UKC Forums - World Champion Sambo

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-- World Champion Sambo (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928494914)

Posted by John D on 11-17-2017 03:14 PM:

Bottom line for me is I am "soured" on all of it. I feel a little bad for this Sambo dog since he thought he had it and now he thinks he may not. But if he keeps the title he will always be known as the dog that won it under questionable circumstances, and perhaps with a lawyer. If the title is awarded to the 2nd place dog, also perhaps with the help of a lawyer, then he'll be known as the first, 1st place loser to win the world hunt. If no dog is awarded the title, then why bother having a world hunt? I don't believe I'll ever look at the world hunt winner the same way but I'm not one of those who are all about the money and a win, no matter how its done.

Its no different than NFL players standing for the anthem. Even if the players start standing and appear to show respect, we now know a good number hate this country. My viewership of NFL is way down from what it used to be.

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Posted by edwardfasteddy on 11-17-2017 03:15 PM:

Like I said they got their backs covered, Didn't you know that?

Posted by Richard Lambert on 11-17-2017 03:29 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Kenneth Tavares
So, if someone spends thousands of dollars trying to win the World Hunt and wins the World Hunt. Them some crybaby gets their win pulled by manufacturing a story, you don't think they should try to recoup their money? 😂

Not saying it happened or didn't but what if someone spent $1,000's only to get beat by someone that cheated to get there. Shouldn't they be allowed to recoup their losses?
It seems to me that a lot of people are assuming facts not in evidence. Shouldn't we wait until the jury comes back and we hear all of the facts before we make a decision?

Posted by Josh Michaelis on 11-17-2017 05:57 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Not saying it happened or didn't but what if someone spent $1,000's only to get beat by someone that cheated to get there. Shouldn't they be allowed to recoup their losses?
It seems to me that a lot of people are assuming facts not in evidence. Shouldn't we wait until the jury comes back and we hear all of the facts before we make a decision?

Well the jury has been deliberating for a couple months now.

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Posted by Richard Lambert on 11-17-2017 06:40 PM:

Deliberating? Maybe they are still hearing testimony. How long has the Russian collusion special counsel been going on? I wonder if anyone in the Sambo case has been offered leniency or amnesty for their testimony?

Posted by Kenneth Tavares on 11-17-2017 06:41 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Not saying it happened or didn't but what if someone spent $1,000's only to get beat by someone that cheated to get there. Shouldn't they be allowed to recoup their losses?
It seems to me that a lot of people are assuming facts not in evidence. Shouldn't we wait until the jury comes back and we hear all of the facts before we make a decision?

Either way works, just asking about the lawsuit. 😝

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Tone it down guys, or they will delete another good topic...

Posted by Donmills65 on 11-17-2017 06:58 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by John D
Bottom line for me is I am "soured" on all of it. I feel a little bad for this Sambo dog since he thought he had it and now he thinks he may not. But if he keeps the title he will always be known as the dog that won it under questionable circumstances, and perhaps with a lawyer. If the title is awarded to the 2nd place dog, also perhaps with the help of a lawyer, then he'll be known as the first, 1st place loser to win the world hunt. If no dog is awarded the title, then why bother having a world hunt? I don't believe I'll ever look at the world hunt winner the same way but I'm not one of those who are all about the money and a win, no matter how its done.

Its no different than NFL players standing for the anthem. Even if the players start standing and appear to show respect, we now know a good number hate this country. My viewership of NFL is way down from what it used to be.

I don't think it should be just handed to them. Make them go back to hunt location and have them hunt it off between the 2 remaining dogs.

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Posted by CedarTree50 on 11-17-2017 07:09 PM:

If they take sams title they will be no world champion this year the other two dogs in the final round had minus points. Yes UKC has hurt mine and Sams reputation in ways people on this board will never understand no matter what their decision is. And yes UKC can be sued trust me on that one.

Posted by J I Allen on 11-17-2017 07:25 PM:

The trouble with suing someone or a company in civil court is if you lose the person or company you sued can ask the judge to reimburse them there legal fees. So when people go to court they better have an iron clad case.

