UKC Forums - Increasing Performance point payouts

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UKC Forums (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/index.php)
- UKC Coonhounds (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=4)
-- Increasing Performance point payouts (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928485864)

Posted by H.W. Moore on 07-17-2017 04:58 PM:

Has anyone on here noticed the price of pups are about the same as 20 years ago? Anyone hear of any clubs in distress or closed? Anybody made a nite champ or grand night simply by winning their cast? A lot of the younger generation don't hunt UKC because there's not a significant payout or prestige. Triple the point value & bring up attendance at a very minimal cost to everyone and make it more appealing.

Posted by Bruce m. Conkey on 07-17-2017 05:20 PM:

Joey, that is what I was told. I think a lot of people might be missing the boat and not getting their pups in because of the confusion on getting one permanently nominated. I know the guys running things think it is easy. But the guys I have been helping are confused.

I had one guy select the $10 box for a easy entry HOLDER thinking it was the easy entry card. I had two guys waning to get the PERFORMANCE Pedigree because they thought that was permanently putting the pup in the program.

I say on the back of the papers just put a check box on the pups papers that have been nominated for the $30 or if I remember correctly at one time I got an orange or red paper in with the papers for the Performance Program. I just think a lot of people ain't getting it done on time or not at all.

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Posted by joey on 07-17-2017 05:30 PM:

I have not registered one in a long time but if there is not a place on the papers to permanently register the pup that is a MAJOR FAIL! Surly that is not right? If it is there is no telling how much money has been missed out on.

You could be right Mr. Moore and I see a few things that could help. Right now UKC has a system in place that is causing them to loose costumers at their local hunts. If you are successful at it you only get to play for 8 wins and your done. I think that along with the PP should be looked into pretty hard.

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Posted by Robert Johnson on 07-17-2017 06:00 PM:

[

Somtimes I have to take money out of my pocket to put on the hunt.

That's every hunt down here where I am. Trophies for the bench show is the biggest reason. But them trophies help draw a few, so we give'em.

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Posted by groworg1 on 07-17-2017 06:53 PM:

think about this ! this idea gets about as much traction as mine about giving one more place then total number of cast even at only 10 points for non cast winner towards nite champion ! by that i mean 3 cast hunt. up to 4 places awarded. all must have plus points. i remember when a 140 dogs hunted and 9th and 10th places went to non cast winners ! think about that 60 cast and only 8 casts came in with plus points. somebody give me one good reason why this wouldn't keep guys coming back ? pp instead of increasing dollars per point by added fee's if more dogs showed up the total number of points awarded would go up making those wins worth more !

Posted by joey on 07-17-2017 07:10 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by groworg1
think about this ! this idea gets about as much traction as mine about giving one more place then total number of cast even at only 10 points for non cast winner towards nite champion ! by that i mean 3 cast hunt. up to 4 places awarded. all must have plus points. i remember when a 140 dogs hunted and 9th and 10th places went to non cast winners ! think about that 60 cast and only 8 casts came in with plus points. somebody give me one good reason why this wouldn't keep guys coming back ? pp instead of increasing dollars per point by added fee's if more dogs showed up the total number of points awarded would go up making those wins worth more !

People not winning is not the reason they are not coming. They already think titles are cheap and in my opinion that would cheapen them even more.

Posted by H.W. Moore on 07-17-2017 07:21 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Robert Johnson

That's every hunt down here where I am. Trophies for the bench show is the biggest reason. But them trophies help draw a few, so we give'em.

I haven't been to a club that still gives trophies in years. I donated a dozen trophies to a club starting out a few years ago & they only held 2 hunts before going under..

Posted by Pat Bizich on 07-17-2017 08:51 PM:

Re: .

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bruce m. Conkey
[B]I am not sure UKC is interested in the performance program.
I have several people that ask me questions when they are registering their pups. Several people in the past month had their paper work filled out and did not know that they had to put a note and send in an extra $30 for to get their pup in the program.

