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-- It is not about the dogs anymore. (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928530160)

I have always felt like its kinda disappointing that it takes so long before technology can be used in the hunts. I don't own a thermal thing but I'm not against it. I wouldn't be against video of a coon in a hole off the phone.
Change is scary

quote:

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Originally posted by pamjohnson
I have always felt like its kinda disappointing that it takes so long before technology can be used in the hunts. I don't own a thermal thing but I'm not against it. I wouldn't be against video of a coon in a hole off the phone.
Change is scary

---

__________________
Cheyenne & Jennifer Cummings
Seneca , MO
(417)317-4815
"TEAM MAFIA"
*NATIONAL GRNITECH GRCH GRNITECH(5) HALL OF FAME PKC PLATIUM CH REDNECK BACKWOODS SHACK
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*PKC WORLD CHAMPION PLATNIUM CHAMPION GRNITECH SHACK'S HEATHER ISLAND SOUTHERN STOGIE
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RIP
*GRNITECH PKC SCH REDNECK MAFIA PKC HALL OF FAME REPRODUCER INDUCTED 2022
*GRNITECH CH PKC SILVER CH REDNECK SHACK ATTACK aka TAC 2018 OKLAHOMA STATE CHAMPION, 2020 MO PKC STATE LEADER

Jen Cummings

You got that right. No way would I even think of turning a dog loose without a tracking collar ( garmin), there is just so much peace of mind knowing where and what the dog is doing that I won't hunt without using one. I love technology and sure wished we had today's equipment when I was a younger hunter. Anyone who doesn't like today's equipment is just kidding themselves. Shucks, using equipment to locate coons should be legal, I don't buy the theory that every one can't afford them, unfair advantage idea. Not every one can afford a really good light, or a tracking system, or new truck, or any number of other things that give some hunters an advantage. We are always going to have some inequalities in life and hunting is no different. I can guarantee that if a piece of equipment could help in finding coons consistently and was legal to use in our hunts, that a lot of folks would find a way to own one. Fuss and cuss maybe, but would not get left out. Lol. Dave. P.S. Even in the dogs being hunted, some hunters can afford to buy a way better dog than others can afford, but no one sees this as being "unfair" or what about the he's a better dog trainer than me advantage. Lol

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

.

So equal of playing field anymore. IAM buying a monkey too now . He is trained to catch the coon in the tree or hole. Guy has one more forsale.. They where trained in Ohio .

__________________
Josh Henry 4026418571



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Sportsmanship
Drew a guy at pkc world hunt couple years ago. His dog was split treed if he had a coon he won. I sent him to go handle his dog. By the time we got to him his dog was on a sapling (slick) coon was sitting next tree over he could of easily moved the dog but didn't. I commend him for being honest his response was he wanted to win fairly. I don't think it happens as much as people think it does. I've had the privilege of hunting with some top notch sportsmen over the years that far out way the negative ones.

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Re: Jen Cummings

quote:

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Originally posted by Dave Richards
You got that right. No way would I even think of turning a dog loose without a tracking collar ( garmin), there is just so much peace of mind knowing where and what the dog is doing that I won't hunt without using one. I love technology and sure wished we had today's equipment when I was a younger hunter. Anyone who doesn't like today's equipment is just kidding themselves. Shucks, using equipment to locate coons should be legal, I don't buy the theory that every one can't afford them, unfair advantage idea. Not every one can afford a really good light, or a tracking system, or new truck, or any number of other things that give some hunters an advantage. We are always going to have some inequalities in life and hunting is no different. I can guarantee that if a piece of equipment could help in finding coons consistently and was legal to use in our hunts, that a lot of folks would find a way to own one. Fuss and cuss maybe, but would not get left out. Lol. Dave. P.S. Even in the dogs being hunted, some hunters can afford to buy a way better dog than others can afford, but no one sees this as being "unfair" or what about the he's a better dog trainer than me advantage. Lol

