UKC Forums - Black and Tan Bones

Pages (8): « 1 [2] 3 4 » ... Last »
Show all 183 posts from this thread on one page

UKC Forums (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/index.php)
- Redbones (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=51)
-- Black and Tan Bones (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928473456)

Posted by ahallada on 01-30-2017 07:17 PM:

It definitely brings up many issues around a color standard for the breed. As long as I've been hunting Redbones there has always been a color standard. If there is no color standard then why even have separate breeds? UKC opened up the X-bred category for these types of situations. It doesn't mean the dog is any less of a dog, they are still registered with UKC and eligible for all of the UKC coonhound events. I have many friends hunting X-bred dogs now and prefer them to other breeds.

A future idea would be to open up one big breed with UKC. Just call it the American Coonhound. Then you can have color associations for that color of dog if you want, but it would end all of the bickering between the breeds and might help us genetically. Kind of like a Buckskin Quarterhorse or a Palomino Quarterhorse. Buckskin and Palomino and others have their own color Associations but they can be dual registered as Quarterhorse if they are from registered QH.

We would have an American Coonhound and if we wanted to dual register it, it would also be a Redbone or whatever color standard it met. In this situation above, it would be a Black and Tan. Each color Association would be independent of UKC and all standards would be left up to the respective color/breed Associations. I doubt the breed Associations would want to deal with all of the paper work though and keep a separate registration office.

I saw a cross on FB a few weeks ago that was from a Redbone female that had a black and tan, a few english, a few walkers , a redbone, and another pup that looked like a redbone with white on the nose and feet/legs. lol Good luck with that one! It was a beautiful sight. I got my sights on that redbone pup. haha The hibred vigor is apparent in these pups and genetically they will be stronger than many "pure bred" Redbones.

__________________
Dr. Allen Hallada (Doc Halladay)

Current:

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Cat Scratch Fever
(Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Aftershock x Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Outlaw Breanna)
2016 Finished to PKC Ch. in one week!

Dual Grand Champion CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. All Grand Outlaw G-Man
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Glissens JJ Jr. x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Billy Jean)
4 Generations of All Grand Nite Champions!
Timber Jack 3X and Timber Chopper over 30X
2019 Southern National Redbone Days Champion
2016 National Grand Nite Champion Redbone
2016 CHKC Redbone Days Champion
2016 PKC Super Stakes Reserve Champion
2016 CHKC Elite Shootout Winner - Texas
CHKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

Bodacious
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Gr.Ch.PKC. Gold Ch.CHKC CH. Outlaw G-Man x Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. Classy Cali)

Past:
Gr.Nt.Ch.Ch. Dawns Timber Jack
1988 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner
1989 UKC World Champion Redbone
1989 Purina Outstanding Redbone Coonhound
#2 Historic Redbone Sire/ Top 20 All Breeds
American Redbone Coonhound Assoc. Hall of Fame

Gr.Nt.Ch. Bussrow Bottom Brandy II
1991 American Redbone Days Champion
1992 AKC World Champion Redbone
1992 ACHA World Champion Redbone
1992 Wisconsin State Champion
1994 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex
Produced 2 Nt. Ch. , 1 Gr.Nt.Ch. out of 2 litters and two Redbone Days Winners

Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. PKC Gold Ch. Layton's Classy Cali
2012 UKC World Champion Redbone and 7th Place Overall
2012, 2013, 2014, 2015 UKC World Champion Redbone Female
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - Goodsprings, AL
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Series Race - 3rd Place Overall
2016 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - New Albany, MS
2016 PKC Texas State Race Winner
2016 PKC Redbone Breed Race Winner
PKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Coffman's Smokin Red Buck
2016 UKC World Hunt 5th Place and World Champion Redbone
2016 National Redbone Days Overall Winner

Gr.Nt.Ch. Reinhart's Central Page
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Brandy II)

Gr.Nt.Ch. Too the Maxx
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Jenkins Crying Katie)
1992 National Redbone Days Champion

Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Ambraw River Rock
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Hersh's Huntin Red Kate)
1992 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex

Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle
1986 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner

Nt.Ch. Timber Mace
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack X Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle)
Mother of Gr.Nt.Ch. Babb's Hazel

Nt. Ch. Timber Shock
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Jessie)

Gr. Ch. Nt. Ch. Squaw Mountain Goldie
(Direct Daughter of Gr.Nt.Ch.Smokey Mountain Brandy)
1990 Autumn Oaks Best of Show Winner
1988 Indiana State Champion

Posted by Hoosier Outlaw on 01-30-2017 09:03 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by ahallada
It definitely brings up many issues around a color standard for the breed. As long as I've been hunting Redbones there has always been a color standard. If there is no color standard then why even have separate breeds? UKC opened up the X-bred category for these types of situations. It doesn't mean the dog is any less of a dog, they are still registered with UKC and eligible for all of the UKC coonhound events. I have many friends hunting X-bred dogs now and prefer them to other breeds.

A future idea would be to open up one big breed with UKC. Just call it the American Coonhound. Then you can have color associations for that color of dog if you want, but it would end all of the bickering between the breeds and might help us genetically. Kind of like a Buckskin Quarterhorse or a Palomino Quarterhorse. Buckskin and Palomino and others have their own color Associations but they can be dual registered as Quarterhorse if they are from registered QH.

We would have an American Coonhound and if we wanted to dual register it, it would also be a Redbone or whatever color standard it met. In this situation above, it would be a Black and Tan. Each color Association would be independent of UKC and all standards would be left up to the respective color/breed Associations. I doubt the breed Associations would want to deal with all of the paper work though and keep a separate registration office.

I saw a cross on FB a few weeks ago that was from a Redbone female that had a black and tan, a few english, a few walkers , a redbone, and another pup that looked like a redbone with white on the nose and feet/legs. lol Good luck with that one! It was a beautiful sight. I got my sights on that redbone pup. haha The hibred vigor is apparent in these pups and genetically they will be stronger than many "pure bred" Redbones.

White nosed "Hybrid Vigor" redbone....why don't you and TMack just come out of the closet already and switch over to walker dogs

__________________
Shane Maxey
Proud lifetime member of the NRA
Banshee Wildlife Products
Hoosier Outlaw / Moonlight Redbones
1994 American Redbone Coonhound Association Hunter of the Year
My first 3 redbones raised from pup's were:
Dual Gr.Ch. Outlaw Billy the Kid
Dual Gr.Ch.- PKC Ch. Outlaw Timber Girl
Dual Gr.Ch. Outlaw Scarlett Fever
(((( Current Favorites ))))
2013 AKC Ladies World Champion
Gr.Nt.Ch.- PKC Ch- AKC Ladies World Ch Ky Moonlight Breanna
Gr.Nt.Ch. - PKC Ch. Ky Moonlight Woody
Dual Grand Moonlight Deana
Dual Grand Ch.- PKC Ch. Moonlight AfterShock
Dual Grand Nighty Night Amber
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Big Time Britt
Gr.Nt.Ch Outlaw Billy Jean
Gr.Nt.Ch-PKC Ch.-2015 PKC Red Days Champ Outlaw Cherry Bomb
Gr.Nt.Ch Outlaw Breeze
Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. All Grand Outlaw G-Man (over $20.000 won in PKC & CHKC) 2019 Southern Redbone Days Overall Champion
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Outlaw Mac
Gr.Nt.Ch. Classy Cali (Heavy Outlaw bred)
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Cat Scratch Fever
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Addiction
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Overdose
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Jinx
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Banshee
"Always outnumbered...Never outgunned!"
To enjoy lots of pics and videos of out redbones, find me on Facebook
as Shenandoah Maxey

Posted by Richard Lambert on 01-30-2017 09:32 PM:

T Mack was never in the closet with Doc. He has been out in the open all along. We all know that he doesn't care what color they are or what you call them as long as He can win with them.

