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-- its a free for all lets shock em /track em / score em (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928297966)

Man o man as the world changes so do the nite hunts.

I guarantee you one thing allow shockers and you better bet I will be getting 1st strike every drop

__________________
Grand Nite Ch PKC CH(3) Main Street Blueberry Jam(Autumn Oaks Final 4 Grand Nite Ch 2015) UKC world finalist 2017 Ohio State Ch 2018
Grand Nite Ch(4) PKC Silver CH Main Street Blue SS quarterfinalist 2018. Autumn Oaks Grand 16 2018. Senior Showdown semifinalists 2020. UKC top 25 World hunt 2020. PKC quarterfinalist 2020
Grand Nite Ch HOF PKC Silver Ch Heatseaker Unleash the Kraken(Grand at 15 months old) BBOA Overall 1st place X2, Tournament of Champions Finalist, National Bluetic Days overall winner, Autumn Oaks Grand 16x2 PKC SS Semi Finalist PKC State Hunt Final 4 UKC World Top 20
GRNT CH BLUES AMAZING GRACE
Trevor Hack
567-231-7413

quote:

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Originally posted by Hoosier Man1
Man o man as the world changes so do the nite hunts.

I guarantee you one thing allow shockers and you better bet I will be getting 1st strike every drop

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quote:

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Originally posted by stsjts
Lol Also you have 10secs left on the 8. BROKE! He just yipped right over there judge!

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__________________
Grand Nite Ch PKC CH(3) Main Street Blueberry Jam(Autumn Oaks Final 4 Grand Nite Ch 2015) UKC world finalist 2017 Ohio State Ch 2018
Grand Nite Ch(4) PKC Silver CH Main Street Blue SS quarterfinalist 2018. Autumn Oaks Grand 16 2018. Senior Showdown semifinalists 2020. UKC top 25 World hunt 2020. PKC quarterfinalist 2020
Grand Nite Ch HOF PKC Silver Ch Heatseaker Unleash the Kraken(Grand at 15 months old) BBOA Overall 1st place X2, Tournament of Champions Finalist, National Bluetic Days overall winner, Autumn Oaks Grand 16x2 PKC SS Semi Finalist PKC State Hunt Final 4 UKC World Top 20
GRNT CH BLUES AMAZING GRACE
Trevor Hack
567-231-7413

Shock an agresive dog at the tree and let me know how that works for the dog closest to it?

__________________
Al Brobst
po box 71
Wheeling,Mo 64688
Home of:
Red Eagle Chief

quote:

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Originally posted by cbcoonskinner
Shock an agresive dog at the tree and let me know how that works for the dog closest to it?

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I KNOW THE GOOD & THE BAD ON THIS. I JUST HAD A GOOD YOUNG DOG KILLED ON THE ROAD IN A NITE HUNT A LITTLE OVER A MONTH AGO. HAD HIS HANDLER BEEN ABLE TO SEE HE WAS GETTING CLOSE TO THE HIGH WAY HE MIGHT HAVE BEEN ABLE TO WITHDRAW & SHOCK HIM BACK. I WAS ON A CAST A COUPLE YEARS AGO AT AUTUMN OAKS A GOOD BLUE DOG WAS KILLED ON THE ROAD. I'M NOT REALLY IN FAVOR OF USING THESE IN HUNTS BUT WITH AS MANY ROADS & AS MUCH TRAFFIC AS THERE IS NOW MAYBE ITS TIME TO LOOK AT CHANGING THE RULES.

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quote:

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Originally posted by JiM
I agree 100% with that statement.
Nite hunts ARE NOT training events, they are where you show the results of all that training. I will always feel that electronics beyond your light has no place in nite hunt events. Not while the clock is running.

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A few years ago a handler could have a dog wearing an e-collar and carry the transmiter.

It never seemed to be an issue that I ever heard of.

A garmin needs to be powered on to work on a dog that gets out of pocket or treed in a place that dosent get a signal.

IMO thats as far as this should go.....Power ON, volume OFF, but never look at the screen during hunt time.

Allowing garmins to be used in scoring would create epic problems IMO.

__________________
Bad decisions make good stories.

quote:

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Originally posted by josh
A few years ago a handler could have a dog wearing an e-collar and carry the transmiter.