Posted by Chris Snyder on 11-17-2017 09:46 PM:

What I Find Funny

I've been watching this topic for a while now and holding back. In my mind, Sam is the champ and it's time to move on. I'm personally glad that he won it as I believe in the x bred program and I know a ton of guys that are just waiting and hoping this goes against Sambo so they can say, "see, I told you so" and they can protect their ego's against the x bred threat to their manhood. LOL

With that said, I think it is hilarious how many people are acting like this is the first time any shady business has gone on at the world hunt.

Posted by HOBO on 11-17-2017 10:28 PM:

Are y'all STILL talking about this? Why don't you all wait till the ruling is made and then vent all your anger?

Once they do make a ruling one way or the other you all will have 10 pages of the same crap on here.

I think Hoosier was right when he told you all to GO HUNTING!!!!!

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Posted by Brian Gray on 11-18-2017 12:46 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by CedarTree50
If they take sams title they will be no world champion this year the other two dogs in the final round had minus points. Yes UKC has hurt mine and Sams reputation in ways people on this board will never understand no matter what their decision is. And yes UKC can be sued trust me on that one.

Your's and Sam's reputation is not hurt in my eye's so just know there is a few out here that beleave in ya. Maybe some of these big time breeders we have out here today should look a Sam's ped. and do a little home work, who ever made the cross that produced Sam must of new a little something someone else didn't know.

Posted by Rip on 11-18-2017 01:12 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by John D
Bottom line for me is I am "soured" on all of it. I feel a little bad for this Sambo dog since he thought he had it and now he thinks he may not. But if he keeps the title he will always be known as the dog that won it under questionable circumstances, and perhaps with a lawyer. If the title is awarded to the 2nd place dog, also perhaps with the help of a lawyer, then he'll be known as the first, 1st place loser to win the world hunt. If no dog is awarded the title, then why bother having a world hunt? I don't believe I'll ever look at the world hunt winner the same way but I'm not one of those who are all about the money and a win, no matter how its done.

Its no different than NFL players standing for the anthem. Even if the players start standing and appear to show respect, we now know a good number hate this country. My viewership of NFL is way down from what it used to be.

I have a little different take on this. If Sambo is awarded the title then it will be the dog that was CLEARED of wrong doing, he would be legit IMO.

If not then UKC's reputation is still good because they investigated this.

I think UKC will only help their reputation by an honest investigation as to be honest their reputation had been hurt in the past with possums and no real investigation or admitting things may or may not have been scored wrong.

The fact that they are actually investigating this actually makes me have a little more faith in the legitimacy of the title.

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Posted by 1912 on 11-18-2017 01:20 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by yadkintar
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wheres the link???

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Posted by Triple K Kennel on 11-18-2017 02:32 PM:

Suing .....

quote:
Originally posted by J I Allen
The trouble with suing someone or a company in civil court is if you lose the person or company you sued can ask the judge to reimburse them there legal fees. So when people go to court they better have an iron clad case.

Anyone can be Sued for just about anything you can think of. That's the Sad part, that's the first thing people start looking at when something doesn't go their way.
Let UKC do their work, if they find foul then deal with it and move on....!!
Tim

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Posted by Mark V. on 11-18-2017 02:34 PM:

I know no fact about this but i like that UKC is doing their job ( I wish it would have been done in the 1week time between the zones and the world) but the ARE doing their job! I DON'T care what kind of dog this is, it has NOTHING to do with the breed of dog its a coon hound in my eyes. I just want a fair outcome. IF something happend that should have not happend then it should be fixed. IF nothing happend then congrats. Sounds like there is 2 people and one God that realy knows the truth!!

Posted by Triple K Kennel on 11-18-2017 02:45 PM:

Exactly.....!!!

quote:
Originally posted by KevinP
So guide can take a tree call now? But gets slandered about the time? This agreeing to let guide get involved in first place never should've happened. Rules are rules. Guide takes you, judge judges, handler calls dog, easy.

I would like to know how this should be called...By UKC.
Can a Guide take a Call ?
Tim

Posted by Robert Johnson on 11-18-2017 03:04 PM:

Re: Exactly.....!!!

quote:
Originally posted by Triple K Kennel
I would like to know how this should be called...By UKC.
Can a Guide take a Call ?
Tim

NO, which should be obvious on the result of what happened on the cast.

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Posted by Robert Johnson on 11-18-2017 03:18 PM:

If it does not fit, you must aquit. It took almost two years to come to that conclusion.

