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-- Tracking ability? (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928528699)

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Originally posted by yadkintar
Yes zeb 3 was a top reproducer and the only reason I missed it was because I am way older than you and I had a broke back, ankle and bad knees and couldn’t and wouldn’t follow a babbling ,bronkey, blow deep dog. And spend money my family needed to prove what ?



For some us the past is all we got. But we keep setting behind that table putting on hunts. so you can prove what a dog man really is.


Tar

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I know and I am not discrediting you but I owned the 2000 $$$ world champ go look at the play by play of how he operated I bought him after that and hunted him nearly every night after that. I trained grchgrntch yadkin tar deacon with him he was a double grandson of grntch yadkin tar rattler. That’s when I noticed the track speed that I am talking about and the deadly accuracy. Bozz was also a grandson of rattler and a lipper female. Deacon at a young age more times than not would destroy bozz on any kind of coon. Where I messed up I tried the stud dog route instead of the money hunts I regret that now.


Tar

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Originally posted by yadkintar
I would rather hear a dog start a bad track and get it jumped and push it to the tree than tree three pop ups but that’s just me.



Tar

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Mr Tar

That because you know it’s more fun carrying a good coonhound then a score card😉👍

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OLD TIMER

Re: Mr Tar

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Originally posted by OLD TIMER
That because you know it’s more fun carrying a good coonhound then a score card😉👍

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Brings back —-

Something Roy Blakesley said a long time ago, “you can teach a dog to tree but it’s a lot better if they do it naturally“.

I just talked with a well known coyote hunter this weekend (on the phone about 600 miles apart😂 who used to coon hunt who said he quit because they bred the tracking ability out and the hunts are won by the handler more then the hound. Then he said something that put a smile on my face in these trying times—“you should be breeding to the handler, not the dog!”

He does have a Limber Lost bred Black and Tan for old times that he lets train his puppies how to get though the woods and trail rabbits.

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OLD TIMER

Jacking a track back and forth 7 or 8 times 200 yards don’t mean they run that coon a mile.


Tar

It’s bred into them . Most dogs shouldn’t be bred at all . They win a little and they are stud dogs . Now that the economy is in the crapper maybe people will make a breeding because they need a pup for themselves knowing what they don’t keep they will have to give away . What I’ve seen is these wipeout 3some pups don’t seem to ever miss , Wheeler pups open in the box let them out and bam there’s Rocky these Houses Jay pups are money and just my experience Drum pups are accurate. I’m about to have 3 generations down from drum x stylish clover pups . We will see what happens ? There are a bunch of balanced lines Swamp Clover etc . The problem is not many cull anymore due to the investment.

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Coonhounds are hard to figure out at how well one produces. If not put in the right hands who knows what they will be. I've kept a whole litter before. Some where crazy some where shy some would never make a coondog and there's that 1 I kept that made a real hound. Me and my hunting buddy bought 2 litter mate pups a year ago on my request that we needed pups bred like they where. His has made a nice hound and he don't hunt as much as me. Mine on the other hand is a real live retard that needs a .22 in his head. Now if you ask my hunting buddy opinion he would like another one off that cross if you ask me I would give you a complete different opinion.

N Williams

Re read your reply.That's what we were talking about,TDB wouldn't have won or placed at all,because there was no re entry.He would have went home the first night.Just think,how many of us even know of a dog that win's five cast in a row with plus points, even in the small local hunts.

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Originally posted by N Williams
I’m not saying y’all were sissy’s. Thousand dallied Bill won the senior super stakes and the world. Both times he did it he won early 3 nights got beat late. Then won double cast thur night then won both hunts. Hunt all week all night long and still be standing. That’s a dog that’s still living and we’re talking about 3 hour hunts. Your problem tar is the best reproducer to ever lived died a few years ago. Your so hung up on the past you missed it. He produced 5 world champs. Love him or hate him don’t think one will ever do that again.

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Re: Tracking ability?

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Originally posted by yadkintar
What makes dogs have superior tracking ability over others.

Are they more intelligent ?


Tar

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Re: Re: Tracking ability?

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Originally posted by Charles Pullen
Young man it’s called “ Drive “ . Hounds that has lot of heart or drive will go hunting without a buddy and they will have the meat when parked . But if they don’t have the drive or desire then they will put it in park when things get tough . Then a lot of hard hunting . Years ago people didn’t have to decide which dog they was taking tonight. It was the only hound they had . So it got hunted . But I would say it’s more desire / drive to finish the tracks .

