UKC Forums - Performance and SS vs. just Performance

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-- Performance and SS vs. just Performance (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928306277)

Posted by Dale Young on 03-06-2013 07:31 PM:

Re: Re: Re: LOL......

quote:
Originally posted by K. Singletary
First of all, how many super stakes pups will you have to pay up and spend countless hours on before getting one worthy of taking. Then you have to take a week off of work and travel, racking up food, hotel, and gas bills. Then you acutally have to win 2 casts which only 1 in 8 that attend can do. Big $ going out with a slim chance of any coming in.

Or I can pay $30 to pay up a performance pup, hunt at the local club where I'm going to hunt anyway and possibly get a few hundred $'s in return for doing nothing extra.

My math tells me it's a no brainer to have a performance pup while many things need to be considered before investing in a super stakes pup.

On a personal level I may never hunt in either one but if a pup is eligible I usually pay it up while it's cheap just in case . For a guy like me Mr. Singletary pretty much said my outlook on it .

Posted by shawnstovall on 03-07-2013 05:43 PM:

809 views and only 26 committs.

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Posted by shane_atchison on 03-07-2013 07:04 PM:

S.S.

Good debate Shawn. Lots of angles to look at here. If you & him split the cost it will be $100 ea. or depending on the amount of pups $20 - $30 a pup. Are you $ ahead for doing it? Not really. But (what if) the next Marti or Cash or Hayes is in this litter? And they never get a chance to compete. Most every litter has a couple pups that can Nite or Gr.Nite and make there owner a lil $ but, there may be that 1 in 1000 in this litter that can go to the stakes & make its owner a lotta $. Goodluck with this litter and I hope to see you when my gyps comes in.

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Posted by shawnstovall on 03-07-2013 11:44 PM:

yea shane i see everybody's point they boy just wants to make sure he can sale the pups and not make a toon of money but to just cover the cost of reg. the pups that is why the super stakes question. i think he would be head in super stakin the pups seems to be more people going back to the other kc hunts these days.

Posted by Bradley E. Hall on 03-08-2013 12:32 AM:

I had a female out of Rock River Cord years ago. I took her to SS in the fall, I drawed All Grand Track Man, yes the Track Man. My female won by a whole coon to herself. I went on to 4th round and drawed a Ashley Hopkins and gave him the cast treeing my gyp to soon which makes me a bad handler. Point is that 3 cast wins paid me $3200 I believe. I been Hunting UKC for 25 years, I got the best dog I ever owned now who is 4 years old a performance pup he was, after I made him Grand in 1 year I think I got a check pushing 500. The math does the work for me. When the performance first came out it was huge, incredible no holds barred. Then when they saw how much money was paid out according to its rules they started cutting it away. No breed days, (remember Nowheres when she made like 20 grand that year?) no world hunt, no more than 2 points a hunt ect. The performance needs to be revised and looked at the points get smaller every year in returns.

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Posted by tim griffin on 03-08-2013 01:09 AM:

Re: Re: Re: LOL......

quote:
Originally posted by K. Singletary
First of all, how many super stakes pups will you have to pay up and spend countless hours on before getting one worthy of taking. Then you have to take a week off of work and travel, racking up food, hotel, and gas bills. Then you acutally have to win 2 casts which only 1 in 8 that attend can do. Big $ going out with a slim chance of any coming in.

Or I can pay $30 to pay up a performance pup, hunt at the local club where I'm going to hunt anyway and possibly get a few hundred $'s in return for doing nothing extra.

My math tells me it's a no brainer to have a performance pup while many things need to be considered before investing in a super stakes pup.

8 double cast wins in three years that adds up to a real good check

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Posted by jculler8 on 03-08-2013 03:34 AM:

Re: Re: Re: LOL......

quote:
Originally posted by K. Singletary
First of all, how many super stakes pups will you have to pay up and spend countless hours on before getting one worthy of taking. Then you have to take a week off of work and travel, racking up food, hotel, and gas bills. Then you acutally have to win 2 casts which only 1 in 8 that attend can do. Big $ going out with a slim chance of any coming in.

Or I can pay $30 to pay up a performance pup, hunt at the local club where I'm going to hunt anyway and possibly get a few hundred $'s in return for doing nothing extra.

My math tells me it's a no brainer to have a performance pup while many things need to be considered before investing in a super stakes pup.

3 cast wins paid $3,200... That's a lot of years of PRP plus food, gas, etc to pay.

It's all what you are in the game for... You mentioned 1in 8 wins at SS.. Well if I'm packing a coon dog... I cut the odds to 1in 4. I'll take a 1in 4 chance at over $3,000 anyday compared to losing a whole point at a PRP program hunt by 25+. In the other world, if I beat the dogs I draw, I get paid! Here 25+ might lose ya $100.

