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affects of grain on dogs

how does the following grains affect a dog
corn
soy
wheat
see some feeds the advertise free of these grains, just wondering what the actual affect of these are on a dog.
is it digestability, allergy or etc

thanks

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scott phillips
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Ch. Nt. Ch. Wild N Blue Hooker
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ok im gonna try to explain this to the best of MY UNDERSTANDING of it. Dogs evolved from wolves. Wolves and dogs=carnivores. Their digestive system is evolved and tuned to process meat and bone and such. They were never meant to eat or be fed corn or soy or wheat or any of that other stuff. they cannot digest it properly. So their digestive system dumps extra gastric acids into the stomach in an attempt to digest said food. this leads to more waste in the kennel and loose stool or diarrhea and can have adverse effects on the dogs body. Imagine a dog as a highly tuned engine designed to run on meat. its like taking a strong diesel engine and trying to run it on gasoline. I hope that makes a little sense.

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thats the way ive heard it too. I also was told by my vet that corn makes a dog hot in the summer. since i have switched to a corn free fed i have noticed my dogs dont get near as hot in warm weather.

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Never saw a wolf attack a wheat field

diamond's extreme athletes naturals

Do any of u have opinions on this feed? Its chicken and rice blend that's 32/25.

Re: diamond's extreme athletes naturals

quote:

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Originally posted by BHolland
Do any of u have opinions on this feed? Its chicken and rice blend that's 32/25.

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Clyde Murphy 229-344-7308

GRCH GRNITECH"PR" Blue Iron Brummy HTX

Top 100 Finalist 2012 UKC World Hunt.

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Tree Blue

I use and recommend Backwoods Supplies

thanks

I have been feeding it for bout 6 mths and dogs like plus they seem to be more in shape easier also. Looking for some feedback from other houndsmen feeding or have fed it. Thanks

I'm feedin diamond naturals.Lamb and Rice.Dogs look and hunt real good.I don't hunt more than 3 nights a week so EA would be overkill.

Wild carnavores eat meat, grass, and stomach and gut contents.

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Bill Harper
Washington, NC
252-944-5592

fences around gardens here are to keep the rabbits, ground hogs n deer out not keep stray dogs, coyotes n fox out. lol
I was lookin for an answer on if someone fed a food with high amounts of soy or wheat what affects would it have over a meat based grain free feed. digestability n the body actually using it seems to be how it affects dogs.

__________________
scott phillips
517-937-9519

Ch. Nt. Ch. Wild N Blue Hooker
Nt. Ch. Treesmokin Midnight Madness (Maddy)

Re: diamond's extreme athletes naturals

quote:

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Originally posted by BHolland
Do any of u have opinions on this feed? Its chicken and rice blend that's 32/25.

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__________________
Justin Henthorne-304-203-1100

quote:

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Originally posted by Bill(Chew)
Wild carnavores eat meat, grass, and stomach and gut contents.

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__________________
“The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatsoever that it is not utterly absurd.”

Grains, Starch

Even the most illustrious canine breeds can probably trace their heritage to junkyard dogs.

That’s the conclusion of a new study aimed at finding the genetic changes that transformed wild wolves into domesticated dogs. Dogs can digest carbohydrates better than wolves can, and gaining that ability may have been an important step in taming the animals, evolutionary geneticist Erik Axelsson of Uppsala University in Sweden and his colleagues report online January 23 in Nature. As humans settled into farming communities, wolves may have given up their meat-only diets to scavenge carbohydrate-rich food from garbage dumps. Animals that could best make use of the starchy food may gradually have morphed over generations into man’s best friend.

No one expected genes relating to digestion to be important for dog domestication, says Elaine Ostrander, chief of the National Human Genome Research Institute’s cancer genetics branch and an authority on dog genetics. Researchers previously thought that when wolves became domestic dogs, genes controlling behavior and the immune system must have changed.

The new study focuses on genetic differences between 60 dogs representing 14 breeds and 12 wolves from around the world. Those changes, the researchers reasoned, could identify genes that were important in separating dogs from wolves.

The researchers determined the genetic makeup of groups of dogs and compared the results to those from wolves, concentrating on parts of the genetic instruction book that differ between the two species. As they had expected, the researchers uncovered differences in many genes relating to the brain. But the search also revealed lots of genes involved in starch digestion and metabolism, and in the use of fats. Dogs, the team found, have more copies than wolves do of the AMY2B gene, which produces an enzyme that breaks starch into easily digestible sugars.

Other genetic variants seem to contribute to dogs’ increased ability to convert a sugar called maltose to glucose, the sugar that cells prefer to burn for energy. Yet other genetic changes improve dogs’ ability to move glucose into their cells. Combined, the tweaks alter dogs’ metabolism so they can get more energy out of a carbohydrate-rich diet than wolves can, the researchers conclude. The scientists confirmed the effect of the genetic variants by identifying biochemical differences in starch metabolism in blood and tissue samples from dogs and wolves.

“This is a profound adaptation that dogs have,” says UCLA evolutionary biologist Robert Wayne. But he doesn’t think it was the first step in domestication. Archaeological evidence suggests that domesticated dogs have been around at least since 33,000 years ago, a time when humans were still hunter-gatherers. The changes that allow dogs to thrive on carbohydrates while wolves eat all meat probably started with the establishment of agriculture about 10,000 years ago, and represent late steps in the domestication process, Wayne says.

Both brain changes and dietary adaptations were probably necessary for some wolves to be domesticated Axelsson says. Wolves that were more tolerant to stress and that didn’t run and hide at the first sign of a human would have been able to stick around garbage heaps longer and eat their fill. And those that could extract more nutrients from the plant material in early farmers’ trash would have had an evolutionary advantage. The researchers are now determining when and in what part of the world the adaptations likely occurred, he says.

