UKC Forums - feeder buckets y/n

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-- feeder buckets y/n (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=319166)

Posted by Jay Bird 76 on 12-18-2009 06:55 PM:

Casey and Steve.....I totally agree. Have fun.

Posted by trackntreeman on 12-18-2009 09:47 PM:

good points

all you have good views on the subject . like i said before , i keep 4 bucket's out for pups , and i do guide hunts on them when asked to guide , so any dog has a fair chance as mine to score a coon cause i dont hunt my old dogs on a feeder on a regular basis . coon are some what thin in spots i hunt , but mostly its west virginia mountains that factor in to the hunting . but in the htx hunts like previously posted feeder's aren't allowed , so why not in the regular nite hunts . the htx program is great in my opinion , an should factor in to people's breeding programs . i just hate when people hunt the same feeder's night after night and they guide you , and their dog runs in and grabs the feeder tree and boom coon runs straight up , they take 225 , your dogs run a legitimate track and tree one , and thats all their dogs do all night cause they know were the feeders are and whats gonna happen .

Posted by Mike Poe on 12-19-2009 02:53 AM:

Ha ha ha

quote:
Originally posted by GA DAWG
Nothing in Indiana and other states up north.. A 2 legged poodle could tree a coon up there without a feeder

Yet 9 times out of 10 when those dogs from thin coon come up here to tree these easy coon in coon crazy indiana they still end up 2 and a half miles away and im treed in there 250yards why is that ?????? huh I wonder I seen guys run there mouth about bringin there dog up here for easy coon yet they still end up miles away.

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Posted by GA DAWG on 12-19-2009 05:22 AM:

Re: Ha ha ha

quote:
Originally posted by Jake poe
Yet 9 times out of 10 when those dogs from thin coon come up here to tree these easy coon in coon crazy indiana they still end up 2 and a half miles away and im treed in there 250yards why is that ?????? huh I wonder I seen guys run there mouth about bringin there dog up here for easy coon yet they still end up miles away.

Idiot dogs I recken..

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Posted by Jay Bird 76 on 12-19-2009 06:36 PM:

I noticed someone pointed out something that not many people realize........A dog hunted of buckets and handled correctly will be a VERY accurate dog if trained right. When there is a lot of smell and a few coons, it takes a good dog to figure them out.

Posted by Jonathan Crump on 12-19-2009 07:45 PM:

I know it takes more time to start a pup without a feeder (when you have a wife 3 kids a job and a life in general) but I have a 2 yr old I was about to give up on and he finally clicked 4 weeks ago (9 trips to woods 7 times treed and 5 coon I dont think the other 2 trees were slick they were just to big and shaggy to see into). The coon population is thin around here but we have been having above average sucess. Happy Hunting all

I got no problem with feeders. When I get older I'll probably hunt feeders to stay out of the hills as much as possible.

Posted by trackntreeman on 12-19-2009 10:33 PM:

top

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Posted by Matt Mays on 12-19-2009 11:52 PM:

pesonally i hate hunting feeder buckets because it seems like you get the same scenario over and over, hot to semi hot track and a quick tree... gets flat out boring after a while. i enjoy turning loose and not knowing what kind of track is out there and where the dogs will tree. as far as feeder bucket hunting and crop field hunting they are not similar, feeder bucket tracks are much easier.

however with that said... when i go to a nite hunt i expect to be hunting on feeder buckets or in very thick coon if there are multiple cast, just like everyone else that shows up i am there with intentions on winning, if every other cast is hunting feeders and ur not you are behind before u ever turn loose.... if ukc would go to cast winners getting a first place nitech win u would probably see a bunch of guides get away from feeder bucket hunting, and with time you would see a turn around in the caliber of dogs winning the hunts

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Posted by bluecole on 12-20-2009 04:58 AM:

buckets

I would think that if one group of men and women in a comp.hunt was turned in on a feeder bucket than all should be able too be dropped in on one as well.Kind of like don't do for one that you can't do for all.I believe that i am gonna get some for a timber that i hunt that used too be loaded with coon,and now they are scarce as hell,but then i do not hunt in competition hunts.

Posted by Rip on 12-20-2009 05:11 AM:

Re: coon not thick!!!!

quote:
Originally posted by vincentk
I have heard the coon not thick comment several times on here. I could be wrong but isn't that why a lot of people talk about wanting those great go yonder dogs? If they are that good and go yonder then there has gotta be at least three coon within a three mile radius that a dog can score on WITHOUT A BUCKET.

Course then you get what you wanted and you would have to walk to them.