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Re: Re: Re: Tracking ability?

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Originally posted by yadkintar
Haven’t seen it in a long time but back in the day it was pretty common to see on a running track dogs that would start locating 50 yards before they got to the tree.


Tar

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Tracking ability?

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Originally posted by Charles Pullen
Don’t you remember when dogs would cross a river and have it . Now it’s a mud puddle and they loose the track . Use to be they would get in a middle of a cutover or clearcut and still here the meat . Now they get hung up on blow downs or laps . To me it’s Desire & Drive both that makes one more special and lot of solo hunting.

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Originally posted by oldsouth123
That's what we were talking about, he wouldn't have won or placed at all,because there was no re entrys.It don't matter how tough he is,he's got to win every cast with plus points against some of the best .The night he hunts alone, he has to hunt the whole three hours without minusing out and come in with PLUS POINTS

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Well we will see how that one coon a 2 hr cast stuff works with the new ukc rules.


And before anybody says well they treed more than that they just lost some of their points .......... OH REALLY !!!



Tar

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Originally posted by N Williams
Bottom line you got to win several cast in a row to win any major hunt. He had to win 5-6 to win both those. I know it’s been done but very few hounds go through stretches where they win 5-6 in a row against good competition. how many dogs have won 2 major hunts in there’s lifetime? I’m not against 3 hour hunts. It’s just a different time and if you had them now dogs would be scattered in different counties by the end of the hunt. It’s much easier to find a dog that can hunt alone and not draw minus than it is to find one that can tree coons and hold there points with dogs so y’all please don’t get started on that. Most cast now in major events all the dogs are hunting alone anyway.

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Mr. Pullen mentioned DRIVE. It starts there. Drive takes them on their mission of finding a coon. Drive can also get them into a lots of trouble if they don't have the tracking ability to take a colder track.

I am fortunate to have one now that has the drive/determination to find a coon. Day or night. I am fixing to start a couple pups in the early morning hours and I figured I needed a feeder bucket out. We are extremely dry down here and wanted to try and bunch a few coon up.

Couple days ago I went out in the afternoon to put a bucket out and decided to take a couple hounds, just to get them some exercise while I placed the bucket. Cut loose couple young ones and my older dog. He went through the timber and hit a DRY creek bed. He followed it till he found a mud spot in the creek. There he also found a coon. Now this is just after 3 in the afternoon with the temp. at 85*. Drive treed this coon.

https://youtu.be/ptKcma_UmTI

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Originally posted by yadkintar
I know and I am not discrediting you but I owned the 2000 $$$ world champ go look at the play by play of how he operated......
Tar

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Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Oh my goodness, that was 20 years ago. Have hounds changed any in the last 20 year's? How many years has it been since there was a Yadkin River line of dogs? How many years has it been since there was a Zeb 3 pup?

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Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Oh my goodness, that was 20 years ago. Have hounds changed any in the last 20 year's? How many years has it been since there was a Yadkin River line of dogs? How many years has it been since there was a Zeb 3 pup?

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Training dogs is not so much about quantity, it's more about timing, and the right situations...After that it's up to the dog....A hunting dog is born...

Reuben there was no plan B back in the day they get by with more today because when coons ain’t moving they get paid for it simple as that !!



Tar

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Originally posted by yadkintar
Reuben there was no plan B back in the day they get by with more today because when coons ain’t moving they get paid for it simple as that !!



Tar

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Originally posted by N Williams
I remember I went to a Rqe about 20 years ago. Drew out with a bunch of well know dogs in our area. I remember we treed a coon right out of the truck. Then everything started slick treeing like crazy. Problem was everyone’s dog started backing. I remember the first tree was about 200 yards from first coon we treed and slick as they come. Everyone started voting to circle. I said you’ve got to be kidding me. They circled about 5 trees that night that we’re slick and should have been minuses. Now days dought this would have happened. It was a ukc hunt and it wasn’t ukc fault. Those trees would have been judged differently if dogs were alone. Last dog I ran she was alone and I mean wouldn’t even be backed on 90% or better trees she made. Questionable trees always got minused. I most certainly believe dogs of today get judged more correctly. When there packing people seem to rule in favor of there dog.

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