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-- competition hunters (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928416103)

i looked again and you are right my reply fit franks comment better

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Bent Creek Black and Tans
Aaron & Vicki Taylor 804-516-8137

pr Iowa import Deliela
grntch taylors black powder

quote:

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Originally posted by RLenhart
"I AM against what he's saying" but you guys aren't reading what he said clearly either. He is not saying to (-) den trees just the trees without a hole.

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funny part

i bet if ya think about it this thread was probably started trying to fix slick treeing people that circle bad trees more so then to fix the hunts or dogs for the better. jmo.

I have read all about this so I am going to repley with my opinion. I have been coonhunting now for about 25 years. I have been fortunate to own a few accurate and 2 that were very accurate. I'm talking about real live around 70%. Meaning you could put me under any circumstance you wanted they did not back up slicks and sure was not bad to make them. When I say 70% I mean no excusses If I walked to one hundred trees I would see them 70% of the time. One I own now: last year in april we ran for a ticket and won about a grand in state$ and 2 grand counting added and won about 12 or 13 cast. We won all but one with plus except one and dogs drew minus all night and I found her 2.3 after hunt with 2 lookin down. She was only scored on 2 trees the hole month that was not plused. This January we ran again and I have mentioned before I believe she was scored on about 5 trees that was not plused and won 7 cast that month out of 9. She never made 2 trees in a row that atleast one was not plused. Thats January deep south. She treed 11 found seen real live ricky raccons. The other 27 dogs we drew made dens and slicks all month and showed us one live ricky raccoon. huh I owned the other years ago. I ukc hunted then. He had 4 WINS TOWARD GRAND BEFORE HE WAS EVER SCORED ON A TREE THAT WAS NOT PLUSED. I do not believe he was ever scored on 2 trees in a row that was not plused. And know he never made more than one circle a night. I can't tell you how many times he was split 100 yards form dogs when they had dens and he had REAL LIVE RICKY RACCONS. You know why? He did'nt back track. I not saying a coon will not run back to a den. But the walker male I owned was a ground pounder and he might make one den tree a week if you hunted him hard even in the dead of winter late at night. He did miss but when leaves were off I would find I would say better than 80% as long as he was in shape. Most of his dens I would find the coon.lol My point if a dog makes 2 trees in a role that no coon was found THERE IS ABOUT A 99% CHANCE ONE WAS NOT THERE. I don't care if they were 2 dens. Dogs make 2 trees in a row with no coon produced they need to suck up some minus I will gurantee that one was slick. I have cut down alot of dens. Most had nothing, some had squirrels, and a few would have a coon. Now no dog is 100% and even the couple accurate ones I had would get in little funks where they missed more than I wanted them to. I have found a dog that will tree alot of coon will miss a few but I'm saying when they made 2 in a row and I did'nt see one I was mad and gurantee atleast one was slick. Dog had 4 circle trees at the end of the night they should be minused on 2. THEY WERE NOT THERE. If they were then your a sorry handler for not finding them.

I usually take more time then I should checking a tree even when my first impression is slick but it's because of finding several that I didn't think was there .

quote:

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Originally posted by msinc
Not much difference between a tree with a den or a big tall tree full of leaves...either way, you cant see a coon in both trees. You cannot prove coon is there or not, so why penalize the dog???

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quote:

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Originally posted by RLenhart
OH I agree, I just didn't want to put words in the guy's mouth he didn't say.

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Re: WHY

quote:

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Originally posted by buck brush
Dave look at the hunt numbers and see if the competition hunters are not the minority, I know there are still people that go to hunts every week end but it sure is not like it use to be a club not to far from me drew 15 dogs there last hunt , they use to draw 80 to 100 at every hunt they had, and they thought 15 was doing good, all you have now is pleasure hunters that go to competition hunt when they are local in most cases. JMO

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David Schmidt
219-614-0654

Pleasure hunting last night, 3 dogs. Dogs treed and we went to them. we had two Amish with us, they hunt with us most f the time, but don't have dogs of their own. Five people shining the tree, no leaves, no holes , large tree about 40 ft high. We looked for about 10 minutes. We concluded the dogs had slicked treed. Lead the dogs off the tree, mine went back so I made him leave. We were standing about 20 ft. from the tree and one of the guys was shining the tree waiting for the dogs to open again. All of a sudden a coon sitting in a crutch of the tree sat up and looked at him. We all looked and seen the coon. Now that crutch didn't look like it was big enough to hide a coon. The coon was about 20 feet up in the tree. So with what some people on here want My dog would have been scratched on the next tree cause it was a den .Tree had a hole in it the size of a basketball. Cause we didn't see the coon in the first tree in the 10 minutes it also would have been minused.

OK, I changed my mind. I'll throw in my 2 cents.

Three weeks ago... average size oak tree, without a leaf on it. My son and I shined the tree for about 5 minutes (that's a lot when there aren't any leaves!) and he told me, "she's slick, daddy!"

Now she's no angel, but she doesn't miss often, and when she does I (like most) can tell when she's not right. I said hold on and took one last look. And finally saw the coons tail! Even then, his body seemed to blend in with the tree.

I don't know if these bright lights are actually worse for seeing coon, or if it's the color of the light, or these tiny coon down here in North Carolina, or that I'm "losing my touch", but we almost condemned her for doing exactly what she was supposed to do!

Now, are there many, many slick trees being circled these days? Yes! Are there a bunch of slick treeing idiots out there? Yes! Are there too many handlers unwilling to take minus under any circumstances? Yes! But do we need to give some of the honest dogs the benefit of the doubt? I believe so.

I often hear people say, "I think this or that", but scoring a tree shouldn't be about what you think, it should be about what you see. Do you see a coon or not? If not, do you see an area that a coon could be hiding? If yes, then circle it. Use the "honor rules" honorably. You can try to redefine the rules, but that won't fix the problem, if the problem is dishonesty.

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David Schmidt
219-614-0654

I am hunting one that is not my normal type dog that I usually hunt don't hunt deep strait chop mouth all the way bought him because my female in these thin coons goes to deep or so I thought the last 5 coons he's treed I could see the pickup from the tree he's missed a couple that I thought he was trying to tree layup but I see enough coons I could get used to that chop mouth lol!!!!

A step In the right direction would be applying a tree count down to cut out on the me to dogs, this would not fix anything in my opinion just make a lot of people mad and destroy UKC night hunts.

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Seth Penn-
256-604-8002
Huntsville,AL
UKC & ACHA NiteCh' Pr' Slippery Creek Rag's Boozer

opinions

I read all the opinions on here and got just what I thought I would. Thank's to all of you who took the time to voice your opinion. Pat

opinions

I read all the opinions on here and got just what I thought I would. Thank's to all of you who took the time to voice your opinion. Pat