Posted by Sawblade on 01-30-2017 10:19 PM:

registration

A dogs breed is determined not by the standards but by the company that tracks the heritage of the dog. In this case UKC. No matter what color a hound might be the truth is we have accepted to take UKC records as our standard to prove a dog is a certain breed. If by their record it is a walker bred to a walker than it's a walker. UKC has allowed the breed organizations to set standards that they "'UKC" have agreed to follow. If tomorrow UKC decided to only require a paper trail proving heritage of only one breed they could do so.
The beef breeds have changed how they look at cattle ,it used to be you could tell and angus from a limousine cow, not anymore. I have seen many an English dog that looked like a walker. Walkers that look like a Tigg and or July dogs. Even today you can not tell a blue English from a Bluetick.
Our breed standards were set by people not by heritage and people can change their minds over time. I have always wanted to rediscover the High-Tan redbones we cast out as inferior many years ago. What did we loose when we became so prejudice to the color of a dog. I'm sure there was a big argument back then about it.
If someone can prove to me that color alone improves hunting quality of a breed than I will be all ears. Color however does not make a breed a breed ,heritage does.
I prefer to not be color blind and at the same time I would never lie on a set of papers just to sell a pup or try to make a cross with another breed and claim it as something else.
Any one want a nice Xbred pup give me a call.

__________________
Sawblade Kennels/owner Kelly Hyde

Proud Breeder of the following dogs
GrNiteCh Sawblade Fiddle "no.5 historical female
QuadGrCh Yellow River Red Blaze
GrNiteCh Copeland's Red Hot Clyde
GrNiteCh Stone's Midnight Red Jake
NiteCh Brights Choctaw Night Time Sissy
NiteCh Sawblade Red Reckon
NiteCh Brasee Red Penny
NiteCh Nacalus Mandolin
Yellow River Fiddle II " good reproducer"
NiteCh Krasa Sawblade Quikstuf Bone
GrNiteCh Krasa Hair Trigger Hope
GrNiteCH Locked and Loaded Jake
GrNiteCh Moonlight Woody
NiteCh Sawblade Mac Truck " Jake and Hopes' brother"
NiteCh After Dark Spark " brother to Fiddle"
NiteCh Morgan's Boone " sister to Fiddle"
NiteCh High Water June " out of Reckon"
NiteCh Sawblade Timberline Rusty
Sawblade Ribbon,

They are bred with heart and drive included.

From a small kennel with Big results.

Posted by wade lucking on 01-31-2017 12:11 AM:

The breed standard also says never cow hocked,, never. It just says solid red preferred , these aren't Black and Tan the are black and red. We better gait at redbone days and start stripping papers.

__________________
LUCKING'S MIDNITE REDS
"A FAMILY OF DUAL PURPOSE HOUNDS THAT CONTINUES ON GENERATION AFTER GENERATION"
Home of:

'Pr' Lucking's Code Red Mountain Dew ( Owned by chad porter and myself) ( Daughter of Desperado) 2 1st place wins ukc nite hunt. 1 best of show with comp , bench show.

'Pr' Lucking's Northern Red Tucker

AND THE PAST:
NT.CH.CH.LUCKING'S KN. LAKE TROOPER
NT.CH.GR.CH.LUCKING'S RAISIN KANE(son of trooper)
NT.CH.CH. LUCKING'S MAD MAGGIE(niece to tornado)
GR.CH.NT.CH.LUCKING'S RED TORNADO(son of trooper)
NT.CH.GR.CH.L&I RED HOT WYLIE(son of tornado)
'pr'lucking's northern red cowgirl (daughter of wylie)(needs just a 1st given to mark barnett)
nt.ch.gr.ch.Lucking's Midnite Desperado (son of cowgirl)(sold to bill tabler)
Nt.Ch.Ch. Desperado's Midnite 3 D(son of Desperado) (given to larry tabler)

Posted by oklared on 01-31-2017 01:49 AM:

IS WHITE A DISQUALIFIER, IS COON FOOTED, IS COW HOCKED, IS SHORT EARS, JUST ASKING WHAT THINGS WILL ABSOLUTLY DISQUALIFY A DOG IN A BENCH SHOW ? OR DO THESE THINGS JUST MAKE SCORE LESS