I can tell you ain't hunted in what I would call thin coon. You can't score with the tracker so if they get out of hearing before getting struck the hunts over for the whole cast (happens often with thin coon and no buckets).

To answer your question, no many times there's not even 1 coon close enough to score on in a 1 or 2 hour hunt EVEN WITH BUCKETS when you are huntin in thin coon.

If there were that many coon around then they wouldn't need buckets. A bucket doesn't mean a hot race, heck it doesn't even mean a race at all in a place that has thin coon.

All buckets do is increase the chance that you will strike one within hearing and increase the chance that you can actually get a tree scored.

If coon are thin it doesn't mean a pop up race or an easy coon, it just means a chance to get after a coon. It still might be a cold track or might run a half a mile before goin up, or might go in the ground.

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Posted by Rip on 12-20-2009 07:06 AM:

Again, you are talking apples and oranges. The fact that you think turnin out at a bucket in a place with thin coon is "treein" tells me you haven't experienced hunting where coons are actually thin.

The World was right over the road here. We got coons comin out our ears here, never said any different. Plenty of coons here.

Not what folks from thick coon areas thought though. Not by a long shot. I heard alot of complaints about "no coon" (I attended and am a member of the host club), but again it's what you are used to. To me this area is just full of coon. Plenty of folks didn't think so though LOL. Matter of fact lots of posts on these very boards commented on how much more legit those scores were cause they were so low.

Of course I wasn't talking about here. I said "hunting in what I call thin coon". That's not close to here, that's back home where I grew up and where I hunted for years and years.

That's a place that I put a feeder bucket out to help train a pup back 10 years ago. It was on a large creek in 10 square miles or so of woods. It took several WEEKS to get one single solitary coon to using that feeder, and he only used it about every two or three nights. Yes you read that right, that bucket had only one coon usin it in all that land and he didn't use it regularly. Now that's thin coon.

And you didn't say "not one coon" in per square mile you said THAT A DOG COULD SCORE ON. You can't score if they are out of hearing when they strike, which is more often than not there without buckets.

In that area even with buckets it was not uncommon for dogs to be out of hearing before they struck. Buckets there only decreased the chances of you having a dead cast due to not hearing anything strike and finding everything in time out after you finally figgure out they have left the country.

Your arguement for "cold nights and having to hunt" holds no water because if they ain't comin to natural food they ain't comin to a bucket there.

In that area a good night on buckets the dogs would still have to hunt harder than a "bad" night in thick coon country. A 10 or 15 minute race is a "pop up" to us and those are rare. Even if there was a coon on the bucket it might be a cold track, but the coons are so thin there that buckets don't mean a strike. Been turned out on buckets plenty of times there with nary a bark and find the dogs treed a mile away over the next mountain a couple of hours later (which you can't score). Add in the fact that about half the coons there live in the ground (whole mountain is one big cave with holes in the ground for a coon to get into every little piece) and a body needs something to help make it a pleasureable hunt and be able to at least hear the race and possibly see a coon. It ain't nothin like "treein", believe me it's HUNTIN there and even with buckets the majority of the people from thick coon country that come down and experience it say they wouldn't hunt if that's all they had to hunt.

But as I said, unless you have experienced thin coon it would be hard for anyone to understand just like I don't understand what it takes to tree coons in places where the dogs have to swim from tailgait to tree on every drop.

Sure if you have enough coons to score one or two in a two hour hunt you don't need buckets. People have to remember though that there are places in the country that there ain't enough coons to score a tree in two hours without a buckets. Plenty of hunts won there with high scoring dog of the hunt having only scored on one coon and that's WITH buckets.

You can't judge what folks in one area do by how things are as you know them to be in your area.

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Posted by Okie Dawg on 12-20-2009 07:49 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Rip
Again, you are talking apples and oranges. The fact that you think turnin out at a bucket in a place with thin coon is "treein" tells me you haven't experienced hunting where coons are actually thin.

The World was right over the road here. We got coons comin out our ears here, never said any different. Plenty of coons here.

Not what folks from thick coon areas thought though. Not by a long shot. I heard alot of complaints about "no coon" (I attended and am a member of the host club), but again it's what you are used to. To me this area is just full of coon. Plenty of folks didn't think so though LOL. Matter of fact lots of posts on these very boards commented on how much more legit those scores were cause they were so low.

Of course I wasn't talking about here. I said "hunting in what I call thin coon". That's not close to here, that's back home where I grew up and where I hunted for years and years.