It never seemed to be an issue that I ever heard of.

A garmin needs to be powered on to work on a dog that gets out of pocket or treed in a place that dosent get a signal.

IMO thats as far as this should go.....Power ON, volume OFF, but never look at the screen during hunt time.

Allowing garmins to be used in scoring would create epic problems IMO.

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__________________
get in the dark and get hooked

I don't give a flip what you put on em or if you have it on. A Coon treeing son of a gun will whip that butt!! Now if somebody will send me a Coon treeing son of gun. Id show you

__________________
Michael Ghorley

Score this:
Three dogs treed. Cast is approaching tree. Dogs are growling. Handlers of Dog A and B give their dogs a little "tone" to prevent fight. Dog C is trained to come in at sound of tone. Dog C hears tone from collars of Dog A and B. Comes 100 feet off tree and meets handler.

and another:
Dog A is being scored at tree by itself. Possum is found. Handler gives dog a big shot of electricity. Dog starts squealing like a stuck pig. Dog B which has been treed [and declared treed] nearby comes off tree to discover why there is a dog screaming like it is in a fight.

and another one to think about but not score:
Cast has a spectator along that asks if they can video dogs around the tree. Camera is running when dogs treed are discovered to be on a possum. Handlers "light their dogs up". Caught on video, later posted to youtube.



I like the idea of some use of electricity [both Garmin and tritronics- on timeout] but think it may open a huge can of worms.

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I don't think anybody is in favor of " Scoring " dogs by way of the garmin. Like wise I think anybody who owns a garmin knows you'd be taking a gamble calling your dog by one. I'm of the opinion that most people who have garmins use them all week long, not as a training tool but for the piece of mind and safety it gives them and their dogs. Ever heard the saying " a locked door is only good for a honest man ?" I think those that cheat now will continue to cheat untill caught and disbarred! Hmm, what if some one calls my dog and I can prove it via the garmin? They get scratched right? Could this be why some are aganist the use of electronics? How about tradition? Well... Humans rode horses for years so let's get rid of the cars and put moccasins on instead of rubber boots. I dare say anybody that lived during that time period would agree to to trade their car for a horse now after having reaped the benefits of technology! I agree with GA Dawg I don't care what kind of gadgets another man uses, that's his choice. It doesn't make him tree coons! It doesn't matter how Many times a man trees his dog by the garmin if there's no coon there he'll minus out! If there is coon there then that only proves he's a true dog.

quote:

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Originally posted by Joseph A Clark
I don't think anybody is in favor of " Scoring " dogs by way of the garmin.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Joseph A Clark
Hmm, what if some one calls my dog and I can prove it via the garmin? They get scratched right? Could this be why some are aganist the use of electronics?

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__________________
Bad decisions make good stories.

quote:

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Originally posted by Joseph A Clark
I don't think anybody is in favor of " Scoring " dogs by way of the garmin. Like wise I think anybody who owns a garmin knows you'd be taking a gamble calling your dog by one. Hmm, what if some one calls my dog and I can prove it via the garmin? They get scratched right? Could this be why some are aganist the use of electronics?

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__________________
GRNITECH PR. RUNNIN REBEL TCSC OLD BLUE 2012 World Hunt Qualified / Top 20
NITECH PR. THE RUNNIN REBEL COWBOY JR DOG 2012 World Hunt Qualified

So it's ok to " slick handle " and get plus points but not ok to use technology to catch a cheater? Most people calibrate a compass before entering the woods. I understand the concern of e-collars, but not the tracking collars. I see very few problems with using tracking systems and feel like there could be " honor " rules put in place to help safe guard aganist cheating by way of a garmin. Well I gotta go back to work, see y'all at midnight! Good debate!

quote:

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Originally posted by Joseph A Clark
Hmm, what if some one calls my dog and I can prove it via the garmin? They get scratched right? Could this be why some are aganist the use of electronics?

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__________________
UKC Nite Champion Stylish Harry's Trixie - 2017 World Hunt Qualified - Owners - Sizemore/Martin
PKC CH/UKC GrNtCh Stylish Kate - 9/12/08 to 9/23/2016 R.I.P - Owners Sizemore/Martin
AKC/UKC NtCh Sizemore's Timber Jam Jeff 5/2/2000 to 1/22/2012 R.I.P.
AKC/UKC GrNtCh Sizemore's Timber Jam Jessi 12/21/04 to 1/21/2011 R.I.P.