---

__________________
Cheyenne & Jennifer Cummings
Seneca , MO
(417)317-4815
"TEAM MAFIA"
*NATIONAL GRNITECH GRCH GRNITECH(5) HALL OF FAME PKC PLATIUM CH REDNECK BACKWOODS SHACK
2014 OK STATE CH, 2015 MO PKC LEADER, 2016 PKC NATIONALS SEMIFINALIST, 2016 UKC TOP 20, 2O17 UKC WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 3RD PLACE, 2018 PKC SENIOR SHOWDOWN TRUCK HUNT FINAL 4, 2018 MO PKC STATE CHAMPION, 2019 AUTUMN OAKS NATIONAL GRNITE CH, 2019 PKC WORLD CH SEMIFINALIST. 2021 PKC SENIOR SHOWDOWN TRUCK HUNT FINAL 4.
*PKC WORLD CHAMPION PLATNIUM CHAMPION GRNITECH SHACK'S HEATHER ISLAND SOUTHERN STOGIE
2021 OKLAHOMA STATE CHAMPION, 2022 PKC WORLD CHAMPION, 2022 MO PKC STATE LEADER PRO SPORT TRUCK WINNER, 2025 MO PKC STATE CHAMPION

RIP
*GRNITECH PKC SCH REDNECK MAFIA PKC HALL OF FAME REPRODUCER INDUCTED 2022
*GRNITECH CH PKC SILVER CH REDNECK SHACK ATTACK aka TAC 2018 OKLAHOMA STATE CHAMPION, 2020 MO PKC STATE LEADER

Re: Re: It is not about the dogs anymore.

quote:

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Originally posted by Robert Johnson
hard to believe them guys are allowing the use of the Flir. Cap that off with going to trees alone and you have the makings for some very serious cheating. I love it. The place to be is becoming a playground for crooks. Washington DC will likely recruit a few of them.

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Don't try to confuse us with logic.

quote:

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Originally posted by yadkintar
Most of the dogs I handled didn’t need a slick handler they just got some age on them and the big doggies of that time period sold them.


They was a lot more advanced than ole blue out there snorken around Under leafs and twigs tryen to move that 4 hour old track lol.


I knew my dog and after the first 30 minutes I knew yours too !!


Tarbaby

---

__________________
Home of:
A couple blue haired potlickers

Gone but not forgotten:
Nt Ch Fanny's Midnite Blue Annie - aka Sodie Pop R.I.P. - I will miss you old girl

Nt Ch Becky’s Midnite Blue Hank - R.I.P. Old Boy, thank you for the memories

Gr Nt Ch S&E's Midnite Lite Blue Snow (Co-Owned with my good friend Harry Eidenier) - We had a blast following you ole girl!

Mr. Lambert

Lol. I was just mentioning a few things that should be obvious to all folks, but do not seem to be as controversial. We all play the cards we are dealt, sometimes we just have a better hand than the other guy. From the price or quality of the dogs we hunt, the equipment we have, the access to hunting grounds, there are many inequities that ALL of us have to deal with in competition hunts or just in life. Banning a piece of equipment based on the inability of everyone to possess does not make any more sense than putting a price limit on the dog they can hunt, or even yet saying a better dog trainer is an unfair advantage for certain handlers. When Garmin first stared getting used in the hunts, there were a lot of handlers that could not afford them and did not have them, but today every one has tracking collars and for the ones that don't someone will let them use one. It would eventually be that way with any piece of equipment. What about hip boots that one handler has on and can get to his dog treed and another handler has only regular boots and don't want to get wet, no one would think this was unfair, after all it's only boots, isn't it? Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

quote:

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Originally posted by Vic Stoll
Still crawfishing I see, answer the question tarbaby. Truth has a little sting doesn’t it?

Alice is the safe bet tarbaby, even when she’s 10 feet tall. She’ll always believe you. 😂😂

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.

T Felderman wrote: Believe it or not but there are still some honest people that hunt the hunts.

Thanks Mr. Felderman, as this is very true. I think we have 3 classifications of people. The honest man, the man out there trying to do the right thing but doesn't know the rules or understand dogs and the man out to cheat you. Fortunately the out and out cheater is in the lesser category. The man that doesn't know the rules make many think there are a lot more cheaters out there, when they are just confused handlers.

I am saddened not by the cheaters these days. But the younger man getting into the sport. It use to be a Family Tradition or your Heritage, or just the call of the wild in you soul. Now, the younger generation seems to view coonhunting as a sport or game that has lessoned the value of a true hound and substituted it for a sometimes hound. I am not trying to offend any of the younger hunters as you are the future. It has to be about the hound first and the appreciation and respect a person has for a good hound. If it isn't anytime the winds of your life blow in a different direction. Your dog pen is empty and when the wind changes your looking for another hound. Which is usually someone else's cull.

Tar played the game back when he was young at a higher level than many of us ever will. Tar understands the truth about being dishonest, even though he doesn't practice what he did in the past. (His own Words) It is there to haunt him. In this sport when you get old and we all do, we all loose a step, our hearing, our balance. We hang on to the past and the bad haunts us but the goods moves us forward. Easier to blame the past on why you are not the same in the hunts as just realizing your body is not the same. Then playing the game at whatever level you can. Being a positive influence on the future of coon hunting with whatever tools you have.