How hard could it be to put a place on the back of the Registration form to put and x and send in $30 or $100 dollars if your between 6 months and one year.
Still haven't found the form.
I wonder how many people register performance pups thinking they are in the performance program only to find out they are not, because they didn't send extra money. I know most people won't send in a $100 if they miss it the first time.
QUOTE]

I 100 % AGREE!!!
THIS IS ABSOLUTELY CRAZY !!!

It is bad enough they are not putting the little blue permanent application in with the litters for each pup.

HOW HARD IS IT TO PUT THE APPLICATION ON THE WEB SITE SO WE CAN AT LEAST COPY IT !!!!!

To me this is "ONE BIG MAJOR ERROR!!."

For that matter how is anyone unfamiliar with the process supposed to"MIND READ" the cost and that they have to send in a "NOTE"with the application for performance ???

"THE SITE SAYS APPLICATION IS NOT AVAILABLE."

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Posted by Bruce m. Conkey on 07-17-2017 10:30 PM:

Pat thank goodness you know what i am talking about. I thought i was going crazy. I know this month there were 4 guys i had to tell to write a note and add 30 bucks. Has to be a bunch of people missing this.

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Posted by Allen / UKC on 07-17-2017 10:32 PM:

The form in question is available on the website.

https://www.ukcdogs.com/docs/huntin...nce-program.pdf

Posted by yadkintar on 07-17-2017 10:37 PM:

Joey I hope you understand what I am fixing to say I was ukc when there was nothing else. I got guys that drive 80 plus miles to come to our hunt because there is no where else closer you get Allen to pull up the hunts in Texas and Oklahoma any given weekend you will find out we are not over saturated they just have very few clubs to go to members have stopped showing up to guide just a decline over the years and a lack of interest no rule changes in years to amount to anything but the dogs have defiantly changed over the years so after years of service the $$$ boys win tar will join the masses and just go enjoy sombody else's hard work I hate to do it but survival of the fittest they say!!

Posted by Richard Lambert on 07-17-2017 10:38 PM:

I always just pay up the whole litter and then the person that buys each pup doesn't have to worry about it. I don't know why everyone doesn't do that. There is a place on the litter registration form just for that.

Posted by rob thompson on 07-17-2017 10:38 PM:

Needs to be on the litter reg. Form and puppy papers, why wouldn't it be ?

Posted by Pat Bizich on 07-17-2017 11:22 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Allen / UKC
The form in question is available on the website.

https://www.ukcdogs.com/docs/huntin...nce-program.pdf

Allen.. Thank you for posting this link .
Now the question was where were the click ons to get to the link you provided?
I went back and tried to search for it again and still absolutely could not find it without your link.
Finally hit pay dirt

Here was the only page I could find referring to the application that says it is not available.

https://www.ukcdogs.com/permanent-registration

Now for us dummies and the new web page .I found out just how difficult it was to navigate and search when you don't know where to look .
I still say this is too much to go through to access an application.

1. UKC FRONT PAGE
2. HUNTING
3. ABOUT UKC COONHOUNDS
4. EVENTS AND PROGRAMS
5. PERFORMANCE PROGRAM
now move to the right of the page under the performance program information.
6. CLINK ON THE LINK UNDER HELPFUL INFO AND FORMS

Ta Da there you are .You have arrived to the above provided link.

Posted by rob thompson on 07-17-2017 11:44 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by H.W. Moore
I haven't been to a club that still gives trophies in years. I donated a dozen trophies to a club starting out a few years ago & they only held 2 hunts before going under..

what it costs to put on a ukc hunt is crazy, I could see the costs for a major hunt being a little higher but the hunt package is too high. If ukc would lower the hunt package the club could easily provide trophies or even a jackpot to hunt for. Some clubs have to pay rent or lease a building to hold hunts, pay electric/water and insurance on the building if they own it. And here we have to pay for a hunt permit from the conservation!! It is hard for clubs to flourish with ukc taking such a big chunk. It is easier just to have club hunts for a Jackpot. And the fact that you can have 1 or 2 dog casts is a load of crap imo people bash pkc on here all the time but they make you have at least a three dog cast and then send a picture in to prove it!!!!