__________________
HOME OF 2010 HIGH SCOREING REDBONE FEMALE, DUAL CH Y2KD, #7 REPRODUCING RED FEMALE
NT.Ch. WINNER AT REDBONE SEC. 2008
3RD PL. NT.CH. 2009 BATTLE OF BREEDS AT ADA OKLA.
4TH PLACE R.Q.E 2010
2ND PLACE OVERALL AT ZONE 4 AND DOUBLE CAST WINNER 2010
WENT TO 2010 WORLD HUNT
AMERICAN REDBONE ASSOCIATION HIGH SCOREING REDBONE FEMALE OF THE 2010 WORLD HUNT
OVERALL HI SCOREING DOG AT 2010 BBCHA BLUE TIC SECTIONAL
GR.NT.CH. AT 12 and A HALF
MADE-EM SEE RED

Posted by ibrobiinhood on 01-31-2017 05:01 AM:

Kelly, I had a nice litter of Redbones with 3 of the 7 being Black & Tan in color. All males and all went to HUNTING homes. One was starting to show what it was made of and got hit along with another fine young hound at the same time. I didn't make this cross planning on seeing the color I seen but I be darned if I am going to cull a potentional GR NT CH because of color. Alot of good comments came up after your last post. And you made my view quite clear...UKC set the standard when they registered my female and the stud dog. Now someone is calling me a liar and saying I bred to a Black & Tan. Got news for them, I wanted Redbones, not x-bred. My female was well watched during her season.

Posted by ahallada on 01-31-2017 06:56 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Hoosier Outlaw
White nosed "Hybrid Vigor" redbone....why don't you and TMack just come out of the closet already and switch over to walker dogs

He's already switched over. lol

I'm grabbing on to this pole and hoping this wind don't pull me with him. Throw me a **** rope!

Nah I'm a Redbone diehard. I'll be here forever! I'll still be laughed at when my dogs are entered in those big $KC events, but when I walk away with those big checks I'll have the last laugh.

Posted by jdgher on 01-31-2017 10:00 AM:

Standards

Ok then, If color is the problem, have the Association change the breed standard. Color can be any color you want. Might as well just change the name to Bones, since color isn't part of it. Get rid of all the standards, that way any pure bred gets in.
Give everyone that enters a hunt or show a first place trophy too.
Not really serious here.

Dogs that don't meet the color standard don't have to die, they just go over to the X-Breed. Keep it simple.

__________________
Darrin Gher
Elbridge Redbones
Home of
GRNTCH PR' Steve-O and Chili's Red Flow
NTCH PR' Twisters Musical Red Huey DNA-VIP Perf Sire 06'07 Deceased 11/07
Former Home of
NTCH 'PR' Swann's Lonesome Red Music/ Kitty
NTCH. CH PR' SawBlade Red Reckon
NTCH. CH PR' Gher's Timber Mt. Brandy
Breeder of
GRNTCH PR' Daugherty's Red BUBBA
NTCH CH PR' BA'S Tree Top Rockin Griddle
NTCH PR' Lickcreek Backwoods Lil Red Annie

Posted by ibrobiinhood on 01-31-2017 12:53 PM:

Darrin, color wasn't a problem when our breed started. It wasn't until more people got involved and someone decided to keep track of the crosses. Not really a bad thing. However, the bad thing was when a standard started dicatating the breed and nature and the true standard went out the door. Could it possibly be that when the registry took over that there was possibly more show people involved then hunters. Have you been to any breed days to see what shows up. How many of them show dogs actually get hunted? Yep, two sets of groups and one isn't in our roots.

Lets look at our roots. If dog "A" is red colored Foxhound but has a history of having black & tan in color upon registering it was registered as Redbone, because breeder being approached by registry. Now this dog was bred to "B", a mixed bred hound who was also red in color therefore it too was registered as a Redbone. The genes both these dogs carried will be passed on. When bred to like dog we not only double up on the good traits we desire but also the bad. Possibly an all white Redbone or even ghost/silver colored.

You mention being color. Is it really a bad thing? Does it stop it from running a coon, what our roots we desired. Don't get me wrong I prefer a deep red coat on mine. However, my desire is first and foremost to have a Registered Redbone that will tree a coon. I bred a female that was deep red to a male that was lighter but red just the same. Who would have thought that 3 would come out Black & Tan in color. But again, much like my roots I wasn't breeding for a standard to dicatate my dog but for my cross to dicatate the standard...the next best REDbone we have ever seen from two UKC registered recognized parents registered as such. One can not breed away genetics, it is in the blood and sometime, maybe not in this litter it will can and does show up.