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Posted by cody jaster on 03-08-2013 04:31 AM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: LOL......

quote:
Originally posted by jculler8
3 cast wins paid $3,200... That's a lot of years of PRP plus food, gas, etc to pay.

It's all what you are in the game for... You mentioned 1in 8 wins at SS.. Well if I'm packing a coon dog... I cut the odds to 1in 4. I'll take a 1in 4 chance at over $3,000 anyday compared to losing a whole point at a PRP program hunt by 25+. In the other world, if I beat the dogs I draw, I get paid! Here 25+ might lose ya $100.

Yes, but did You Win That Much? Are you just saying you Could win that much! Apparently no one one here has!!! Pkc is making a killing on wanna be winners!

Posted by K. Singletary on 03-08-2013 04:44 AM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: LOL......

quote:
Originally posted by cody jaster
Yes, but did You Win That Much? Are you just saying you Could win that much! Apparently no one one here has!!! Pkc is making a killing on wanna be winners!

Yep, it's like all those people standing in line at the gas station buying lottery tickets. Only to play in this game it will cost you more than a dollar. LOL

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Posted by jculler8 on 03-08-2013 04:46 AM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: LOL......

quote:
Originally posted by cody jaster
Yes, but did You Win That Much? Are you just saying you Could win that much! Apparently no one one here has!!! Pkc is making a killing on wanna be winners!

Last time I checked, a trophy isn't worth much more than a few bucks and a big fat ole chest. If you need to know how much I've won over there, all you have to do is log on and check a post I'm in. It's under my name, number, etc etc

Posted by K. Singletary on 03-08-2013 04:48 AM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: LOL......

quote:
Originally posted by tim griffin
8 double cast wins in three years that adds up to a real good check

Yes it does, congratulations.

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Posted by K. Singletary on 03-08-2013 04:51 AM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: LOL......

quote:
Originally posted by jculler8
Last time I checked, a trophy isn't worth much more than a few bucks and a big fat ole chest. If you need to know how much I've won over there, all you have to do is log on and check a post I'm in. It's under my name, number, etc etc

You aren't hunting for a trophy in UKC, you are hunting for a title to build a pedigree. Most I know give the trophies back to the club.

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Posted by jculler8 on 03-08-2013 05:16 AM:

In one way or another, EVERYONE here would like the point value to go up... UKC is attempting to do something about this with several program price increases in small amounts. That's all fine and dandy, however, has anyone on this post ever thought about what kind of interest over 1 MILLION dollars draws in a bank? Look at the breakdown of points and values. Nowhere does it account for interest gained over the year and I highly doubt all of that performance money sits in the office all year until the end of March.

Posted by GA DAWG on 03-08-2013 05:17 AM:

If the breeder SS the litter now. You can pay up the SS for 25 dollars I do believe. I can go to a week night 30 dollar 4 dog hunt. Win 72. That's at a local club to. I've paid for paying my pup up in one little hunt.

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Posted by LIPPER'S-N-LAW on 03-08-2013 05:34 AM:

Need to have top notch

quote:
Originally posted by Dwils
Performance points are hardly worth enough to interest me anymore . For the money u put in the payout is a joke

thats because you don't have a top stud dog like MoJo

Posted by Tyler Vaden on 03-08-2013 06:31 AM:

Re: Need to have top notch

quote:
Originally posted by LIPPER'S-N-LAW
thats because you don't have a top stud dog like MoJo

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Posted by JustinH23 on 03-08-2013 02:25 PM:

I guess it doesn't matter to me. Like Jim, most of us are just throwing money down a black hole anyway. No sense in arguing about it.

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Posted by John D on 03-11-2013 10:18 PM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: LOL......

None of it can be justified based on a bottom line. Most of these dogs that win alot of money still spent several dollars for every dollar they won, if you truly account for everything.

I rarely if ever hunt local PKC hunts and if I did show up at a big PKC hunt I'd probably be beat before turning a dog loose, anyhow.

Having said that, I do like to start a pup from about every litter I produce and if they are year old, doing something and ready to sell, then that SS could attract a good quality buyer.

I dabble around in UKC hunts and for t hat reason the PRP is a must. Not just for the money but its also worth some recognition.

The math I look at is the scores on the casts at the bigger hunts. If my dog or something out of them is competitive until the end, then I feel like it was worthwhile to show me I'm on the right track. If they have to be withdrawn to avoid being scratched, or from showing a big minus score while other dogs come in with plus, then my math tells me I'm going the wrong direction in dogs....

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