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Diet

Genetics Markers Prove Dogs Have Evolved to Digest Carbohydrates and Starches
by Dr. Patrick Mahaney

One could spend all day, or more, engaging in (sometimes heated) dialogue about what our pets should eat. Depending on your personal beliefs, education, and experience, your perspective could be vastly different from another pet owner. Even within the veterinary community, there are a wide range of recommendations as to what is the most appropriate style of feeding for our companion canines and felines.

Should your pet eat a whole-food based diet made up of nutrients identical or similar to the form created by nature, or a highly processed diet engineered into a dehydrated (and seemingly devitalized) piece of kibble?

What about the components that make up a particular diet? Should pet food have whole meats, vegetables, fruits, and grains? Or is it sufficient to feed protein and grain meals and by-products that have been coated with rendered fat and infused with artificial colors to increase palatability and appeal to owner aesthetics (respectively)?

Should you be feeding grains and starches to your pooch? Can dogs even digest them? Recently, a study published in Nature magazine proved that dogs’ domestication complements environmental and geographical changes associated with their role as companions to humans. It’s proven in their genes, which have evolved similarly to man’s and reflect dogs’ ability to digest grains and starches.

The authors of the study, titled The Genomic Signature of Dog Domestication Reveals Adaptation to a Starch-Rich Diet, conducted "whole-genome resequencing of dogs and wolves to identify 3.8 million genetic variants used to identify 36 genomic regions that probably represent targets for selection during dog domestication. Nineteen of these regions contain genes important in brain function, eight of which belong to nervous system development pathways and potentially underlie behavioral changes central to dog domestication.

“Ten genes with key roles in starch digestion and fat metabolism also show signals of selection. We identify candidate mutations in key genes and provide functional support for an increased starch digestion in dogs relative to wolves. Our results indicate that novel adaptations allowing the early ancestors of modern dogs to thrive on a diet rich in starch, relative to the carnivorous diet of wolves, constituted a crucial step in the early domestication of dogs."

As domesticated dogs are believed to have evolved from wolves nearly 11,000 years ago, their evolutionary process parallels a similar genetic shift seen in humans. Today’s dogs and humans eat and can digest a wider variety of foods in comparison to the primarily meat protein meals that were hunted, killed, or scavenged by their lupine and Cro-Magnon predecessors.

To fit modern times, we should be providing our canine companions some variety in their diets. I am an advocate of both dogs and cats eating whole food meals instead of processed diets. As ChooseMyPlate.gov does not advocate that we humans regularly eat highly processed foods, the same basic principles should apply to our canine and feline companions.

Even though today’s dogs can digest grains and starches, I don’t recommend that such nutrients form the majority of a dog’s diet. Any grains or starches made to be consumed by our pets should be whole-food based, cooked, and included in a small to moderate quantity (30% or less of the volume of a particular meal), complementing the larger percentage of meat, vegetable, and fruit ingredients.

Although commercially available and home prepared diets that are 100 percent free of grains and starches are popular, there are nutritional benefits stemming from their inclusion. Whole grains like brown rice, barley, etc., are good sources of minerals (Selenium, Manganese, etc.) and can even serve as substrates (pre-biotics) on which beneficial bacteria (pro-biotics) grow. Starches like russet and sweet potatoes, banana, etc., are rich in vitamins (A, B6, E, etc.) and minerals (Potassium, Manganese, etc.).

Part of where my concern about pets eating commercially available pet foods containing grains and starches lies in the quality of the ingredients. The majority of canine and feline diets are made with ingredients that are "feed-grade," which are of lower quality than "human-grade" and have higher potential to contain unhealthy substances (e.g., deoxynivalenol [vomitoxin], aflatoxin, etc.) according to the FDA Regulatory Guidance for Toxins and Contaminants.

Short or long term consumption of these toxins can cause inflammatory bowel disease, kidney and liver damage, or even cancer (see petMD article: Are You Poisoning Your Companion Animal by Feeding 'Feed-Grade' Foods?).

How you feed your pet is your personal choice. Nobody can force you to feed a particular commercially available or home prepared option. My best suggestion is to model your pet’s diet after that which humans are recommended to eat, which means choosing a variety of whole foods and minimizing processed foods.

__________________
Doug Robinson

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Ditto!

quote:

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Originally posted by CSnowgren
You are on to something. Keep going with it.

As far as others about wheat, soy etc. Filler, nothing more. It provides a cheap "volume" with much less dietary benefit for the dog. This is how 20 dollar a bag feeds can keep it at 20 bucks. Remove the cheap filler, add better protein/carb ingredients and the price will go up because it has to.

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Doug Robinson

Past Home of:
GRNITECH FCH GRCH ROBINSON'S SILVERTONE BLUSPECK HTX DNA-P
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GRNITECH GRCH ROBINSON'S CIDERHOUSE LULU
NITECH GRCH GRFCH GRWCH RED RIDGE'S SUPER SHOCK Z HTX2
NITECH GRCH ROBINSON'S OATKA VALLEY ANNIE (BLUSPECK DAUGHTER)
NITECH GRCH ROBINSON'S JJ THUNDER SUE

Current
CH PR ROBINSON'S OATKA VALLEY JUNEBUG - (GRNITECH PKC CH RIVER BOTTOM'S CRACKER JACK X NITECH GRCH ROBINSON'S OATKA VALLEY ANNIE)

Bill (Chew)

Your are correct. The dog is actually a omivore. The cat however is a true carnivore.

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LuAnn Metsker

Rock Creek Kennels

Re: ;;;

quote:

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Originally posted by capt_agricultur
Never saw a wolf attack a wheat field

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