Posted by Donnie Stevens on 07-17-2017 11:54 PM:

I just got a set of papers back from UKC last week which included a litter registration. I just looked it over and not one word mentioned about any program on it that I can see.

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Posted by rob thompson on 07-18-2017 12:06 AM:

And another thing that sucks about the hunt package, if nobody shows you still got to pay for it. Ukc needs to refund that money, or at least let the club schedule another hunt and use the money already spent for the new hunt package. Ukc needs to make a minimum dog requirement and if no dogs show or not enough then it costs the club nothing!!!! This would help keep the clubs healthy. I know these suggestions will just float off into the wind because none of the powers that be want to change anything BUT if you take a long hard look at my suggestions they will benifit ukc and the clubs.

Posted by Randy Woodard on 07-18-2017 12:07 AM:

There's papers in with the puppy papers to fill out and send in. Applications for permanent performance. If the puppy sellers not giving them when they sell pups that their fault

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Posted by Pat Bizich on 07-18-2017 02:14 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Randy Woodard
There's papers in with the puppy papers to fill out and send in. Applications for permanent performance. If the puppy sellers not giving them when they sell pups that their fault

No Sir.They were not in with the papers.
Out of the last 4 litters registered 2 sets "DID NOT" have them enclosed. We had to call to have them mailed and the other we copied off the website.

I really can't see a breeder going through the expense of nominating a litter then not giving them to the new owners.
It is possible they forget but does not seem likely to me.

Posted by Bruce m. Conkey on 07-18-2017 12:20 PM:

Must be hit an miss on getting these forms sent out. If I was the man in charge of this program and serious about it. The first thing I would do is to get a number on the amount of coonhound pups that are eligible to be permanently registered in the program. Then I would look at the number of those pups that are UKC registered and compare that to the ones Permanently Registered in the Performance program. That would show very quickly if there is a problem. Then UKC has to look at what it is. If people are not getting these pups permanently registered then WHY? How much money is being loss due to this. How much money is not being put into the program because of this.

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Posted by yadkintar on 07-18-2017 12:30 PM:

Don't the points work on how many dogs you hunt against Bruce ? If so people are seeing low numbers and think it is not worth their time and money. Granny is a Grntch and 10 yrs old and performanced we still got time for a comeback.

At Jim and Richards club and if they don't wait on me hand and foot I am gonna gripe about it on here lol.

Posted by H.W. Moore on 07-18-2017 01:50 PM:

I'm coming to the conclusion that UKCs new owners have no desire to improve, expand or even continue the Performance program. Slight changes & minor increases & improvements could dramatically help both UKC & customers.

Posted by yadkintar on 07-18-2017 02:32 PM:

H.w here is where I think we are at we get the yee old silent treatment on one side .............. Again and we know what that means then you got a bunch of suggestions from a bunch of northerners that have been spoiled way to long telling us southerners that we are all wet and don't know about the struggles of keeping a club afloat and if we don't like it quit. I like your ideas and at this point if I owned a kc that more less let its membership do a large part of the work and pay most of the bills I would really be listening and would not wait three years to make changes but that's just me.

Posted by Daniel Donahue on 07-18-2017 02:43 PM:

Allow

Someone to performance one litter per year on a male at a cheaper rate. I bred to a dog that won't be bred again this year so it's hard to pay the full amount for one breeding

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Posted by JiM on 07-18-2017 02:49 PM:

You really wanna increase the PRP payout? Here's a simple way to greatly increase the pool of money in the program without having to ask or rely on UKC to lift one finger.
Encourage every Bluetick, Red Bone, B&T, Plott and Leopard owner/breeder to nominate and pay up every litter and every pup into the program. This would bring a huge flood of cash into the program while taking very little out.

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