UKC Forums - How often to shoot a coon

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-- How often to shoot a coon (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928531631)

Posted by yadkintar on 08-05-2020 02:05 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by JesseJ
Tar
I have my Oklahoma hunting license so when it cools off n season starts I'll come visit, I want to see all those honey holes! Stay safe n I'll be in touch. JesseJ

Let me know I will feed you fish.

Tar

Posted by DL NH on 08-05-2020 02:58 AM:

After reading all these responses I’m beginning to wonder how many times everybody had to shoot that deer, fox, coyote, bear, bobcat, house cat, polecat, fisher, porcupine, possum and your buddies dog before they ran one of them?

If the genetics are there they’ll do it. If it’s not, well then at best you’ve got a man made coon dog that will never be as good as the hound that became a coon dog one nanosecond after the sires sperm penetrated the dams egg.

We flatter ourselves when we believe our hounds do what they do because we’re such good and wise “trainers”. We train them to handle and what not to chase and or tree. The bird dog and retriever people are dog trainers. Us hound people are mostly “aiders and abetters.”

“No Brag, Just Fact”

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Posted by Jerry Moll on 08-05-2020 03:07 PM:

Re: How often to shoot a coon

quote:
Originally posted by gpent24
How often to shoot a coon?

Just once, most of the time!

Posted by novicane65 on 08-05-2020 03:19 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by DL NH
After reading all these responses I’m beginning to wonder how many times everybody had to shoot that deer, fox, coyote, bear, bobcat, house cat, polecat, fisher, porcupine, possum and your buddies dog before they ran one of them?

If the genetics are there they’ll do it. If it’s not, well then at best you’ve got a man made coon dog that will never be as good as the hound that became a coon dog one nanosecond after the sires sperm penetrated the dams egg.

We flatter ourselves when we believe our hounds do what they do because we’re such good and wise “trainers”. We train them to handle and what not to chase and or tree. The bird dog and retriever people are dog trainers. Us hound people are mostly “aiders and abetters.”

“No Brag, Just Fact”

So do you believe bird dogs don't trash? If a person wanted they can "train" a hound to handle just as good as a bird dog. You can teach a hound everything that gets taught to a bird dog. Heck you can teach most dogs to retrieve, I won't say all because some just won't. I had a pup about 4 years ago that I took along when training with my wife and her GWP. The pup was smart and eager to please. On his second trip (4 months old) to the training pond he started retrieving bumpers like he'd been doing it for awhile. Wish he would've lived longer but he got hit in the road at 7 or 8 months.

You'd be correct by saying most people do not "train" a hound to do much. Most try to train what not to do. Honestly most times our hounds do what they do in spite of all of our bad techniques. They do it because its genetics whether its hounds or bird dogs.

And bird dogs operate differently after having birds shot over them. Just like shooting coons to your dog does. If you pay attention you'll see the differences in them. Some dogs refuse to point a woodcock/Timber doodle after retrieving one. I've never seen a dog that cares much for retrieving one. Because the feathers are very light but oily and stick to everything including to the roof of the dogs mouth. But because your bird dog is (or should be) forced fetched it will pick the bird up and bring it back regardless of bird species.

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Posted by gpent24 on 08-05-2020 03:21 PM:

Re: Re: How often to shoot a coon

quote:
Originally posted by Jerry Moll
Just once, most of the time!

haha most of the time unless you get one of those terminator coons

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Posted by gpent24 on 08-05-2020 03:21 PM:

Re: Re: How often to shoot a coon

quote:
Originally posted by Jerry Moll
Just once, most of the time!

haha most of the time unless you get one of those terminator coons

__________________
601-916-2876

Posted by yadkintar on 08-05-2020 03:46 PM:

Re: Re: How often to shoot a coon

quote:
Originally posted by Jerry Moll
Just once, most of the time!

Bad when your eyes and ears go. You can’t see the sights as good and you can’t hear the kerthunk to know if you hit it lol.

