UKC Forums - dr law ?

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-- dr law ? (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928264624)

Posted by monstermash on 08-18-2012 03:41 PM:

i have a friend lives in western va , he knows tom and knows law ,i that is one reason i would ,that man knows dogs had some great ones - and i trust what he says period.

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Posted by R.lee prater on 08-18-2012 03:51 PM:

Re: JMO

quote:
Originally posted by rghnd123
If someone wants to breed to him go for it. If they don't more power to them. I have never seen the dog in a hunt around here. He may be a Coondog maybe not. Your not getting him your getting his offspring. I don't know why so much controversy is caused over this dog. Is it jealousy or what. If Hopkins wants to stud him out let him do it. If you want a pup get one if you don't buy another pup from a different sire. I am giving a non biased answer. Its the wrong breed for me. Although I am not color blind on a good one.

WELL SAID. If we all liked the same thing it would be screwed up.

Posted by amazingcursouth on 08-18-2012 03:56 PM:

Just because a dog titles out does not mean he has proved himself. That is the lie that is being handed down to our next generation of hunters. Yes it does mean something but it does not mean its a reproducer by any means. I think the world of Mr. Paul Sheffield and he has accomplish much in the coon dog world. But take Hardwood Dan for example, he more than proved himself in the hunts over and over, BUT he was not a reproducer. So saying that a dog must prove itself in the hunt to PROVE it can reproduce is a huge misconception in the breeding world. There are some super nice studs out there that have proven themselves in the stud pen, and they were reproducers from birth, NOT after they granded out or won a major hunt.

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Posted by rrs on 08-18-2012 03:56 PM:

key to reproduction is genetics and not win slips-titles, dogs that have never been out of the pen can-will reproduce if genetics are there to do so, world champions may never ever have what it takes to reproduce their likeness, course performance is a measure and validation of what genes have the potential to do... you get what parents can produce, not always what they can do, better to see off-spring as measuring stick than the actual parents...

Posted by Redgy Ramsey on 08-18-2012 04:05 PM:

I'VE HUNTED WITH HIM. IF I OWNED HIM HE WOULD FINISH QUICK BUT TOM'S HEALTH WILL NOT LET HIM PUSH HIM IN THE HUNTS!LOUD, BETTER TRACK DOG THEN MOST OUT THERE NOW. I WILL BREED TO HIM AGAIN AND DON'T CARE IF HE'S EVER TITLED. IN 2 YEARS ASK ME ABOUT HIS AND IVY'S PUPS???? LOUD AND SMART!!!

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Posted by grntinokla on 08-18-2012 06:37 PM:

I have never hunted with Doc.I bred my Clover female to him because I thought the bloodlines would match up well.I met Tom for the 1st time when we got them bred.He actually brought Doc to Oklahoma to breed because I had a previous obligation on the day she was ready.I now have spoken with him several times and am proud to consider him to be my friend.I know for sure that Redgy knows what a coondog is.My pups are,like Redgy's,LOUD AND SMART,and,from what I have seen so far,I will also be breeding to him again.

Posted by Knox on 08-18-2012 06:40 PM:

There you go guys........

quote:
Originally posted by Redgy Ramsey
I'VE HUNTED WITH HIM. IF I OWNED HIM HE WOULD FINISH QUICK BUT TOM'S HEALTH WILL NOT LET HIM PUSH HIM IN THE HUNTS!LOUD, BETTER TRACK DOG THEN MOST OUT THERE NOW. I WILL BREED TO HIM AGAIN AND DON'T CARE IF HE'S EVER TITLED. IN 2 YEARS ASK ME ABOUT HIS AND IVY'S PUPS???? LOUD AND SMART!!!

A truthful answer coming from an honest man, that happens to know what a COONDOG is.....!!!

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Posted by Mike Knuckols on 08-18-2012 09:52 PM:

Re: dr law ?

quote:
Originally posted by clintonmesserjr
just curious to why alot of people are breeding to him? as far as i can tell he is just a pr dog with no pkc money just curious?so he must be a coondog!

The pups Ive heard from different females have BIG LOUD BAWL MOUTHS on the tree and are easy on the eyes . Bold puppies. I have a litter that is 4 days old here that I have high hopes for 1 male out of Law and Redgy's Ivy female that is very loud at 3 months and a 1 year old female that is very loud and full of go and intelligence . Puppies are a chance and after hunting Lipper bred hounds for 20 plus years thats where ill put my money and time . Dr Law is a son of Lipper with that Drive and Mouth right here in my back yard . The man that owns him knows more about breeding and what it takes to make a top hound than most . He isnt charging a rediculous stud fee and is willing to do whatever it takes to help You . Time will tell on his pups Im pretty sure they will suit most . Im not knocking anyones stud dog I just feel bringing this old blood back to compliment these modern walkers will be lights out .

