UKC Forums - Why its important to make out crosses and how to do so

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Posted by BUCKEYE BILLY on 09-12-2013 09:11 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by ov_blues
The kink or lack thereof in their tail is the least of my concerns. Will they hunt big, get struck quick, drive a track and die on the right tree? Those are my bigger concerns. lol. If I can breed all of that in, I should be able to breed out a crook in the tail. haha.

I hear ya on that one. It was just an example of a trait that were genes that were passed down the line. Good subject to talk about thats all. Ive enjoyed it.

Posted by southernthunder on 09-12-2013 09:19 PM:

Re: Re: Eddie

quote:
Originally posted by BIG$BLUES
You got the wool pulled over his eyes Eddie lol

not everybody can have slow track straddling, won't tree nothing but possums, short eared, squeaky mouth potlickers like mine lol

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Posted by bluetickman2002 on 09-12-2013 09:23 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by southernthunder

I think I will call my next one Kinky lol [/B]

I did have one called crook LOL

__________________
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pr swampland tilly (son x wezze)
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Posted by southernthunder on 09-12-2013 09:25 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by bluetickman2002
I did have one called crook LOL

lol

you want me to pick Weeze up yet? lol when is her heat cycle due next?

Posted by BUCKEYE BILLY on 09-12-2013 09:41 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by bluetickman2002
I did have one called crook LOL

lol thats funny. That could be considered a little dirty if a feller didnt know the the whole story behind it. So ur in cast right. Cast member says hey buddy I got to ask ya why u named ur dog kinky. Ur reply then would come next. Lol good conversation peace.

Posted by BUCKEYE BILLY on 09-12-2013 09:48 PM:

[QUOTE]Originally posted by southernthunder
lol both of my gyps had pups with kink tails and both were from the same sire (half sisters). I used the same stud dog I breed both of those gyps to on other gyps without any problems.

I think I will call my next one Kinky lol [/QUOTE

opps I quoted the wrong post. Lol

Posted by pamjohnson on 09-12-2013 11:52 PM:

crooked tails also happens in beagles as well,and yes it is genetic. with beagles if its curled in a circle it gets caught in the briars a lot so breeders will clip them off as pups, with nail clippers to solve this problem.

Posted by southernthunder on 09-13-2013 02:15 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by BUCKEYE BILLY
[QUOTE]Originally posted by southernthunder
lol both of my gyps had pups with kink tails and both were from the same sire (half sisters). I used the same stud dog I breed both of those gyps to on other gyps without any problems.

I think I will call my next one Kinky lol [/QUOTE

opps I quoted the wrong post. Lol

lol

Posted by bluetickman2002 on 09-13-2013 05:00 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by southernthunder
lol

you want me to pick Weeze up yet? lol when is her heat cycle due next?

her slippers and tilly will all be in around jan thinkin about breedin slippers to boomer he crossed real well on wezzze but so did son and levi LOL

I talked to ron taylor the other day he said the pups I sent him out of levi are doin real good he said his is the best pup he has had in a while and his buddy said the other is the most natural pup he has ever owned not to bad when 10 month old pups are treein coon the old dogs cant find LOL

Posted by southernthunder on 09-13-2013 01:21 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by bluetickman2002
her slippers and tilly will all be in around jan thinkin about breedin slippers to boomer he crossed real well on wezzze but so did son and levi LOL

I talked to ron taylor the other day he said the pups I sent him out of levi are doin real good he said his is the best pup he has had in a while and his buddy said the other is the most natural pup he has ever owned not to bad when 10 month old pups are treein coon the old dogs cant find LOL

I sure wish I could talk you into breeding Weeze one last time. what kinda mouth did the Levi pups have?

Posted by bluetickman2002 on 09-13-2013 06:14 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by southernthunder
I sure wish I could talk you into breeding Weeze one last time. what kinda mouth did the Levi pups have?

they are loud hank has a bawl mouth the one little female that looks like wezze is the loudest I think

tiny is the loudest dog I got here high piched chop on tree bawl on track you can hear her well over a mile with no problem

Posted by BUCKEYE BILLY on 09-13-2013 06:39 PM:

wow

Almost 1,100 hits in 4 days. Good subject!!!!!!!

