UKC Forums - best concealed pistol for the money?

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Posted by john Duemmer on 09-26-2012 01:23 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by nccoonhunter197
I disagree on the ammo. I work in a field where I shoot ALOT. The " suped " up ammo only uses more powder which puts the speed and velocity near that of the 357 Sig but cheaper to shoot. I also disagree with the comment about the 45 only needing one shot. If you hit your target you only need one shot anyway. Takes practice and alot of rounds. A good exercise is get your heart rate up ( sprinting, jumping jakes, etc.l Then practice shooting two rounds quickly. Repeat until your breathing so hard you about pass out. The last two rounds just before passing out will be the ones to base your accuracy off of. If you are ever attacked or have to shoot somebody then that is close to where your heart rate will be elevated to. I also like running tactical drills like shooting from different positions and contorted angles. Create muscle memory and when put into the situation your body will react from the training.

Firstly accuracy in a self defence situation is very seldom a factor, almost always your assailant is only feet away. A heavy round that imparts alot of Ft.LBS. of knock down power on impact is your best chance to disable your attacker.

The hot ammo doesnt simply have more powder, more powder would simply blow out of the barrel on a handgun before it burned, The higher velosity ammo is produced with faster burning powder,which generates higer chamber pressure which may damage a poorly made weapon.

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Posted by nccoonhunter197 on 09-26-2012 01:52 AM:

Ok John......I guess I did not go into enough detail for some. Glad you clarified that about the powder. Tried to keep it simple. I carry a 45 Daily. Not by choice. I prefer a 40 in a full frame. I will say this, part of what you said is true. Most shot will be under 3 yards. At that distance caliber is a minor issue. Your talking point blank range. I won't say anything more. I have enough training and worked enough "shoot outs" to know accuracy does matter at any range. I've seen tens of shots fired between two people from five to twentyfive feet and neither one hit. I say again, muscle memory equals accuracy and accuracy equals dead in any caliber.

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Posted by john Duemmer on 09-26-2012 02:46 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by nccoonhunter197
Ok John......I guess I did not go into enough detail for some. Glad you clarified that about the powder. Tried to keep it simple. I carry a 45 Daily. Not by choice. I prefer a 40 in a full frame. I will say this, part of what you said is true. Most shot will be under 3 yards. At that distance caliber is a minor issue. Your talking point blank range. I won't say anything more. I have enough training and worked enough "shoot outs" to know accuracy does matter at any range. I've seen tens of shots fired between two people from five to twentyfive feet and neither one hit. I say again, muscle memory equals accuracy and accuracy equals dead in any caliber.

The term accuracy refers strictly to the weapon, not the shooters ability. That is why i said accuracy is irrelivent at close range. As a general rule a lower velosity round of large caliber will provide much more stopping power than a smaller caliber round fired at higher velosity. Those hot rounds are only more likely to kill someone in the next apartment. For personal protection my recomendation is to always carry the largest caliber weapon that you can shoot well. If you have worked many "shoot outs" i presume that you have also seen a few where the goodguy and the badguy have managed to poke some holes in each other with small caliber weapons. THE GOODGUY NEEDED A BIGGER GUN.

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Posted by Jim A. on 09-26-2012 02:50 AM:

Nothing wrong with a small frame pistol if thats what what you like. I prefer a larger pistol. More round capacity and accuracy. For me its a Sig Sauer p229 Enhanced Elite in .40s&w. 12 + 1 capacity, and the last round will fire with the clip dropped. Yes, the Sig is pricey at just over a grand, but I'm trusting it with the lives of myself and my family. Money is no object in that situation for me.

Posted by john Duemmer on 09-26-2012 03:00 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Jim A.
Nothing wrong with a small frame pistol if thats what what you like. I prefer a larger pistol. More round capacity and accuracy. For me its a Sig Sauer p229 Enhanced Elite in .40s&w. 12 + 1 capacity, and the last round will fire with the clip dropped. Yes, the Sig is pricey at just over a grand, but I'm trusting it with the lives of myself and my family. Money is no object in that situation for me.