Dave you are wrong in UKC not picking the officals. It was the world hunt, and UKC brings in or approves all who are involved in the hunt or show in anyway.

Fast Eddy, UKC can be sued, and has been, over a lot less than this.

I do agree that time is very important in decisions, and feet are dragging. That is the only real issue here. It is the time it takes to get a real and solid decision. Oh maybe I am wrong, but I like things resolved quickly, and to think something like a coon hunt can't get a decision made quickly, based on the testimony and rules of the KC is mind bogling at best.

Posted by Richard Lambert on 11-18-2017 03:19 PM:

"Guide" supposedly can't take a call or run a time...but...Can judge appoint/delegate or make the "guide" a "back-up judge" with the authority to take a call or run a time? Is the judge doing this when he sends the guide with 2 handlers to score a tree? Otherwise, why is the judge sending him? If the guide has no authority why is he going? All right MOH's, what is the answer?

Posted by Bruce m. Conkey on 11-18-2017 03:20 PM:

Guys we have created a monster. Here is whats happening at the hunts. We have our 4-20 dogs hunts that the only benefit is trying to make night champion or grand night out of dogs that are not of the best caliber. Most of the times these hunts are closer to 10 dogs than 20. You have judges trying to scratch handlers for the slightest mistake they make when it means nothing to the outcome of the hunt but they can apply some rule to it so it happens. Then we come on here and bash the one or two guys that know the rules when they try to help. They are JiM, Joey and Rip. Couple others or better good also.

Now we have pressured UKC into doing play by plays and posting up to the minute information of the larger hunts. Yes other kennel clubs do it. But they have a panel in the woods and there are a few judges or a guide that is sent with handlers on split trees. Handing split trees in major hunts is done completely different than in a 4 dog hunt as far as who goes where.

Allen is only ONE MAN and he does an outstanding job for UKC with yesterdays rules.

Like I said in an earlier post. Guys that hunt major hunts have melted the rules together and it works fine until we want to split hairs. Quit splitting hairs and get a coondog.

This board is so far from the reality of what goes on in a hunt and that its painful to see.

PKC can put 300 dogs a night in the woods early and the cast winners late for 4 nights. Then trim that down on the weekend and have very few problems. They put the cast breakdown and the scores of each cast early and winners late. If you want to complain go over there and they will send you packing.

Not comparing the two but UKC does the best it can. I think we should give them a break and some respect. A lot of new hunters cut their teeth on UKC hunts every year. We all talk about how the youth is important. Lets show it and support what UKC does without picking everything apart.

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Posted by Triple K Kennel on 11-18-2017 03:22 PM:

Re: Re: Exactly.....!!!

quote:
Originally posted by Robert Johnson
NO, which should be obvious on the result of what happened on the cast.

I didn't think so Rock, but it seems like most think the Cast can do whatever they want as long as they Vote on it......🤔
Thanks
Tim

Posted by Richard Lambert on 11-18-2017 03:30 PM:

If the judge's watch or time is the only time that matters then why does anyone else in the cast keep time? What if judge says the hunt is over but 3 cast members say there is 10 minutes left to hunt? What do you do? Can you question it and overrule the judge? What if 3 cast members say the 2 caught a dog but the judge says that it didn't. Can you question it and vote on it? What about it, MOH's? How would you rule if a cast came back with such a question.

Posted by Triple K Kennel on 11-18-2017 03:34 PM:

Time.....

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
If the judge's watch or time is the only time that matters then why does anyone else in the cast keep time? What if judge says the hunt is over but 3 cast members say there is 10 minutes left to hunt? What do you do? Can you question it and overrule the judge? What if 3 cast members say the 2 caught a dog but the judge says that it didn't. Can you question it and vote on it? What about it, MOH's? How would you rule if a cast came back with such a question.

I would think the Judges call will stand, and you can't over rule the Judge but only can question it ?
Let's hear some answers on this.....
Tim

Posted by Richard Lambert on 11-18-2017 03:43 PM:

Re: Re: Exactly.....!!!

quote:
Originally posted by Robert Johnson
NO, which should be obvious on the result of what happened on the cast.

Oh my goodness, I thought that was exactly what happened at the World Finals. Guide took a tree call from Sambo's handler when Judge was not there and allowed him to handle his dog. It was questioned and MOH allowed it to stand. Am I wrong?

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