Posted by southernthunder on 09-13-2013 07:43 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by bluetickman2002
they are loud hank has a bawl mouth the one little female that looks like wezze is the loudest I think

tiny is the loudest dog I got here high piched chop on tree bawl on track you can hear her well over a mile with no problem

funny how that works lol

Posted by southernthunder on 09-13-2013 07:43 PM:

Re: wow

quote:
Originally posted by BUCKEYE BILLY
Almost 1,100 hits in 4 days. Good subject!!!!!!!

yes it is!

Posted by CountryMile on 09-14-2013 06:56 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Blue Iron
I've seen crooked tails in all breeds and inbred, linebred and outcrossed pups. Heck saw 2 in one litter that were off a WalkerXRedbone cross. I disagree on it being genetic but if you believe it is that's perfectly fine too.

I would tend to agree. Like mentioned above, I have seen this trait follow certain blue lines as well. I also saw many many Leatherwood hounds that where linebred pretty hard on these same lines and I cant recall ever seeing a Letherwood with a crooked tail

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Posted by pamjohnson on 09-14-2013 01:08 PM:

understanding

some may get a little confused. its not the line breeding that is the problem. it's the fact that bent tails are a genetic default and then linebreeding on that gene is were the problem lies. unless someone wants bent tails. in that case breed bent tails on bent tails,weather it is outcrossed or linebred or inbred in to the cross u will get what u bred for.

Posted by BUCKEYE BILLY on 09-14-2013 08:07 PM:

Re: understanding

quote:
Originally posted by pamjohnson
some may get a little confused. its not the line breeding that is the problem. it's the fact that bent tails are a genetic default and then linebreeding on that gene is were the problem lies. unless someone wants bent tails. in that case breed bent tails on bent tails,weather it is outcrossed or linebred or inbred in to the cross u will get what u bred for.

ur right some do get confused. I dont know how we got to talking about a bad gene. This not an opinion about weather this is true or not cause its a fact. After I figured it out one day I did some research with pepole that breed animals for a living. Horses , cows , dogs. And they also linebreed, but if they do they go back out on the next cross. Way out. Lets just look at the cosmetic traits that can be bad traits that can get sealed by going back to the same gene pool too many times or too close. This is what has happened in the line that ive bred. U start getting a smaller dogs as whole, Shorter ears, Hooktails, bad bites in teeth department, Bad feet. Seems like if u go too tight the bad traits and genes start showing up. If u dont believe me line breed inside ur own kennel too many times and ull see. That being said i love to line breed my hounds but i see something out there in a stud or a line of dogs doing some winning i go get it. our bluetickers as whole want to use their own stud for some reason and not go get what we need to beat the competition. We all know who the competition is right. For those who dont know I give ya hint. I can tell ya who it shouldn't be. One of our fellow bluetickers with a better stud than urs. Its amazing how people go thru this message board and not even click on and read about the dogs that our not related to theirs. We need to mix the best of the best and then linebreed back into our own gene pool if ya want. If we all think that way we will mix up the best blood and get all the good dominant genes so that the next generation we can stay in inside our kennel and breed back in our gene pool that has please us all these years and seal more good traits for the bluetick breed as a whole. Thanks for reading Norm

Posted by Climb or Die on 10-13-2013 03:47 AM:

boys let me say this about norm. I used to think he was little cocky and thought he was just blowing smoke about breeding these blue dogs. Now after hunting with my female he told me to breed her to the son dog of ron taylors which I did and the most of the litter turned out to be nice dogs. so then I told him I was going to breed the same female to levi seman and he told me not to the pups wouldn't amout to much and some would be long haired. I thought he was crazy we are talking the same bloodlines right with levi being sons grandfather. well I be danged if them pups didn't amount to nothing and some had long hair. boys norm know these blue dogs and has produced some of the finest crosses the breed has seen if you want a blue dog that can compete. I will be hunting a jet 9 or airplane pup again in the future. It may be just crazy high percentage luck but any blue dog I hunt will come from norm or tom Jennings cause they know how to breed one that can compete on the big stage.