__________________
www.ConkeysOutdoors.com
"Boss Lights"

Well said

Was it ever just about the dogs? I was under the impression all this time it was about the team. All pluses and minus are not just dependent upon the dog doing his job but the handler doing his also. The cheating part has been around as long as the game but isn't nearly as prevalent as some believe.

__________________
Cheyenne & Jennifer Cummings
Seneca , MO
(417)317-4815
"TEAM MAFIA"
*NATIONAL GRNITECH GRCH GRNITECH(5) HALL OF FAME PKC PLATIUM CH REDNECK BACKWOODS SHACK
2014 OK STATE CH, 2015 MO PKC LEADER, 2016 PKC NATIONALS SEMIFINALIST, 2016 UKC TOP 20, 2O17 UKC WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 3RD PLACE, 2018 PKC SENIOR SHOWDOWN TRUCK HUNT FINAL 4, 2018 MO PKC STATE CHAMPION, 2019 AUTUMN OAKS NATIONAL GRNITE CH, 2019 PKC WORLD CH SEMIFINALIST. 2021 PKC SENIOR SHOWDOWN TRUCK HUNT FINAL 4.
*PKC WORLD CHAMPION PLATNIUM CHAMPION GRNITECH SHACK'S HEATHER ISLAND SOUTHERN STOGIE
2021 OKLAHOMA STATE CHAMPION, 2022 PKC WORLD CHAMPION, 2022 MO PKC STATE LEADER PRO SPORT TRUCK WINNER, 2025 MO PKC STATE CHAMPION

RIP
*GRNITECH PKC SCH REDNECK MAFIA PKC HALL OF FAME REPRODUCER INDUCTED 2022
*GRNITECH CH PKC SILVER CH REDNECK SHACK ATTACK aka TAC 2018 OKLAHOMA STATE CHAMPION, 2020 MO PKC STATE LEADER

quote:

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Originally posted by pamjohnson
Well said

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__________________
Training dogs is not so much about quantity, it's more about timing, and the right situations...After that it's up to the dog....A hunting dog is born...

Has anyone ever known of any competition event (not just competition coon hunts) where cheaters weren’t present in some shape or manner?

We can “pine away” for it but it’ll never come about this side of Glory.

__________________
Dan

Re: .

quote:

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Originally posted by Bruce m. Conkey
T Felderman wrote: Believe it or not but there are still some honest people that hunt the hunts.

Thanks Mr. Felderman, as this is very true. I think we have 3 classifications of people. The honest man, the man out there trying to do the right thing but doesn't know the rules or understand dogs and the man out to cheat you. Fortunately the out and out cheater is in the lesser category. The man that doesn't know the rules make many think there are a lot more cheaters out there, when they are just confused handlers.

I am saddened not by the cheaters these days. But the younger man getting into the sport. It use to be a Family Tradition or your Heritage, or just the call of the wild in you soul. Now, the younger generation seems to view coonhunting as a sport or game that has lessoned the value of a true hound and substituted it for a sometimes hound. I am not trying to offend any of the younger hunters as you are the future. It has to be about the hound first and the appreciation and respect a person has for a good hound. If it isn't anytime the winds of your life blow in a different direction. Your dog pen is empty and when the wind changes your looking for another hound. Which is usually someone else's cull.

Tar played the game back when he was young at a higher level than many of us ever will. Tar understands the truth about being dishonest, even though he doesn't practice what he did in the past. (His own Words) It is there to haunt him. In this sport when you get old and we all do, we all loose a step, our hearing, our balance. We hang on to the past and the bad haunts us but the goods moves us forward. Easier to blame the past on why you are not the same in the hunts as just realizing your body is not the same. Then playing the game at whatever level you can. Being a positive influence on the future of coon hunting with whatever tools you have.

---

.

Tar they say actions speak louder than words. What you do for clubs and others is a very good thing. Sometimes your words trip you up. Keep up the good work helping others.

