got papers or not.

Glynn

Posted by Mike_Flores on 03-03-2010 04:06 PM:

I dont mind a grade dog at all. All my dogs are registered, but I dont breed or compete in anything. I'm just a hunter. So far, I've never needed my papers or reg card for anything.

Posted by bluebellchopper on 03-03-2010 04:53 PM:

I know

a man that has redtick bluetick cross and are making awesome bear and tree dogs.

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Devin Duncan, Bath County Va. 540-292-1176

Posted by dsodshounds on 03-03-2010 05:32 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by bearhunter
Papers dont really matter(they dont really matter with coonhounds either)They are a tool for keeping track of parentage,know several guys with"crossed up" hounds that can show youa 3,4 5, even 7 gen pedigree they kept on their own.However,a good "coondog" pedigree dosent mean they will makea big game hound.

i agree. most of the better big game dogs ive saw were solid big game dogs bred to solid big game dogs. and those crosses bred the same way again. seems like the few old timers ive hunted with that bred for themselves always bred for what they liked in a big game dog and bred for themselves or locally.. papers didnt mean much to them but consitently catching bears did, and when they bought a pup or pups from a real good coondog pedigree the nose power wasnt there alot of the time they they liked. alot of ppl dont realize that it takes alot to make a big game dog.

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Brushy Ridge English Hounds
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Posted by bluebellchopper on 03-03-2010 08:37 PM:

I was a bear hunter I would hunt grade dogs all the time. You could cross what ever dog to what ever dog to breed the traits that you want in them to be better big game hounds. example cross a plott with a bluetick= nose and grit. walker x bluetick = speed and nose. But in the coon hunting world if you want to night hunt and sell your pups papers are everything.

__________________
Devin Duncan, Bath County Va. 540-292-1176

Posted by Diggerman on 03-03-2010 09:21 PM:

papers

quote:
Originally posted by Matt Jones
Papers don't get game, but we should all try to keep them registered for future generations. My best Cat Dog is a little english female who probablly had puppy papers at one time, sure would like to know her bloodlines, would try some more out of that stock.

Need anyone say any more!!!!

Posted by HrdStrknKennels on 03-04-2010 01:53 PM:

A guy I hunt with just raised a litter of plott walker crossed pups hoping to getthe nose and drive of the walker and to try to improve the feet with the plott. We hunt a lot of registered dogs and most of them are off the same line of dogs and will continue to do so as long as it works. It has worked for a long time and hope it keeps working for a lot longer

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Hard Stroakin Kennels & Pure Rage Big Game Hounds
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"THIS AINT NO BEAUTY CONTEST"
coon and bear dogs of the FINEST kind
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Posted by T.chandler44 on 03-06-2010 01:31 AM:

I will hunt em with or with out papers and most of the guys i hunt with has mixed grade dogs and some papered dogs we hunt em papers dont get us meat i keep registered and grade dogs i like papers cause i competiton hunt but all my competiton dogs are trained by a redbone and blk and tan mixed so no papers dnt matter unless ur in the competiton hunts

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Posted by David Boggs on 03-06-2010 07:34 AM:

i will hunt

aney thing long as it is a coon dog or wat ever i am hunting.i like my pappers to keep up with the line but i have never sean pappers tree no kind of game,david

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i tell the truth about my dogs good or bad

Posted by Diggerman on 03-06-2010 04:23 PM:

Papers

Of cource papers have never treed anything,sick of hearing that,A hound is a hound, regardless of papers.Papers tell you where your hound came from period. However they are a very usefull tool in breeding or selecting your next pup. Papers can only help you in selecting a hound, Papers cannot hurt you in selecting a hound. If it doesn't matter where your hound came from, or where to get another one ,then don't worry about papers. I am glad someone had foresight to start a registry and keep it going all these years. I know where most of my hounds come from, and I WISH I knew about the rest of them.

Posted by theo on 03-07-2010 12:03 AM:

Papers???

Papers Dont Tree Coons!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.You have something that doesnt have papers,and is a good Dog............you got yourself a good coon Dog!!

Posted by rick matley on 03-08-2010 11:49 AM:

I threw a book at a bear once and he wasn't worried, then I opened the doors of the dog box, he took off running then. Never did tree a bear with a piece of paper but do tree bears with my hounds, same thing happens with Bobcats too.....LOL

Posted by Rockcreek on 03-08-2010 07:16 PM:

Re: Papers

quote:
Originally posted by Diggerman
Papers can only help you in selecting a hound,

I respectfully disagree with that.

Take care.
Mason

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702-686-5035

Posted by Skeeter22 on 03-08-2010 10:05 PM:

papers

Both me and my cousin are huntin grade dogs out of the same line. we know what they come out of for three generations just by keeping track ourselves. The rest of the guys in the group hunt manily grade and we treeing bear and coon. Yes I will have a dogs with papers as long as IT DOES ITS JOB! But it dont matter one way or the other.

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ShortRidgeKennels- Bear n Down

Posted by Iceman197 on 03-11-2010 11:27 PM:

All about Preference

As for papered or grade dogs, it really is personal preference. Both have some great dogs come out of them, but also both have dogs that are not "up to par." We personally use papered dogs for the pure and simple fact that you can keep track of the dogs bloodlines and for the sales factor. When selecting pups to bring into our pack, its nice to compare pedigrees of bloodlines that we have had good luck with in the past and that others have had good luck with. We are fortunate to have some really really outstanding bear dogs and bringing in new blood once and a while. But we do hunt with a couple of different groups that do not have a single papered dog in their yards. Our papered dogs and their grade dogs run stride for stride. But the key to good dogs is culling the herd. No matter if the dog is papered or a grade dog, if it isn't doing the job, don't breed to it. You don't breed to the brother of the best dog, you breed to the best dog!

Posted by psiskjr on 03-13-2010 01:58 AM:

Papers?

It costs the same to feed a papered dog as it does to feed a grade dog. Not saying I wouldnt feed a good grade dog, BUT I like to breed my own so I own registered dogs and can trace them back thirty five years. I have had as many good coon dogs as I have had registered dogs. Same with hog dogs but I always have my registered Catahoulas to fall back on breeding replacement hog dogs.

As for breeding good big game dogs, I have never had any grade dogs that could equal my papered dogs. I have always believed that if you needed to cross a breed then you had the wrong breed to start with.

Breeding good dogs and having good dogs are not the same thing.

Psiskjr

Posted by HrdStrknKennels on 03-13-2010 04:05 AM:

a dog can be a good dog and a good reproducer weather it has papers or not but it is also a proven fact that cross breeding will give you some hybrid vigor which means that cross bred dogs are supposed to be better as lng as you are breeding quality animals. And another thing I have noticed is that people that know how to cut their losses on a dog and cull the ones that are not up to par are usually the guys hauling the best pack of dogs around.

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