Only going by my own personal experiences. Again I think cheaters will cheat regardless, I'd rather be able to keep track of my dog. I just believe there's many positive points to using them and most people just automatically have a tendency to be opposed to them because they don't like change. The slick handlers & cheats have already done enough damage to the sport and if a garmin makes some people feel a little safer, then why not. It doesn't make a dog tree or strike any more coons. I think there's a lot of different angles both good & bad by allowing the garmin, but more good than bad. I'm sure there's those out there that will try to use it to their advantage much like some people carry several stop watches around their necks. That's perfectly legal but some do it for protection and to be sure everybodies dog gets timed accordingly and others do it to try and catch another man's dog breaking time by mere seconds. There's no way the handlers and judges stop watch will be exactly the same so the handler can argue over time even if the judge was being fair. It'll be the same with the garmin only I can see where a garmin can be used for safety, cut back on hunt time etc.

As I read the artical in the bloodlines I went through several emotions. 1st shaking my head thinking you have got to be kidding me and half laughing. Then the thought of it is obvious that this person has not been to many hunts, and has no clue. To down rite anger. I myself have hunted in 8 differnt states in Big hunts in all the KC's. I have done my fair share of winning and loosing. I hunt 5 to 6 nites a week all yr round. When I choose to enter a hunt you can bet my hound is ready. Yes dogs will be dogs and sometimes it dosen't matter how long you have worked to get ready for a hunt they can do some things at the wrong time that ruin a hunt for you and maybe even the whole cast. However, I would much rather take the chance that all my training before the hunt will payoff. Why in the world would I be in favor of some person being allowed to shock his dog after treeing a possum. I do use a e-collar to train my dogs and mine is split with the coon and hears yours screaming yes they will come into me. So I take minus the same as the grinner treer. Like was stated above, shock a dog getting ill on the tree and see how bad of a dog fight you have then. Use the garmin to see who struck which dog? What about the people who don't have a garmin and collar. Guess you can't even enter a hunt now unless you have one rite? Or is it going to be the clubs responsability to have plenty of them laying around for all hunters enterd. As for using the young man that died last yr at a hunt. What right did you have to bring that up. It would have not changed a D!@# thing. You were not there you have no clue what happened that nite. He DID NOT have his dog with him. YOU should have gotten the facts from someone that was there before you ran your mouth. I was truely disapointed with UKC even printing that portion of the artical.
If you truly hunt your dogs they way they should be you know there every bark. You know when there in the ground, on a fence, at water. in thick terrine, treed slick, or treeing off game or running junk. By using my garmin for training yes I have pick these things up quicker than ever. But there is a time and place for it. A comp, nite hunt is NOT the time or place. Allowing this in the hunts is only going to help the lazy part time hunter and take away from the the true houndmen and wemen that have put the real work into already knowing what there dog is doing w/o the aid of the garmin.

quote:

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Originally posted by River Birch Run
As I read the artical in the bloodlines I went through several emotions. 1st shaking my head thinking you have got to be kidding me and half laughing. Then the thought of it is obvious that this person has not been to many hunts, and has no clue. To down rite anger. I myself have hunted in 8 differnt states in Big hunts in all the KC's. I have done my fair share of winning and loosing. I hunt 5 to 6 nites a week all yr round. When I choose to enter a hunt you can bet my hound is ready. Yes dogs will be dogs and sometimes it dosen't matter how long you have worked to get ready for a hunt they can do some things at the wrong time that ruin a hunt for you and maybe even the whole cast. However, I would much rather take the chance that all my training before the hunt will payoff. Why in the world would I be in favor of some person being allowed to shock his dog after treeing a possum. I do use a e-collar to train my dogs and mine is split with the coon and hears yours screaming yes they will come into me. So I take minus the same as the grinner treer. Like was stated above, shock a dog getting ill on the tree and see how bad of a dog fight you have then. Use the garmin to see who struck which dog? What about the people who don't have a garmin and collar. Guess you can't even enter a hunt now unless you have one rite? Or is it going to be the clubs responsability to have plenty of them laying around for all hunters enterd. As for using the young man that died last yr at a hunt. What right did you have to bring that up. It would have not changed a D!@# thing. You were not there you have no clue what happened that nite. He DID NOT have his dog with him. YOU should have gotten the facts from someone that was there before you ran your mouth. I was truely disapointed with UKC even printing that portion of the artical.
If you truly hunt your dogs they way they should be you know there every bark. You know when there in the ground, on a fence, at water. in thick terrine, treed slick, or treeing off game or running junk. By using my garmin for training yes I have pick these things up quicker than ever. But there is a time and place for it. A comp, nite hunt is NOT the time or place. Allowing this in the hunts is only going to help the lazy part time hunter and take away from the the true houndmen and wemen that have put the real work into already knowing what there dog is doing w/o the aid of the garmin.

