UKC Forums - Score this please

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Posted by Steve Raleigh on 04-25-2009 08:54 AM:

Score this please

4 dog cast.....dog A strikes for 100, B for 75, C for 50, D for 25.....Dog B trees for 125, Dog A for 75, the five is up cast is walking to score tree, along the way dog D is called treed (in the same area as previously treed dogs)....As we arrive (20ft) from tree all dogs are treed on the same tree....Once we get 15 ft from the tree dog B gets off the tree and grabs a drink of water for about 45 seconds, within the 45 seconds the cast is at the tree and all dog are handled except for dog B but is soon handled as he comes back to the tree before tree is scored and is handled...Cast scores the tree and coon is seen....what is the outcome of the scored tree?

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Posted by JustinM on 04-25-2009 10:00 AM:

dog B -125 dog D -125

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Posted by nitehawk on 04-25-2009 12:20 PM:

YEP!

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Posted by Nightmare10 on 04-25-2009 12:31 PM:

matt

I would say so. I dont think they can minus you for a dog getting a drink.

Posted by ratdaddy1 on 04-25-2009 12:45 PM:

hey man!!!

Dog B scored 125 dog A scored 75 dog D takes minus 5 was up coon was seen cant minus dog for drink but can if 5 is up and coon is seen. If dog D was on a differnt tree he would get 125 score to but he wasnt ......

Posted by on 04-25-2009 01:27 PM:

Stare at your watch for 45 seconds. If a dog is away and not treeing that long, I minus them, not for getting a drink but for leaving the tree. Dog B minused 125 tree and 75 strike=total 200-. Dog D is minused 125 tree and 25 strike=total 150-.

Posted by Rick Ennen on 04-25-2009 01:44 PM:

A few months ago on a hunt, during the commotion of handlers leashing their dogs, I was last to the tree and in the commotion my dog walked about 20 feet from the tree before I could grab his collar. He immediatley turned around and walked directly back to the tree. The whole sequence didn't take more than a few seconds. Minus is what the judge gave me. I was also told that had I followed the dog off the tree and handled him away from the tree without the judge's permission, I could be scratched. I should mention this was not a UKC hunt and a hard lesson of how strictly enforced a judge could apply the rules. So the exception for dogs drinking water would seem like a judgement rule on the part of the judge and not something in the rule book.

Posted by Brandon Coselman on 04-25-2009 02:09 PM:

Dog B is minused both ways and DOG D is deleted on tree and minus on strike...

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Posted by Steve Raleigh on 04-25-2009 02:17 PM:

Lot of different answers lol....Jim, what does dog C get?? he was struck 3rd and treeing on the closed tree when cast arrives (not declared treed either) coon was seen.

Posted by Rip on 04-25-2009 02:19 PM:

Jim is right.

You can't delete D's tree points since he was called treed after the 5 minutes.

Tough break for the thirsty dog. 45 seconds is a long time, but I doubt it actually took 45 seconds. For one, the dog wouldn't have came back if he had to go that far to get water. If water was that close and the dog was hot, well then I personally wouldn't want a dog that was too stupid to keep from overheating.

All smart dogs would do it, but would likely be back on the tree before we got there. You don't know what happens at a tree till you get there. We think we know, but I have seen many dogs quit treein to drink on a hot night with water in sight.

Goin strictly by the rules (which is what we have to do to keep any integrity in the hunts) those dogs are minused. When I am huntin on my own that dog gets petted just as much cause it was only gettin a drink and had no intention of "leaving a tree".

Dog C if it was at the tree but not called treed would be minused strike.

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Posted by Steve Raleigh on 04-25-2009 09:18 PM:

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Rip
[B]Jim is right.

Tough break for the thirsty dog. 45 seconds is a long time, but I doubt it actually took 45 seconds. For one, the dog wouldn't have came back if he had to go that far to get water. If water was that close and the dog was hot, well then I personally wouldn't want a dog that was too stupid to keep from overheating.

All smart dogs would do it, but would likely be back on the tree before we got there. You don't know what happens at a tree till you get there. We think we know, but I have seen many dogs quit treein to drink on a hot night with water in sight.

QUOTE]

Rip,
Acutally it did take 45 seconds and the creek in which the dog got a drink from was 5-10ft from the tree....

smart dog???? the dog was laid up all winter hadnt been hunted but 1 or twice since last october....