Tar

Posted by DL NH on 08-05-2020 04:48 PM:

Mr. Depue,

Are you saying you can teach a coon hound how to run a track? How to accurately locate the right tree most of the time? How to drift a track and when to slow down and walk it out if that’s what’s required to get it up to a running track? How to cold trail a track up into a running track? Which way is the right way on track? There’s a whole lot more back tracking ending up in empty trees and dens than many realize or want to admit.

To be sure, there are some really good hound men/women that have skillfully trained there dogs to handle extremely well.

Bird dogs operate from several verbal/voice, hand and whistle commands. I think most would agree bird dog training is far more intense and complex than training hounds.

But..........I could be wrong!

__________________
Dan

Posted by novicane65 on 08-05-2020 05:45 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by DL NH
Mr. Depue,

Are you saying you can teach a coon hound how to run a track? How to accurately locate the right tree most of the time? How to drift a track and when to slow down and walk it out if that’s what’s required to get it up to a running track? How to cold trail a track up into a running track? Which way is the right way on track? There’s a whole lot more back tracking ending up in empty trees and dens than many realize or want to admit.

To be sure, there are some really good hound men/women that have skillfully trained there dogs to handle extremely well.

Bird dogs operate from several verbal/voice, hand and whistle commands. I think most would agree bird dog training is far more intense and complex than training hounds.

But..........I could be wrong!

No those are traits or skills that can be learned from experience.

Bird dogs also operate in sight of the handler 75% of the time. Honestly I don't think its harder to "train" a bird dog. All the things you listed you can't teach a bird dog either. You can't force train a bird dog on any of those things you listed in the hound section of your reply. You can teach them to leave old scent alone, same as a hound. You can't teach a bird dog how to track either, they do it or they don't. It's a natural ability in either type of dog. I do know what you're saying about the back tracking. And it happens in bird dogs too. The ones who say otherwise haven't been around many bird dogs then. You ever hear of a false point? Or a point with no bird to flush? It happens. Why is it some dogs can stick a point at 60 yards while others can't until they're within 20? Is it training or traits/skill set? Not all bird dogs are created equal, just like hounds. They all don't have the same skill set or traits. And yes bird dogs can operate on several different types of commands. But its not super common for 1 dog to be able to do all you listed. Some dogs naturally back a point, others you have to teach it to, some never will learn it. Some dogs you can't get steady to wing, others to the shot. Not all bird dogs can point either, some you have to teach them, others never learn nor inherited the trait.

The point I'm trying to make is you're trying to compare apples to oranges. Both are fruit but very different games, styles and types of dogs. Now if you compared beagles to coonhounds, or Running dogs to coonhounds then your comparing red apples to green apples.

I'll pm you. We're getting a little off on the original subject.

Posted by Josh Michaelis on 08-05-2020 06:55 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by DL NH
Mr. Depue,

Are you saying you can teach a coon hound how to run a track? How to accurately locate the right tree most of the time? How to drift a track and when to slow down and walk it out if that’s what’s required to get it up to a running track? How to cold trail a track up into a running track? Which way is the right way on track? There’s a whole lot more back tracking ending up in empty trees and dens than many realize or want to admit.

To be sure, there are some really good hound men/women that have skillfully trained there dogs to handle extremely well.

Bird dogs operate from several verbal/voice, hand and whistle commands. I think most would agree bird dog training is far more intense and complex than training hounds.

But..........I could be wrong!

Retriever and pointer training is not nearly as difficult or complex as training a coon hound.

__________________
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Posted by jdgher on 08-06-2020 03:20 AM:

Some dogs

Some dogs get lazy if you shoot a lot of coon, some dogs perform better work harder if shot a lot of coon, it depends on the dog. I had a GRNT CH female that was a winner as long as you didn't shoot coon out, so she ended up getting 1 coon a year. She would get tree happy and slick tree too often if I gave her coon (Most if not all, her mates were the same way, several NTCH's and some GRNT's from this cross). They were pretty accurate Redbones if you didn't shoot coon out.

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