That's a place that I put a feeder bucket out to help train a pup back 10 years ago. It was on a large creek in 10 square miles or so of woods. It took several WEEKS to get one single solitary coon to using that feeder, and he only used it about every two or three nights. Yes you read that right, that bucket had only one coon usin it in all that land and he didn't use it regularly. Now that's thin coon.

And you didn't say "not one coon" in per square mile you said THAT A DOG COULD SCORE ON. You can't score if they are out of hearing when they strike, which is more often than not there without buckets.

In that area even with buckets it was not uncommon for dogs to be out of hearing before they struck. Buckets there only decreased the chances of you having a dead cast due to not hearing anything strike and finding everything in time out after you finally figgure out they have left the country.

Your arguement for "cold nights and having to hunt" holds no water because if they ain't comin to natural food they ain't comin to a bucket there.

In that area a good night on buckets the dogs would still have to hunt harder than a "bad" night in thick coon country. A 10 or 15 minute race is a "pop up" to us and those are rare. Even if there was a coon on the bucket it might be a cold track, but the coons are so thin there that buckets don't mean a strike. Been turned out on buckets plenty of times there with nary a bark and find the dogs treed a mile away over the next mountain a couple of hours later (which you can't score). Add in the fact that about half the coons there live in the ground (whole mountain is one big cave with holes in the ground for a coon to get into every little piece) and a body needs something to help make it a pleasureable hunt and be able to at least hear the race and possibly see a coon. It ain't nothin like "treein", believe me it's HUNTIN there and even with buckets the majority of the people from thick coon country that come down and experience it say they wouldn't hunt if that's all they had to hunt.

But as I said, unless you have experienced thin coon it would be hard for anyone to understand just like I don't understand what it takes to tree coons in places where the dogs have to swim from tailgait to tree on every drop.

Sure if you have enough coons to score one or two in a two hour hunt you don't need buckets. People have to remember though that there are places in the country that there ain't enough coons to score a tree in two hours without a buckets. Plenty of hunts won there with high scoring dog of the hunt having only scored on one coon and that's WITH buckets.

You can't judge what folks in one area do by how things are as you know them to be in your area.

Very well said. When it comes right down to it buckets ( like them or not) is something you can't stop ( no way no how). If you out lawed them it would be VERY EASY to hide them. Sourgum on a stump for example or on rocks. You won't see it but they will smell it for a long ways. Nothing is 100% fare but the closest thing to it is for all to use buckets and you will never even get that.
As far as a dog being work on them in thick coon after he is past the pup stage of needing them. I would agree it isn't much of a dog if you use buckets. The thin coon you have been talking about. I probubley wouldn't hunt either if that is all I had. LOL

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Posted by vampire on 12-20-2009 12:15 PM:

Feeder Buckets

I believe feeder buckets are fine for starting pups, and only if used sparingly. They are detrimental for all other applications, especially Nite hunts! I've seen way too many titled bucket dogs to suit me. That's one of the reasons I quit the night hunts. My dogs hunt " wild " coons not trained ones.

Posted by dogfaceNH on 12-20-2009 12:53 PM:

Here's an example of thin coon...

I've been trying to find good hunting spots closer to home to take the pup out for some exercise and tree and "easy" coon or at least have some hot scent to peak his interest without having to travel half way across the state. I put a bucket out filled with dogfood and dry coolaid mix 6 weeks ago. I also cut the bottom off of a peanut butter jar and hung it in a tree near the bucket figuring with that much odor any ringtail within 5 miles should be able to find it. I have moved it to different areas on different farms weekly because it has not been touched. Now that's thin coon!

Posted by SCRedboneran on 12-20-2009 01:48 PM:

feeders

i do not hunt feeders all week and i dont actually have feeder buckets. i just poor corn im the edge of water to sour.. feeders do not make u win a hunt. alot of dogds cannot tree a coon on a bucket because their is so much scent their that the will slick tree around the feed. a real dog will carry the track away and tree it...

Posted by Rip on 12-20-2009 02:06 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by dogfaceNH
Here's an example of thin coon...

I've been trying to find good hunting spots closer to home to take the pup out for some exercise and tree and "easy" coon or at least have some hot scent to peak his interest without having to travel half way across the state. I put a bucket out filled with dogfood and dry coolaid mix 6 weeks ago. I also cut the bottom off of a peanut butter jar and hung it in a tree near the bucket figuring with that much odor any ringtail within 5 miles should be able to find it. I have moved it to different areas on different farms weekly because it has not been touched. Now that's thin coon!

EXACTLY. Sounds like you have experience in that department LOL.