Posted by wade lucking on 01-31-2017 06:17 PM:

A real easy solution is if you have a pup born Black and red, the pup and both parents must be DNA profiled. Making the pup DNA VIP . Color must also submitted as such, allowing people to see that a black and red dog might be in there pedigree. It's not fair to label them x bred as they are a purebred hound. Why change a name as they are purebred redbone. Jmo

Posted by JShelton on 01-31-2017 11:42 PM:

I understand the point you guys are trying to make. But hunting a red one will get you enough flack all on it's own. So why would you even want to haul one to the hunts that was marked up like another breed of dog. The guys that have single registered dogs like get a head Lil red and Cali can't even get the respect they deserve and they are the right color. Just like everyone has said if it's black and ran register it X need if you believe that it will be able to compete. Personally I wouldn't take keep or buy one that color. Because I hunt red ones. I like the red in the red one and I don't have any interest in one of any other color and I'm sure most would agree. Just like breeding for ability we don't want bad traits showing up and off color dogs are no different as the pup that picks up the bad traits jmo

__________________
Jerry Shelton
606-282-8323

Posted by JShelton on 01-31-2017 11:44 PM:

I understand the point you guys are trying to make. But hunting a red one will get you enough flack all on it's own. So why would you even want to haul one to the hunts that was marked up like another breed of dog. The guys that have single registered dogs like get a head Lil red and Cali can't even get the respect they deserve and they are the right color. Just like everyone has said if it's black and tan register it X bred if you believe that it will be able to compete. Personally I wouldn't take keep or buy one that color. Because I hunt red bones. I like the red in the red bone and I don't have any interest in one of any other color and I'm sure most would agree. Just like breeding for ability we don't want bad traits showing up and off color dogs are no different as the pup that picks up the bad traits jmo

__________________
Jerry Shelton
606-282-8323

Posted by oklared on 01-31-2017 11:51 PM:

A LOT OF THAT BLACK WAS DONE YEARS AGO BY SOME WELL KNOWN BREEDERS AND IS STILL CROPING OUT ONCE IN A WHILE.

Posted by ahallada on 02-01-2017 12:58 AM:

Re: Standards

quote:
Originally posted by jdgher
Ok then, If color is the problem, have the Association change the breed standard. Color can be any color you want. Might as well just change the name to Bones, since color isn't part of it. Get rid of all the standards, that way any pure bred gets in.
Give everyone that enters a hunt or show a first place trophy too.
Not really serious here.

Dogs that don't meet the color standard don't have to die, they just go over to the X-Breed. Keep it simple.

Yep, that's exactly why UKC created the X-bred breed. It's not that hard to figure out.

Posted by wade lucking on 02-01-2017 02:28 AM:

This is not a x bred dog, it's a purebred redbone. X bred is breeding two different breeds or dogs of unknown ancestory

Posted by Donnie Stevens on 02-01-2017 03:22 AM:

It is an Xbred dog if you want papers because it does not meet the redbone standards.

__________________
Friends don't let friends hunt blueticks

Posted by wade lucking on 02-01-2017 04:05 AM:

Solid red preferred, small amount of white on brisket or feet not objectionable.
Disqualifications: Albinism. Any color or combination of colors other than described.

Above is the color breed standard. So black and red is out, so any black on a redbone should be x bred as it wouldn't meet the standard, check your hounds muzzles, tails and ears. Don't not breed these dogs . They don't meet the standard.

I wonder why they left the white part in and not the Black, what year was this standard set.

Posted by ibrobiinhood on 02-01-2017 04:32 AM:

I am almost certain there was a time when color was included on putting on the registeration papers Wade.