Jim you are right about the Sigs they are very nice and very dependable. I am not a big fan of the staggered mag. models for a carry piece simply because they are harder to conceal, nice in a combat situation but for personal protection its pretty hard to imagine a need for the extra rounds,

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Posted by Jim A. on 09-26-2012 03:06 AM:

I agree, single stack magazine models are inherently easier to conceal. The double stack sig can be concealed, just not as easily. The extra rounds simply give me peace of mind. And if I happened to drop a big bluetick joke at aBBOA event, I'd need all the bullets I could get haha

Posted by EFranks on 09-26-2012 03:31 AM:

North American arms

Go to their website. I tote a naa pug 22 mag. It goes in my pocket 7 days a week. It is not much bigger than a pocket knife. You really forget about it being in your pocket. Check em out

Posted by ROBBIE BURLESON on 09-26-2012 05:57 AM:

I carry a NAA 22 mag also loaded with Hornady critical defense, i know its not the most accurate but it is very light and small and one round of the hornady and its pretty much over.

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Posted by nccoonhunter197 on 09-26-2012 07:42 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by john Duemmer
The term accuracy refers strictly to the weapon, not the shooters ability. That is why i said accuracy is irrelivent at close range. As a general rule a lower velosity round of large caliber will provide much more stopping power than a smaller caliber round fired at higher velosity. Those hot rounds are only more likely to kill someone in the next apartment. For personal protection my recomendation is to always carry the largest caliber weapon that you can shoot well. If you have worked many "shoot outs" i presume that you have also seen a few where the goodguy and the badguy have managed to poke some holes in each other with small caliber weapons. THE GOODGUY NEEDED A BIGGER GUN.

Actually you would be suprised how few people actually hit their target. Way way more misses then hits. That is why I push practice way more tan caliber. I do not disagree that a larger bullet packs more knockdown. The worst thing a person can do is shoot a gun, long gun or pistol, they are not confident in. I can shoot a 500 SW and pretty accurate but I can take my SW M&P and be way more confident in hitting my target in a stressful situation. Like I said before I carry a Glock in 45 pretty much everyday. Read my earlier post and try that exercise. That is the closest you will come to the heart rate of an actual attack victim. If you want a gun strictly for home defense use a shotgun with bird shot. You can kill the intruder and never penetrate the sheetrock. Way safer then firing a handgun round inside your home full of loved ones.

__________________
"To educate a man in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to society." -
-- Theodore Roosevelt

Brian Teague 252-649-3050

Posted by EFranks on 09-26-2012 01:53 PM:

10-4 on that!!!! I love mine

quote:
Originally posted by ROBBIE BURLESON
I carry a NAA 22 mag also loaded with Hornady critical defense, i know its not the most accurate but it is very light and small and one round of the hornady and its pretty much over.

Posted by EFranks on 09-26-2012 01:55 PM:

22 mag

Hornaday actually came up with self defense round for 22 mag. Check it out on their website. It is impressive

Posted by jdhall25 on 09-26-2012 07:06 PM:

I'm looking at the seacamp pistols. anybody heard anything about them.. Why is everybody so negative about the ruger pistols?

Posted by jdhall25 on 09-26-2012 07:09 PM:

I think I'm going to change my mind. I work at a government facility. so I cant take a gun with me.It would be pointess to carry one in my opinion. I was just looking to find one to take with me hunting because you never know what may happen. want one affordable but powerful any suggestions?

Posted by jdhall25 on 09-26-2012 07:12 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by john Duemmer
Firstly accuracy in a self defence situation is very seldom a factor, almost always your assailant is only feet away. A heavy round that imparts alot of Ft.LBS. of knock down power on impact is your best chance to disable your attacker.

The hot ammo doesnt simply have more powder, more powder would simply blow out of the barrel on a handgun before it burned, The higher velosity ammo is produced with faster burning powder,which generates higer chamber pressure which may damage a poorly made weapon.

How much was your 1911? If you dont mind me asking?

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 09-26-2012 07:34 PM:

Critical Defense 22 WMR Range Test from Hornady

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3opMF8iqC5k

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