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__________________
When it comes to coonhounds some people are easy to please. I'm Not!

GrNiteCh Ch Oak Branch's Black Bird Star
Wipeout Chesapeake Piper

TRACKERS ON DURING HUNT TIME ONLY FOR HANDLER TO REFERENCE FOR SAFETY

SHOCKER SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED DURING HUNT TIME

__________________
GRNITECH PR. RUNNIN REBEL TCSC OLD BLUE 2012 World Hunt Qualified / Top 20
NITECH PR. THE RUNNIN REBEL COWBOY JR DOG 2012 World Hunt Qualified

quote:

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Originally posted by JiM


Cheaters and slicksters ARE NOT the ones who are against using electronics in the hunts, you can be sure of that because those guys know very well and are already preparing to take advantage of the absolute treasure trove of ways the electronics will enhance their ability to cheat even more effectively. Being allowed to use the Alpha during a hunt is the cheaters wet dream.

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__________________
GRNITECH PR. RUNNIN REBEL TCSC OLD BLUE 2012 World Hunt Qualified / Top 20
NITECH PR. THE RUNNIN REBEL COWBOY JR DOG 2012 World Hunt Qualified

.

Help me understand this.
First off my goal when going to a hunt is to win by my dog doing what a coondog does, tree coons. Not hoping what it will do or what it should do. I am not going there looking for someones dog to make a mistake so I can luck up and win.

Look at the scores and you will see if you have a dog that goes out and doesn't pay the other dogs any attention and trees two to three coon, you should have a winner on most nights.

If my dog is trained to be a coondog how can someone use a shocker or GPS to beat me.
Neither the gps or shocker can put a coon in the tree. Yes it can stop a chewing dog from chewing and get it to barking but if I needed for the other dogs to chew and go silent at the tree to win, I would stay home.

Just give me some examples of how the shocker or GPS will beat a coon treeing dog.

River Run I have read what you posted and respect what you say. I still don't know how someone with a GPS is going to have an advantage.

Good point it cant

Bruce, One of my biggest hang ups is the fact that I spend 5 to 6 nites a week in the woods with my dogs. I also spend countless hours during the day in the woods trainging my pups when I have any. I do all of this and work a 50 hr a week job. I do it because I simply want the best dogs I can have. I breed raise and train all my own dogs. There for I know each and every bark my dog makes. I know far to many people that enter hunts that don't have a clue there dog is water, or fence barking or in the ground. Because they haven't done there work in the woods such as I have. They tree there dog they make big mistakes they get minus and there gone. Maybe that dog was a babble mouthed dog and got every 1st strike. Or a cover dog that stole 1st trees on my dogs locate. Yes I still win the cast but I am there to win the hunt. When there minused out I come in with a better score, if they can watch there garmin they will know there dog is on the river, or holed up and not tree them.
Second I truely think scoring based on garmin's is going to lead to a whole lot more problems in the woods. JMO

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River Birch, i admire the effort you put in your hounds. I can agree with what you said about them not calling them treed on river or in hole but the stationary rule should take care of that.
I dont think a dog barking on the river or in a hole is going beat one treeing coon.

As far as new problems using the garmins that will happen. Maybe it would lead to better judges. Thats the answer to a lot of Problems.

I really dont know what the answer will be but it is migrating towards technology being used during the cast. Maybe some knowledgabe men such as yourself can help define the rules.