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-- 1st strike-1st tree dog (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928522008)

This stuff is funny to me. You are kidding yourself thinking this is going to change everything for the better. Everyone has seen the dog that covers if it’s remotely in the area. That guy that owns it will still pitch his in when he figures out your sure enough coontreeing machine. A good cover dog will not need three minutes. Heck if there is one in the area And a man knew the dog was more than likely was going to back yours but was 50/50 on it Whats to keep him waiting till the two is gone and pitch him in for 25 ,if he is not there He has lost almost nothing . These are usually the first strike type of dogs to boot that later may tree his own. Fact is if you are hunting a nice dog you probably going to win most your casts. If you get beat by the type that covers and gets some of yours and trees his own that’s the way it goes sure we have all been there . So I’m sure you’ll be happy they changed the rule to better suit your independent dog. But like I mentioned above a good handler will find a way to give himself a chance. The ones I feel sorry for is the guys that enter knowing they probably won’t win but want to hunt some new places meet some other hunters that will probably minus out fairly quick and eventually stop coming. The only rule change I do not like is the next available after tree is closed. Makes no sense to me what so ever.

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Tom Lynch
317-514-1514
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GRNTCh Lynch’s LIL BLU MAC (Walston’s Big Country x Hatcreek Kate 2)

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Originally posted by Sgraves
...... You don’t see a man that races horses bring a plow horse to a race do you.Its just that simple. Rules we have before us are simple . If you work hard good things will come your way.....

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Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Oh my goodness, men started out racing their plow horses. But then some rich guys started breeding and training a couple of horses just for racing while keeping their others for plowing. The rich guys starting setting rules for their races. First there were quarter mile races but then the rich guys set the distance longer to put those cow horse at a disadvantage. And they also had claiming races to keep the ringers out. If you want to start a real fight, get a bunch of walking, gaited, racking, quarter horse guys together and ask them who has the "best" horse.

Now don't get me started on automobiles. Henry Ford once said that the first.car race was 5 minutes after the 2nd Ford rolled off of the assembly line. Look at what that has led to. How many race car drivers drive their race car back and forth to work. NASCAR started out with "stock cars". They still call them that but they are nowhere near "stock". This is thanks to multiple rule changes through the years. They have completely eliminated the common man. Is this where the sport of coonhunting is headed?
Maybe we need a dirt track circuit or some claiming races.

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__________________
Eric DePue
Hill Country Kennels Itty-Bitty
PKC CH Wax's Late Night Boom
And
Partners on a few common trashy young dogs

Gone but not forgotten

GrNtCh, PKC Ch Hillbilly Bildo
Pr Broken Oaks Wild Blue Gypsy

No Richard, no one has eliminated the common man. Men living in the past or to hard headed to change their ways maybe. If you choose not to drive a station wagon , why drive it. That simple.

Richard am gonna give you a hard time because I know you are really a good guy. This song reminds me of you. Forgive me I can’t help myself. Here goes. He’s an ole hippie that don’t know what to do, should he hang on to the old or grab on to the new. Am sure you know the rest. Couldn’t help myself. Haven’t met you but you just seem like a good guy. Have to be when you start out everything with oh my goodness.

Well it seems like these changes maybe a good thing , lets wait and see what is finalized and how it is implemented into action. That will tell the tale for sure. UKC should just stick to the plan no matter what since the coon hunters chose the cup they wanted to drink out of and lets see how well it does for a year or 2. No human plan of action is ever perfect , and we are talking about dogs not gods.

__________________
The more laws a nation has the more corrupt the nation.

When the law of the land becomes unjust outlaws will rise to take their place in history.

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Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Oh my goodness, men started out racing their plow horses. But then some rich guys started breeding and training a couple of horses just for racing while keeping their others for plowing. The rich guys starting setting rules for their races. First there were quarter mile races but then the rich guys set the distance longer to put those cow horse at a disadvantage. And they also had claiming races to keep the ringers out. If you want to start a real fight, get a bunch of walking, gaited, racking, quarter horse guys together and ask them who has the "best" horse.

Now don't get me started on automobiles. Henry Ford once said that the first.car race was 5 minutes after the 2nd Ford rolled off of the assembly line. Look at what that has led to. How many race car drivers drive their race car back and forth to work. NASCAR started out with "stock cars". They still call them that but they are nowhere near "stock". This is thanks to multiple rule changes through the years. They have completely eliminated the common man. Is this where the sport of coonhunting is headed?
Maybe we need a dirt track circuit or some claiming races.

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__________________
Eric DePue
Hill Country Kennels Itty-Bitty
PKC CH Wax's Late Night Boom
And
Partners on a few common trashy young dogs

Gone but not forgotten

GrNtCh, PKC Ch Hillbilly Bildo
Pr Broken Oaks Wild Blue Gypsy

1st and 1st

Hunted in the 70's (in my teens then). I remember well drawing the Hammer bred dogs that would babble. If I drew one of them, they got 1st strike. If I drew 2 of them, they got 1st and 2nd strike.