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Posted by Matt McKinney on 08-19-2012 01:12 AM:

I don't know tom or his dogs but there is no reason to be disrespectful to the man. If you don't like law or think he is any count you can make the simple choice of not breeding to him or owning a pup out of him. Tom has had some nice dogs in the past and there is no reason to disrespect him or run his dogs into the ground

Posted by crossbblues on 08-19-2012 03:50 AM:

I am much impressed with thesmarts that my p pup out of Law and Ivy has. She has a loud loud squal mouth,out going pup. always curious.She is already tracking the squirrelsg in the yard . nose to the ground, always busy and very easy on the eyes.

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Posted by BIG HAROLD on 08-19-2012 04:41 AM:

Just because he's out of the Litter of Setback, doesn't mean he can't reproduce!!

Posted by MikeR on 08-19-2012 11:15 AM:

People will breed to him because they've bought into Hopkins Lipper hype and BS for 30 years.

According to many in another KC the Law dog was hunted in several hunts and never came in with + points

Some people breed to hype, BS, & papers for $$ and others breed to improve the dogs and lines. You be the judge......

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Posted by monstermash on 08-19-2012 11:36 AM:

WHEN YOU DO AS MUCH FOR THE WALKER BREED AS WHAT HE HAS ,THEN I THINK PEOPLE CAN COME ON HERE AND TRY TO BEAT SOMEONE DOWN ---lack of knowlodge - lack of smarts and lack of eduction = dumb dumbs one send button at a time ?
MR HOPKINS i love me some lipper !!!!!
yes i have spoken with tom a couple times , he knows is stuff !

to you sir ,my hat is off to you!!!!

Posted by wvhoundsman on 08-19-2012 12:48 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by monstermash
WHEN YOU DO AS MUCH FOR THE WALKER BREED AS WHAT HE HAS ,THEN I THINK PEOPLE CAN COME ON HERE AND TRY TO BEAT SOMEONE DOWN ---lack of knowlodge - lack of smarts and lack of eduction = dumb dumbs one send button at a time ?
MR HOPKINS i love me some lipper !!!!!
yes i have spoken with tom a couple times , he knows is stuff !

to you sir ,my hat is off to you!!!!

agreed

Posted by josh on 08-19-2012 01:09 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by MikeR
People will breed to him because they've bought into Hopkins Lipper hype and BS for 30 years.

According to many in another KC the Law dog was hunted in several hunts and never came in with + points

Some people breed to hype, BS, & papers for $$ and others breed to improve the dogs and lines. You be the judge......

Yup.....No one would look twice at the same dog with a different pedigree, Its just proof of how absessed with pedigrees some are and how they drive the coonhound world.

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Posted by GA DAWG on 08-19-2012 02:11 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by josh
Yup.....No one would look twice at the same dog with a different pedigree, Its just proof of how absessed with pedigrees some are and how they drive the coonhound world.

No one would look twice with the same dog. Different owner either. I do like a loud squall mouth though. I might have to check into this stuff.

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Posted by amazingcursouth on 08-19-2012 02:20 PM:

if you don't like lipper dogs, mr hopkins, or law its fine. but you need to go out and shoot your hound in the head because more than likely it has lipper or a dog with lipper in his pedigree. No one has ever said you have to hunt a dog off of Law or breed to him. And as far as hype, I know of many men who have built the hype, and you may just blow one of his squallers. But i have found this out, lots of folks on here have been hunting a total maybe 5 yrs and don't have a dang clue to what is really going on. pay your dues then MAYBE, JUST MAYBE you will have something to talk about

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Posted by nccoonhunter197 on 08-19-2012 02:22 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by MikeR j
People will breed to him because they've bought into Hopkins Lipper hype and BS for 30 years.

According to many in another KC the Law dog was hunted in several hunts and never came in with + points

Some people breed to hype, BS, & papers for $$ and others breed to improve the dogs and lines. You be the judge......

And of course what we hear is always the truth. Just like the giy who always says " I have never seen my dog do that. " We also know if it is on the internet it must be true. I have seen the commercial on tv. As far as results on Dr Law we all will have to wait and see if he can reproduce. He doesn't have to be a coondog to prove he can reproduce, his offspring have to be coondogs to prove that.

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Posted by monstermash on 08-19-2012 03:48 PM:

get them brian they need to put some miles you put in the woods ,when you coming out to hunt with mark and i -miss the fun .

Posted by josh on 08-19-2012 04:44 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by GA DAWG
I might have to check into this stuff.

Very few of us have owned a dog in the last 20 years that dosent have lipper in its pedigree somewhere.....Im betting you have already checked this stuff out.