__________________
www.ConkeysOutdoors.com
"Boss Lights"

Bruce, Tar, and Others

Coon hunting as we knew it in our younger days certainly has changed, most thing do change over time. Holding younger hunters to a perceived standard that us older hunters have of the sport of coon hunting is NOT a valid conception. Yes, many younger hunters come and go in the sport as their interest change, but that is just the way they operate, it's neither right nor wrong. Many of us older hunters did not have as many interest as these younger hunters have today. We CAN NOT impose our ideas of what is best for other hunters, while our ideas may work for us, they may not work for others. Tar was not caught cheating in the hunts, but he was Man enough to admit he cheated some in his younger days, while under pressure to get hunting another mans dogs. Tar did not have to admit to anything, but he choose to tell the truth, something Many others choose not to do for fear of branding themselves as a cheater. I suspect many that would point to Tars misdeeds have been guilty of the same things. Check the plank in your own eye before looking for the speck in others eyes. Don't judge younger hunters by your standards and think you are correct. Coon hunting is up to every individual to pursue as they see fit. Coon hunting has always had a dukes mixture of folks in this sport, hide hunters, competition hunters, and everything in between. Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

Re: .

quote:

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Originally posted by Bruce m. Conkey
Tar they say actions speak louder than words. What you do for clubs and others is a very good thing. Sometimes your words trip you up. Keep up the good work helping others.

---

quote:

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Originally posted by yadkintar
Vic you ever circled a slick tree ? In the past I have if that’s what you want to know. if you have your just as guilty. Thing is I admitted it multiple times on here your just old and forgetful lol.

But I love you anyways just the way you are.

Tarbaby

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quote:

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Originally posted by Richard Lambert
...."It is not all about the dogs anymore"...

Oh my goodness, I can't believe that Tarbaby has the nerve to make such a statement. Was it all about the dogs when you were younger, had a money man and traveled the country as a paid handler? Was it ever all about the dogs?

---

__________________
Home of:
A couple blue haired potlickers

Gone but not forgotten:
Nt Ch Fanny's Midnite Blue Annie - aka Sodie Pop R.I.P. - I will miss you old girl

Nt Ch Becky’s Midnite Blue Hank - R.I.P. Old Boy, thank you for the memories

Gr Nt Ch S&E's Midnite Lite Blue Snow (Co-Owned with my good friend Harry Eidenier) - We had a blast following you ole girl!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Vic Stoll
tarbaby, I pasted Richards question on here for you again, you know, the one you refuse to acknowledge & continue your Ostrich syndrome with? Not at all about "I may have been a little shady before, but fessed up & it's OK now".

You know it & I know it, you were part of & did the EXACT SAME THING you're whining about with this post. Different tools, means, & era, but the same thing.

Why is it so bad with this generation & the tools now? Just as bad back then, was it not?

Since you are a self proclaimed expert, I struggle to think that you aren't aware of this? You know it all already, why bring up a pointless concern?

The good far outweighs the bad, your a self proclaimed part of the good now, right?

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Re: Jen Cummings

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dave Richards
You got that right. No way would I even think of turning a dog loose without a tracking collar ( garmin), there is just so much peace of mind knowing where and what the dog is doing that I won't hunt without using one. I love technology and sure wished we had today's equipment when I was a younger hunter. Anyone who doesn't like today's equipment is just kidding themselves. Shucks, using equipment to locate coons should be legal, I don't buy the theory that every one can't afford them, unfair advantage idea. Not every one can afford a really good light, or a tracking system, or new truck, or any number of other things that give some hunters an advantage. We are always going to have some inequalities in life and hunting is no different. I can guarantee that if a piece of equipment could help in finding coons consistently and was legal to use in our hunts, that a lot of folks would find a way to own one. Fuss and cuss maybe, but would not get left out. Lol. Dave. P.S. Even in the dogs being hunted, some hunters can afford to buy a way better dog than others can afford, but no one sees this as being "unfair" or what about the he's a better dog trainer than me advantage. Lol

---

Change

Tar may not be as articulate with words as some folks, I think what he was trying to get across in this thread was that the hunts have become more complex with the available technology today it will be easier to cheat in a hunt when big money is on the line. Yes, cheaters have been around since the start of competition hunts, but advanced technology does indeed improve a cheaters opportunity to cheat. Anyone that doubts that has their head in the sand. Sadly, Tar is correct in saying it's no longer about the dogs, maybe it never was in some folks eyes. Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

I will just say this I found a many of coon with a two cell flashlight when I started hunting. Even with the flir you still have to show the cast the coon with just their lights. Hear is the part I don’t like if you let a handler go to his dog alone he can look around for either his coon or one near by and the cast will not know it.


If he was seen shining around with his light he would be scratched. As the dogs are all split up nowadays it will be to big of temptation. And it will not be an even playing field for all.



Tar