If you had enough coon to strike a track you wouldn't need to put out a feeder to train a pup. If you had enough to strike a track within hearin with old dogs you wouldn't need to put out a feeder. You don't have to be in the South to have thin coon. When your coon are that thin it works against you even puttin out a bucket cause what few coon you do have don't have a problem findin food. I never had any luck with any kind of feeder except a soured corn feeder. I have never had a coon take one piece of dog food to my knowledge. (Others did in their huntin spots but I never did, of course I only had one feeder that had a coon on it in my life).

When you do get a coon comin there it won't be a sure thing, or if it is they don't act like they do back home. I forgot to mention that I put out three more feeders for a total of four in different hunting spots of mine back then to help train my pup. That one is the only one that I managed to get a coon to using. The other three never got touched.

It did help to have that one though cause it was across the road from the house. I was able to go over there any night I wanted to and every two or three trips she could get on a track pretty close to me. She never treed it at the bucket either. That coon always ran good. That coon disappeared and I never put out another bucket in my life (but that was the last pup I trained too, got two more comin now and I will likely have to find a place to put out a bucket or two).

Where I am at now has a good coon population. Don't get me wrong a bucket is still nice for pups even here, but you can still strike a couple of coons within hearin without them here in a two hour nite hunt.

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Posted by trackntreeman on 12-20-2009 09:14 PM:

thanks to all

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Posted by T Felderman on 12-21-2009 02:01 AM:

I havent hunted south of Tennessee. So in my personal opinion using buckets anywhere north of Tennessee............................ No thank you. Dont care for em and that goes for training a pup also.

Posted by elvis on 12-21-2009 11:43 AM:

I dont see any difference in having buckets or not. Your gonna draw some good guides and some poor guides no matter what hunt you go to.
I prefer drawing a good one myself. And by good I mean one that will put me in enough coon to have a chance at winning the hunt.

I have never heard anyone bitch about too many coon unless they didnt draw to them.

As long as high score wins the hunt, the luck of the draw will be a major player, and you will have one happy cast and a bunch of others hollering unfair.

One thing to remember about feeders though, anytime you get your coon congregating at one spot, you will likely lose them all if one of them shows up carrying a disease.

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 12-21-2009 12:43 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by elvis
One thing to remember about feeders though, anytime you get your coon congregating at one spot, you will likely lose them all if one of them shows up carrying a disease.

Years and Years of Distemper really can hurt !!!!! Were having a Very Slow Recovery and still seeing a Infected Coon here and their.. Baiting Coon in Virginia is Illegal anyway ..

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Posted by GA DAWG on 12-21-2009 10:00 PM:

Cut loose last night..Dog went alone 1 mile..Turned and hunted back another mile..Not a bark..Dang sure wish I had a feeder filled up lol..Dont usually hunt em while the state land is open..When it closes I'll fill em up..If somebody wants to send me one of these real coondogs that can tree em here everynight within .5 mile of the truck without a feeder..I'll be more than happy to hunt it!!!!!!!!!!!

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Posted by Randy Tallon on 12-22-2009 12:15 AM:

I guess that puts to rest the reason why most of the big hunts are held in areas where there are coon. Why go to a hunt that 20 casts come in with 0 or minus and 2 casts come in with 400?? One of the reasons that Vince has a complaint about buckets is that in our area there is no reason for them. I have guided the local RQE for several years. NO BUCKETS, and came in with nothing lower than a 650. When you put buckets in areas up north with plenty of coon it turns into a horse race or 100 yd dash.....no hound work just slam, bang or you get treeing idiots like you describe and the whole hunt is screwed going to 3 blank trees every drop until the weak are weeded out. I will not condemn someone for guiding to buckets in poor coon population. What burns my backside is when a commoner like me drives miles and gets beat by a lesser dog in a different cast because someone with a pocketful of change PAYS his way.

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Posted by Okie Dawg on 12-22-2009 12:59 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Majestic Tree H
Years and Years of Distemper really can hurt !!!!! Were having a Very Slow Recovery and still seeing a Infected Coon here and their.. Baiting Coon in Virginia is Illegal anyway ..

You can allso medicate against some things if feeding them.

Posted by GA DAWG on 12-22-2009 01:14 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Okie Dawg
You can allso medicate against some things if feeding them.

Like what?

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Posted by GirlsHuntToo on 12-22-2009 01:28 AM:

my opinion is that feeders are good for training. if you have a young dog that you are working with, they help. i trained mine off of feeders. but when they got 12 months old, i took them down. i dont think that they should be used in ukc events for dogs OVER 12 months. If its a pup trial, yes, i think thats ok, but if the dog/s is/are 12 months or older, they are old enough to get out and hunt.

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