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Posted by walker1978 on 08-19-2012 05:51 PM:

some peolpe dont understand the whole reason behind breeding for whats on the papers. if you dont look at what in a dogs pedigree past the 4th gen or take the time to know what the traits are of the other dogs in the pedigree then you are only hurting your self and the breed. these old guys like mr. hopkins that have been doing this for a long time know what the traits are and know how to get what they want . look at a lot of these brood bitches. never titled but yet there pups are titled and do a good job. well that is because of whats on there papers. you dont breed for titles you breed for traits. law has got all the traits in his papers to make coondogs. now every one knows that he might not be a reproducer but there is only one way to find out and that is to breed him. maybe mr. hopkins just whats to see what he will reproduce before he wast years on a dog that doesnt. but i think he will. besides look at the % of the top reproducers , really isnt that great anyhow.with rat attack being the highest at onlt 22% think about it that means out of every litter he has only 1 or 2 out of a litter made coondogs. yes not all were comp hunted im sure but eighter way thats not that impressive. look on the female side and you got brood bitches with that good of a % on reproducing coondogs. my piont is it doesnt mean a thing if law is titled or not. mr. hopkins allready made his mark in the walker breed with lipper so i think he would know what he is doing and if he think law will be a good one then thats good enough for me. besides that it is his dog and he can breed him to a weener dog and that isnt gonna hurt any of us one bit.

Posted by joey on 08-19-2012 06:12 PM:

Your right the dogs on the paper mean something. However that does not mean that it is passed on. The only window we have to the genetics a dog has is his traits. In the woods and out. Like you said the percentages of any stud are not that great and lippers weren�t as good as a lot of them. So what are the chances that this is the one? I personally don�t care if all of you breed to him and I wish you and Mr. Hopkins the best of luck. Let�s give credit where it is due though. Lipper was a product of Joe houses breeding and most of his success in the stud pen was after he was sold.

Mr. Hopkins has a little Timothy Ball in him when it comes to advertisement. He has been out of it for 20 years and came back to the world of internet coon hunting. 20 years ago all you got from blowing smoke in an ad was some grumbling in local areas that you never heard. The internet gives immediate response to all the bull and it didn�t go very well for him. Remember the ads on Cash? Never lost a cast? That�s because if he was not going to win he was withdrawn in the last minute and that was not considered a loss. Were most of you even around 20 years ago to remember all this?

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Posted by GA DAWG on 08-19-2012 06:34 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by josh
Very few of us have owned a dog in the last 20 years that dosent have lipper in its pedigree somewhere.....Im betting you have already checked this stuff out.

I've never had one it showed up on its papers. Never had the big lipper mouth I hear about. I don't however like a bawl mouth tree dog like I've saw mentioned on this post but Id try a lil lipper just to say I have

Who was lipper out of anyhow? Since we are talking way back. How far back honestly do folks think a strain holds together when its bred to this and that. Where do you give the credit?

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Posted by smokin-1-mo on 08-19-2012 08:18 PM:

LIPPER
LAWYER
ADIOS LIGHTNING
CASH

JUST SOME OF THE DOGS TOM HAD ENOUGH CONFIDENCE IN TO OFFER AT STUD ,IF HE IS OFFERING LAW TO THE PUBLC I WOULD SAY HE THINKS HE WILL MAKE HIS MARK AS THESE OTHERS DID.....

Posted by Mike Knuckols on 08-19-2012 08:24 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by joey
Your right the dogs on the paper mean something. However that does not mean that it is passed on. The only window we have to the genetics a dog has is his traits. In the woods and out. Like you said the percentages of any stud are not that great and lippers weren�t as good as a lot of them. So what are the chances that this is the one? I personally don�t care if all of you breed to him and I wish you and Mr. Hopkins the best of luck. Let�s give credit where it is due though. Lipper was a product of Joe houses breeding and most of his success in the stud pen was after he was sold.

Mr. Hopkins has a little Timothy Ball in him when it comes to advertisement. He has been out of it for 20 years and came back to the world of internet coon hunting. 20 years ago all you got from blowing smoke in an ad was some grumbling in local areas that you never heard. The internet gives immediate response to all the bull and it didn�t go very well for him. Remember the ads on Cash? Never lost a cast? That�s because if he was not going to win he was withdrawn in the last minute and that was not considered a loss. Were most of you even around 20 years ago to remember all this?

I was and have been hunting Lipper bred hounds for 25 years . Im from Marshall Texas the same town as where Tommy and Lipper lived at that time . Lipper, Lawyer, Cash ,Lightning , numerous others. Joe House breeding Id say he has and is carrying it on very nicely wouldnt You ? As for Cash Id give YOUR left testicle to have another one out of him lol. I guess I dont understand the hate . Ive never heard Tommy or Timmothy Ball run down another man or his stud EVER as he has been attacked on here . It takes a really good hound and some breaks here and there to do the winning Tommy has but he always has had a winner he must have put a pretty good spanking on some of these haters for them to feel free to trash him on here . True if You have something You want to sell or promote You must advertise if You dont believe it dont breed to him .

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