Again, I am glad that UKC stepped up and allows us to register them as x-bred eliminating the hassle of going through a breed association to single register a pup from both registered REDBONE parents. Its been joked about doing away with the standard. In reality maybe its the association we are dealing with. As a veteran I do not believe we have any business in the UN they do not believe in what I do. Therefore they do not have my best interest to heart. Does the association that sets my standard. I do not believe so. As Wade has pointed to, the off color does not make a cross bred hound, it makes it a Redbone that doesn't meet the breed standard. Like any other fault that would have it removed from a bench show.

Posted by ibrobiinhood on 02-01-2017 04:35 AM:

Wade, one thing is for certain....the standard has changed.

REDBONE COONHOUND

Official UKC Breed Standard
Revised January 1, 2016
@Copyright 1982, United Kennel Club.

As we can see, it was revised January 1, 2016

Posted by JShelton on 02-01-2017 04:42 AM:

Your right it doesn't say a black muzzle is ok. Maybe the association could change that. But to have a dog that looks like a total different breed is not what any redbone fancier or breeder should want. Period.

__________________
Jerry Shelton
606-282-8323

Posted by ibrobiinhood on 02-01-2017 05:01 AM:

I already said I don't desire an off colored Redbone. Shoot I don't want one with an over bite or retained testicle. But it comes in the genetics. Sometimes that genetics is the BEST coon treeing Redbone there is. And there lies my desire. And back to square one....that off colored Redbone should be no less then its littermates that meets the breed standard. If a Redbone fanicer isn't happy with its color they should turn their head instead of saying it isn't a Redbone because of what genetics makes it. It isn't going to stop me from making the cross again just as much as it isn't going to stop me from pushing the pups from the cross already made. The only thing missing is the show people won't be getting on the bench with it but as we seen with Cali, they sure can make a coon dog.

Posted by ibrobiinhood on 02-02-2017 01:39 PM:

Does color really define the breed or did our roots define the breed? Could it be that the title Redbone has nothing to do with the color but rather the last name of a breeder. Say something like Peter Redbone and the orginal color of the breed was with a black saddleback. With alittle more study one can see that our roots were built around hunting stock and not show stock. Back to our roots....In the late 18th century, many European-type hunting dogs were imported to America, most of them of Scottish, French, English, and Irish ancestry: the English Foxhound, the Harrier, the Grand Bleu de Gascogne, the Welsh Hound, the Beagle, and the Bloodhound were among these. Most often, these dogs were imported so that wealthy planters of the Tidewater could engage in foxhunting. Over time, Southern hunters selectively bred dogs that would not back down, had great stamina, and would "hound" their prey until they treed or cornered their exhausted quarry, leading to modern coonhounds. I wonder if the English Foxhound, the Harrier, the Grand Bleu de Gascogne, the Welsh Hound, the Beagle and Bloodhound are a particular color to meet a breed standard.

Again, breeding for a particular color is great for the breed. Something to strive for. But again, the study of our roots seems to me that color wasn't what we were striving for. UKC didn't take on the role of registering our dogs in 1902 based on color. They took it on to see what crosses were being made amongst HOUNDSMEN and not showmen.

Posted by thecoondawg76 on 02-02-2017 06:28 PM:

History

True Color throwbacks
The white points comes from the terrier bred in for more tree.
The saddleback is a throwback from bloodhounds.

The pink skin on some I think came from Italian Vislas I think but that is my opinion on the Visla.

Now Black and Tan or black and red, where the black comes down the legs or over the head that is Black and Tan hounds that were bred in irregardless of what the parents say. That doesn't mean you did it but someone certainly did. Some lines produce this a good bit and those it is because they for sure have full Black and Tans bred in. That is not a throwback but another breed.

Same for white that shows up at places other than small amounts on the toes or chest area. Especially, if the white has spots in it. That white could come from walkers, English, cur dogs and the like. That is not a throwback but another breed.

