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-- Spring Creek Rock (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928255442)

Yes, yes and sometimes yes.

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Re: Rock threw a a gritty hound in almost

quote:

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Originally posted by cripple creek
every litter. several that I hunted with could and would today be considered mean. Just like the Rat dogs today, you needed to know how to train them. I think he was one of the first to throw a lot of tree dogs and really overall balanced dog, but you didnt have to wait on them to be 2 years old to start treeing. Most other studs in his era through some good some bad based on the female, but Rock could be bred to a brood female and throw balanced coon dogs.
I liked Radar more than rock himself because he threw tremendous hounds in almost all his litters. He could make up for a bad female as well and throw whole litters of coondogs from average females.
He was what I called a prepotent stud, which means he throws himself or better in all his litters. My experience in breeding these walkers and I have been doing it for way over thirty years is that the female generally throws about 60 % or better of the traits in the pups no matter what stud they are bred to. However the few studs I have seen where the male throws more of the genetics traits in the pups than the female was Spring Creek Rock, Spring Creek Radar, Sackett Jr. and Rat Attack. Their DNA was so strong you could see the traits several generations down. You had to actually breed the traits out.

Ill give you a case in point. Houses Clint threw some nice dogs. He even threw the immortal houses lipper, but he had to be bred to just the right lineage of a female to get exceptional results. I saw him bred to one of the best natural and most complete honest coondogs that ever lived who was strong, strong finley river bred and the entire litter was a complete bust. Non of them could tree a coon at any age.
She was later bred to a finley river bred dog and threw generations of reproducing males and females that are the backbones of a well respected kennel still operating over 20 years later.
One of the studs listed above bred to this female would have at least thrown a majority of outstanding pups from this same cross.

The one thing that is a missing question in this equation and conversation on Rock is this: Does freezing the semen do something to the DNA structure and change the reproduction qualites of their offspring.
Limo was a case study in this. He was bred to several females and only a handful of nice dogs were produced from it. The Lipper semen that produced Cade and TJ's Stylish lipper only time will prove if their offspring can reproduce.
Old Rock threw dogs that reproduced dogs that could reproduce.
Lipper threw dogs that produced outstanding dogs, you could find reproducing studs several generations down the line but Limo couldnt do it and Cade should have done it and he is almost 11 and you dont see a book full of studs from him.
You see my question here?
I am not knocking anyones dogs, its just the jury is still out on is can the frozen semen produce dogs that show grandsons and great grandsons being nice reproducers.

Thats my 2 cents worth for what that is worth.

We can only experiment and time will tell. Its worth it if someone has the money to do it.

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Does anybody on here have a Spring Creek Rock female? The reason I ask I have one straw from Elimanator dog. Must have vet that knows what there doing. If interested and your close to upper Mi send me pm. Would do for pick of litter and one other pup.

The walker breed shouldn't be going backwards fellows it supposed to be moving forwards. There are a lot of dogs today that would reproduce a lot better hounds than rock. I'm sure most of the walkers have a shot of him in there pedigree already anyway. 60 percent of it is whether the pup gets in the right hands or not. I have a hound at my house u could breed to for free and I'd bet u would be happy with the results. Most of the dogs u see today are born already looking up kinda curious if they were like that 40 years ago.

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Rock

I started coonhuntin with my Dad and his friends as a 9 year old kid in the Early 70s Around 1978 My Brother got A ROCK PUP FOR ALMOST NOTHING The pup was A JUNK RUNNING FOOL THAT COULD CATCH A RED FOX But He was A TREMENDOUS COONDOG aswell that STARTED TREEING COONS AT 6 MONTHS OLD He Had A Monster Locate and WAS AHEAD OF HIS TIME ....He had NO REVERSE and NO QUIT IN HIM, DIDNT NEED ANYTHING TO TAKE HIM HUNTING AND HE WAS ALWAYS UPFRONT WHATEVER HE RAN ... When he Located a tree HE WOULD HIT IT LIKE A BOLT OF LIGHTNING YOU COULD HEAR HIM FOR EVER I only hunted with one son from Rock but couple the old timers AROUND HERE Were to tight to spend money TALKED ABOUT HIM FOR MANY YEARS In my opinion Rock had alot to offer.... SPRING CREEK ROCK,HILLBILLY MAC and HOUSES LIPPER WERE THE 80S BEST I owned pups from all 3 NONE OTHERS COMPARED TO THE ROCK PUP I HAD Not even close

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Anybody ever have anything with Rock crossed on Diamond Jim or maybe Tom Tom? I know Burgess Big John was off Tom Tom and a Jim female. Or maybe some Deamon and Rock bred stuff?

THE DOG IS ROCKS DADDY

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