In 1981 (I believe I have the year correct), they jumped 1st tree to 125. I loved that. Having always hunted dogs that leaned toward the tighter side, this was great. A good tighter mouthed dog should typically tree ahead of the open dog. Simple fact. I'm speaking from personal experience, not about hypothetical situations.

If you turn a cast of dogs loose, ONLY ONE OF THEM CAN STRIKE FIRST. Why not award it with more points than those that didn't strike first? To me, that's a dog that should rewarded with more points than the others. Not one that should be neutralized through rules to eliminate the advantage of an honest 1st strike dog.

If you turn a cast of dogs loose, ONLY ONE OF THEM CAN TREE FIRST. Why not award it with more points than those that didn't tree first? To me, that's a dog that should be rewarded with more points than the others (assuming they have the meat). Not one that should be neutralized through rules (including split tree rules) to eliminate the advantage of an honest 1st tree dog. Where else can you have 2, 3, or 4 contestants and they all get 1st place??? I know, it's great if you are 2nd, 3rd, or 4th. But, regardless of what anyone says, it's not fair to the one that's actually 1st!!!

To me, BETTER, QUICKER, FASTER (Accuracy Demanded) is something we should be STRIVING FOR, not something we should be fighting against (by making rules to neutralize or penalize them).

BETTER, QUICKER, FASTER should not be the enemy, IT SHOULD BE THE GOAL!!!

Mr. Lambert

You are wearing yourself out with all this rule change scenarios. Let's just wait and see how things play out, shucks, you just might like them. Like them or not, they are coming and when they do we will have a choice play or stay home. Most of us have played for many years under rules that we did not like, there will never be a set of rules that everyone likes. The way I see it is if you play by the same rules as I do, why should one of us complain? Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

Re: 1st and 1st

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Originally posted by honalieh
Hunted in the 70's (in my teens then). I remember well drawing the Hammer bred dogs that would babble. If I drew one of them, they got 1st strike. If I drew 2 of them, they got 1st and 2nd strike.

In 1981 (I believe I have the year correct), they jumped 1st tree to 125. I loved that. Having always hunted dogs that leaned toward the tighter side, this was great. A good tighter mouthed dog should typically tree ahead of the open dog. Simple fact. I'm speaking from personal experience, not about hypothetical situations.

If you turn a cast of dogs loose, ONLY ONE OF THEM CAN STRIKE FIRST. Why not award it with more points than those that didn't strike first? To me, that's a dog that should rewarded with more points than the others. Not one that should be neutralized through rules to eliminate the advantage of an honest 1st strike dog. Fella , not trying to be a smart a$$ , but you to smart for your own good. You making a mountain out of a mole hill.

If you turn a cast of dogs loose, ONLY ONE OF THEM CAN TREE FIRST. Why not award it with more points than those that didn't tree first? To me, that's a dog that should be rewarded with more points than the others (assuming they have the meat). Not one that should be neutralized through rules (including split tree rules) to eliminate the advantage of an honest 1st tree dog. Where else can you have 2, 3, or 4 contestants and they all get 1st place??? I know, it's great if you are 2nd, 3rd, or 4th. But, regardless of what anyone says, it's not fair to the one that's actually 1st!!!

To me, BETTER, QUICKER, FASTER (Accuracy Demanded) is something we should be STRIVING FOR, not something we should be fighting against (by making rules to neutralize or penalize them).

BETTER, QUICKER, FASTER should not be the enemy, IT SHOULD BE THE GOAL!!!

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Honalieh , not trying to be a smart a$$, but you are to smart for your own good. You making a mountain out of a mole hill.

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Originally posted by novicane65
OH MY GOODNESS....... Figured I'd let you know your analogy was a bit off.

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richard

i like your idea for a real coon hunt and i live in the same area as you do so when you want to have that coon hunt let me know where and what the entry is and i'll be glad to compete!!!!!!

i say if a dog trees an obvious slick,it and every dog on that tree are done for the nite.

Oh my goodness Marv, that is a rule that would really change hounds. Scratch dogs for slick trees.

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Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Oh my goodness Marv, that is a rule that would really change hounds. Scratch dogs for slick trees.

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There already are.

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Originally posted by Richard Lambert
There already are.

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Ukc did a good job on rules changes. I don't think anyone with a somewhat independent dog, that's tight mouthed or opened mouth, that can tree a coon with no help is complaining about the new comp rules at all. That is what we are looking for isn't it? Dogs that when you cut loose are going to get treed under a coon no matter what else is going on?

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Originally posted by elvis
i say if a dog trees an obvious slick,it and every dog on that tree are done for the nite.

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__________________
Donald Bergeron