Your ignorant.

Posted by Rip on 04-25-2009 10:01 PM:

quote:

Rip,
Acutally it did take 45 seconds and the creek in which the dog got a drink from was 5-10ft from the tree....

smart dog???? the dog was laid up all winter hadnt been hunted but 1 or twice since last october....

Your ignorant. [/B]

Woah bud, maybe before you call someone ignorant you should LEARN THE RULES and not ask questions that are elementary at best.

I said a dog that got a drink WAS SMART not to get overheated and to take care of him/herself.

You just proved my point for me. It was 5-10 feet away, not far at all and certianly not far enough to think the dog had "leaving the tree" on his mind. He/she just needed a drink.

But, he technically left the tree and got a drink so we have to score him as leaving the tree.

I personally think that is a smart dog.

It's not too smart to be trying to attack people that are just helping you out and didn't do anything to you.

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Posted by Steve Raleigh on 04-25-2009 10:28 PM:

Rip,
I apologize....I read your post wrong and took it wrong.

Posted by ratdaddy1 on 04-26-2009 12:08 AM:

hey man!!!

Read again dog D was declaerd treed in same area did not say same tree when they got to tree he was on the same tree coon was seen he takes minus both ways if he was declard split... look (at rule 4d it will tell you to .........this is in the rule book on page 54 look at rule k on same page) dog B could be minused but could take to a vote ....................... I would not minus him becouse he was not leaving just 5 or 10 feet to get a drink health of dog is importaint............

DOG CAN NOT BE TREED ON CLOSED TREE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by JustinM on 04-26-2009 03:57 AM:

arg those 4 am post screw me up, sleep deprived haha I forgot to minus those strike points in my original post.

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Posted by Wes Coffman on 04-26-2009 04:06 AM:

Jim is right.

Posted by Rip on 04-26-2009 04:47 AM:

It's OK Steve, we all do that from time to time.

Message boards are typed and the tone doesn't come across like it does in normal conversation so it is easy to take offense at something that was meant as innocent, or miss something.

No hard feelins.

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Posted by Steve Raleigh on 04-26-2009 08:21 AM:

Good deal Rip...again i apologize...so what does dog C get scored as? that was one of the main reasons for the post....by the way i was handeling dog A. not that it matters, but just was wondering about dog C. as he was stuck but not treed and was treeing when cast arrived and coon was seen....does he only get minused stike and his (next available gets deleted and minuse donly on stike?)

Posted by Rip on 04-26-2009 01:31 PM:

If dog C was at the tree and wasn't treed in he gets minused on track in accordance with rule 4D

"(d) If dog declared treed, after five minutes has elapsed no additional dog can be declared treed at that particular tree but if they come in to tree will get minus on track and nothing on tree if coon is seen."

If the coon wasn't seen then he would have got circle.

Dog D gets minused tree points because like we discussed before he was declared treed by his handler after the 5 minutes were up, meaning the handler was calling a split tree and the dog wasn't so he got minused the 125 tree points for being treed and not being on a different tree.

The only time you ever assign tree points to a dog is if a dog is there treeing but not declared treed when the judge arrives on a slick or off game tree. Other than that you don't assign tree points to a dog.

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Posted by Steve Raleigh on 04-26-2009 04:18 PM:

Posted by jawscardodger on 04-27-2009 07:17 PM:

Judge shouldn't of took the tree call on dog D unless it was clear he was split treed.

Posted by Wes Coffman on 04-27-2009 09:18 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by jawscardodger
Judge shouldn't of took the tree call on dog D unless it was clear he was split treed.

wrong.

*(k) Any dogs declared treed after five minutes expires and tree is closed; call will be accepted as a split tree. If dog is on closed tree when judge arrives, tree points will be minused. Strike points scored in accordance with 4(d).

Posted by on 04-27-2009 09:26 PM:

jaws was right last year, Wes is right this year.

Posted by jawscardodger on 04-28-2009 02:18 PM:

Didn't know they changed that rule.i guess I'm only a year behind.

Posted by copperheadcreek on 04-28-2009 06:56 PM:

my question is , did the judge see the dog on the tree , if so and all it did was get a drink of water and come back to the tree and start treeing again , i probably wouldnt - the dog. as far as c he is - track only. d is - 125 ( acording to the new rule) for tree and - for the track........

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