Same goes for gray or "Ghost" Redbones. Weimaraner has been bred in to certain lines and especially if you breed close on those lines. Guess what? You get a large portion of grey colored "Redbones". Redbones do not carry diluted color genes are not in Redbones like Dobermans and such. Yet again this is another breed bred in. UKC knows all this as does the other main registery concerned with breeding and so this is why these other colored and marked hounds are not eligible for registration. They have shown to have things in them that are not Redbone. This is not a throwback but another breed. To stop this issue they could even unregister any hounds that threw off color. Not what needs to be done for sure though. However, unless they are going to require every pup be DNA'd then not allowing hounds outside the standard to be registered also prevent unprincipled breeders who are trying to short cut their way to the top from knowingly and deliberately breeding in hounds of other breeds while claiming they are full Redbone. Also if someone knows that a cross is going to produce a large number of off colored pups but does it repeatedly anyway. Then you can claim whatever you want but you are indeed breeding for off colored pups and even the solid colored ones are going to have a high probability of throwing off colored pups. To me in that case the responsible breeder would send the whole litter in as x bred and not do the cross again unless they plan to label all of those pups x bred. That doesn't prevent you from hunting them in the hunts all you like. But is more true to what the hounds apparently are. Might it produce a great litter of pups? Sure. And you can do. However you are breeding x bred hounds, with a good bit of some other hound in them. To demand the standard change to meet your idea is there again trying to short cut your way to the top.

Lastly the hounds we have began as hunting hound period. They caused game be cornered so hunters could shoot them for food. Their were no shows. When thebreed standard was accepted that was done with the help of many breeders they knew what they had and what they threw out in their pups. The reason the standard has the points it does. To me however, saddle back should be an accepted color as it has been around from the start. However, these other colors have not, in what was considered to be pure bred Redbones.

__________________
Home of where the Heaviest Fireball bred hounds there are come from.
And the closest ones alive to GrNtCh Oklahoma Twister (the #1 reproducing son of Fireball) and GrNtCh Yellow River Rocky (the #2 reproducing son of Fireball) . Thanks to alot of help from my friends.

Handler of:
NtCh GrCh "PR" Dan Langston (Has 2 wins towards GrNtCh in the hunts) ( 10yr old owner asked for me to bring him back to his home) (wouldn't sell) (Ch D8 Dozer (bear hound from all coondog stock, out of my breeding) x NtCh Music/ Kitty) (33% Fireball thru heavy line breeding the highest GrNtCh Fireball blooded hound alive, who is hunt titled )

Home of:
'PR' Atomic Fireball's Harry Lady (GrNtCh. Barnyard Horse Harry x GrCh Daisy (was the highest Fireball blooded female alive)

'PR' Atomic Fireball's Toes ('PR' Atomic Fireball's Fast Talker (nephew to Bookem Danno) x 'PR' Atomic Fireball's Harry Lady

'PR' Atomic Fireball's Little Dixie (NtCh GrCh. 'PR' Dan Langston x 'PR'Harry Lady)

'PR' Atomic Fireball's Two Toes (NtCh GrCh Dan Langston x Atomic Fireball's Toes
Didn't have the deep hunt style I like but is a solid coonhound. Been treeing her own since her second night in the woods at 8 months old.

Former home of:
(Qualified for the 2011 World Hunt) NtCh. 'PR'Swann's Lonesome Red Music/ Kitty RIP (NtCh.Twister's Musical Red Huey x NtCh. Sawblade Red Reckon) RIP

GrNtCh Fireball's Jackpot Jackie, highest placing Redbone female ever, in the UKC World Hunt . RIP

GrCh. 'PR' Atomic Fireball's Little Daisy RIP (Was the highest GrNtCh Fireball blooded female in the world at the time) (Qualified for the 2010 World Show).

'PR' Atomic Fireball's Red River (Daisy x Brown's Oklahoma Twister) RIP (heatstroke)

Ch. D-8 Dozer (Was the Highest blooded GrNtCh Fireball blooded male in the world until I had the GrNtCh Twister pups from here) Was sent to be bear hunted because of his size and me being disabled. RIP

First and only sons of the Old GrNtCh #7 Historical Reproducer Brown's Okl. Twister (the #1 Producing Son of Fireball) in 15 years..

http://atomicfireballkennels.webs.com/
http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthrea...threadid=341228
Steve Bell

Posted by oklared on 02-02-2017 07:53 PM:

WHEN YOU GO TO A HUNT ,WHO CHECKS COLOR

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:03 PM.

Pages (8): « 1 [2] 3 4 » ... Last »
Show all 183 posts from this thread on one page