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Posted by bluetickman2002 on 10-14-2013 12:26 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Climb or Die
boys let me say this about norm. I used to think he was little cocky and thought he was just blowing smoke about breeding these blue dogs. Now after hunting with my female he told me to breed her to the son dog of ron taylors which I did and the most of the litter turned out to be nice dogs. so then I told him I was going to breed the same female to levi seman and he told me not to the pups wouldn't amout to much and some would be long haired. I thought he was crazy we are talking the same bloodlines right with levi being sons grandfather. well I be danged if them pups didn't amount to nothing and some had long hair. boys norm know these blue dogs and has produced some of the finest crosses the breed has seen if you want a blue dog that can compete. I will be hunting a jet 9 or airplane pup again in the future. It may be just crazy high percentage luck but any blue dog I hunt will come from norm or tom Jennings cause they know how to breed one that can compete on the big stage.

just curious how was your gyp breed that you crossed on son and levi ?

I breed the same female to son and levi and had good results with both the levi pups are less than a year old and doing a good job by themselves and no long hair on them

Posted by southernthunder on 10-14-2013 04:46 AM:

I have been told by many that the heavy jet breed dogs will have long hair lots of the time. I don't know this to be true, but have now seen some of it for the first time ever.

Posted by Climb or Die on 10-17-2013 09:17 PM:

my female was smokey river and jet 5 bred.

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Posted by BUCKEYE BILLY on 10-18-2013 12:48 AM:

jay

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Posted by Autumn Clements on 10-18-2013 05:05 PM:

I made a Grandmother x grandson cross last spring.. Quite happy with how my male is doing out of this cross

------GRNTCH Bingo's Northern Blue Dancer
----GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Prancer
------GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Spice
--Prancer's Getting Down N Dirty
------GRNTCH B&D's Blue Spike
----GRNTCH GRCH Spike's Twilite Hooker
------GRNTCH Twilite Blue Honey
CH Buell's Blue Rocky
------GRNTCH Slife's Blue Rambo
----GRNTCH Smiley's Blue Rambo II
------GRNTCH Smiley's Misti Blue
--GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Spice
------NTCH Smokey River JB's Cheif
----GRNTCH Davis' White River Sugar
------NTCH Nixon Wolf Cr Pebbles

Always wanted to make this cross too but dad & I didn't own any of the females from this cross to be able to make it.
------GRNTCH Bingo's Northern Blue Dancer
----GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Prancer
------GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Spice

------GRNTCH Dancer's Northern Blue Son
---- Son x Spice female
------GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Spice

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Posted by BUCKEYE BILLY on 10-23-2013 03:10 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Autumn Clements
I made a Grandmother x grandson cross last spring.. Quite happy with how my male is doing out of this cross

------GRNTCH Bingo's Northern Blue Dancer
----GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Prancer
------GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Spice
--Prancer's Getting Down N Dirty
------GRNTCH B&D's Blue Spike
----GRNTCH GRCH Spike's Twilite Hooker
------GRNTCH Twilite Blue Honey
CH Buell's Blue Rocky
------GRNTCH Slife's Blue Rambo
----GRNTCH Smiley's Blue Rambo II
------GRNTCH Smiley's Misti Blue
--GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Spice
------NTCH Smokey River JB's Cheif
----GRNTCH Davis' White River Sugar
------NTCH Nixon Wolf Cr Pebbles

Always wanted to make this cross too but dad & I didn't own any of the females from this cross to be able to make it.
------GRNTCH Bingo's Northern Blue Dancer
----GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Prancer
------GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Spice

------GRNTCH Dancer's Northern Blue Son
---- Son x Spice female
------GRNTCH GRCH Clements' Blue Spice

i would of liked to seen that cross made myself. they would of been tree dogs with brains

Posted by cwbluebio on 10-23-2013 11:14 AM:

Please share with us what you felt was lacking in the dogs you had that made you feel it was necessary to make your outcross (s). Pamjohnson's advice and suggestions appear to make sense and are based on fact. Appreciate that while your own experiences may in fact be true, they are just that, and do not represent the breed or even a line of dogs as a whole. Poor selection results in the problems you list as concerns-smaller dogs, poor bites, etc., etc. and can easily be selected away from using the same breeding methods. So many people start out capitalizing off the successes of others, have success for a generation or two and then run into these type problems. Hybrid vigor is nice many times for the first generation but can also destroy everything just as easily. I will limit my comments to these because no one ask for my opinion anyway. Just be careful about viewing anything and everything as absolutes. Good luck in the future and keep thinking and trying.

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