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Facts on Pen

He has sired 4 litters.
The Oldest is a year and a half old.
We own a female that is out of the first litter that is running and treeing on her own and has been for over a year.
He was bred to the same female again and the pups are coon crazy.
She is Southern Knight bred.
I bought PEN in December of 2004.
His first litter here is from a GrNite female they are 2 months old.
His second litter is from Gary Utchman's female.
He has bred two other females since then. Both Hunt Titled well bred females.
He has sired 22 pups so far.
My goal this year was to breed 5 well bred females. So far he has bred 4.

Scott

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Gone but not forgotten:

GrNiteCh Oklahoma Blue Creek (Ch GrNiteCh Goodsons Rowdy Bocephus X GrNiteCh GrCh TP's Dizzy Dot)
GrNiteCh Mose's Pink Floyd (GrNiteCh Dean's Blue Mose X GrNiteCh B&D's Blue Ruby) Hollis-VH
GrNiteCh GrCh Bullet II's Code Blue Cricket (GrCh GrNiteCh 'PR' Twin Springs Runnin Bullet II X NiteCh Ch JJ's Code Blue Jenny)
Ch GrNiteCh Smokey River Blue Tramp II (GrCh GrNiteCh Smokey River Jean's Blue Tramp X Ch NiteCh Misty River Blue Doll IV)
GrNiteCh GrCh Vining's Hammerhead (Dual Grand Twin Springs Runnin Bullet II X Dual Grand Vining Blue Mollie)
GrNiteCh Ch Uchtmans Blue Logan (GrNiteCh Gene's Blue Newton X ChNiteCh Smiley's Blue Lady)
GrNiteCh GrCh Makin' Music Banjo (GrNiteCh Washburn Valley Blue Drip X GrNiteCh GrCh Razor Ridge Unstable Mable)
GrNiteCh. Uncle Pen (GrNiteCh South Shore Drive Blue Kev X GrNiteCh Frosty's Fancy)

want to make it 5 scott

Guys and Gals, the best way to get the next top blue stud dog is to have a hound with a decent pedigree, an above average looking hound, a dog that reproduces pretty good hounds, win several large hunts, win the UKC world hunt and have the stud fee at $500 or above. Breeding junk promotes more junk. It takes a good hound, a better handler and lady luck in your corner to win large hunts. Which one of these hounds has won several large hunts? They may be on their way.

I also think another overlooked stud is Treeslammin Hill Billy.

quote:

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Originally posted by blueticker
Guys and Gals, the best way to get the next top blue stud dog is to have a hound with a decent pedigree, an above average looking hound, a dog that reproduces pretty good hounds, win several large hunts, win the UKC world hunt and have the stud fee at $500 or above. Breeding junk promotes more junk. It takes a good hound, a better handler and lady luck in your corner to win large hunts. Which one of these hounds has won several large hunts? They may be on their way.

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How did Southern Knight ever reproduce? He was the sire of one of the best most natural dogs ive ever been to the woods with! bar none! but i never seen much else out of him? How was he bred again it been way to long ago.............LOL

There are a few Southern Knight dogs around here. A couple of them made night champion and a couple more could if they were put in the hunts. I don't think any of them made Grand and probably won't.

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quote:

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Originally posted by rampage
you people will realize one day Davis white river bogie is where its at he is just not publisized like alot of the dogs on here are but one day you all will see

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Mad Dog Midwest. Proud member of Team Mad Dog. Thanks to our founders Tim and Paul Vaughn as well as Dave Dean for gracing our kennels with such fabulous bloodlines to work with. Treedogs by birth, coondogs by the grace of God!

blueticker

wasn't that a description of Ray execpt for the world (so far)?

I

Like to see so many different names being mentioned here..Father time tells the tale of how dogs reproduce both male and female... Ability and pedigrees are there, now lets see where the reproduction factor falls and attempt to capture that in future generations... Females of the past I wish I got a pup from are,,, Sebastian's Penny, Bragg's Miss America, Adkin's Blue Dog Vonnie III and Richmond's Pat..

Current female,,, Sturtz's Sadie, she impresses me...as a mama....

Don't count out Sturtz's Ben in the stud pen, there is one of his offspring out here and he is a TREE DOG !!!

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Fan of the of the Bragg and Vaughn Blues !! TREE OLD HUSSLER in Memory of DOC Householder... Rest in Peace Rev. Kenneth Adkins my dear friend !! Home Will's Creek Savage Sioux-Zee!!
Yeah, I competition hunt !! All Fall and Winter long.. My Blues compete with the local coon.. My Blues win a ton !!! We use and recommend MOONSHINER LIGHTS, Peggs , Ok.

I WOULD SAY TO WATCH FOR POUNDER. MOST OF HIS PUPS ARE STILL YOUNG. HE IS NOT EVEN 5 YEARS OLD YET. I DOUBT THAT HE WILL EVER GET BRED AS MUCH AS ALOT OF DOGS, BUT SO FAR HE HAS ONLY BRED QUALITY FEMALES. THAT IS WHAT MAKES A GREAT STUD DOG.

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MACKIE MANNS SR

Studs

Uncle Pen
Bullet II
Jet 8
Raisen Cain
Bo Bo
Screwey Lewey
Bogie
Bullet's Runnin Rattler
Short Mtn Blue Buck
Tree Slammin Hill Billy
Southern Knight
Sturtz's Ben
Pounder
Appels Bullet

Some of these are younger and some a little older but one thing is for sure, if you don't breed good females to them they probably won't reproduce. Just breeding to anything to get 100 puppies or not turning down poor females is not good for our breed. Don't let a post like this divide us blue dog people. I would buy a dog off of any of theses studs if it suited me and I could care less on the breeding and like wise I would cull a Pen pup in a heart beat if it were useless. If someone is looking for a dog Mackie has a NiteCh male off of Pounder and Lou for sale on the board. If I were looking It sure would have interested me. If us Blue guys do not stick together we will not be as succesful as we could be. If there is a good stud that you can afford to breed a good female to breed to him no matter what the bloodline. If you look at some of the most succesful crosses in the bluetick breed alot of times there is no reason why they should have worked from a line breeding standpoint. It was because they bred good males to good females. I hope all of these males put their mark in Bluetick History.


Sincerely,
Scott

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Gone but not forgotten:

GrNiteCh Oklahoma Blue Creek (Ch GrNiteCh Goodsons Rowdy Bocephus X GrNiteCh GrCh TP's Dizzy Dot)
GrNiteCh Mose's Pink Floyd (GrNiteCh Dean's Blue Mose X GrNiteCh B&D's Blue Ruby) Hollis-VH
GrNiteCh GrCh Bullet II's Code Blue Cricket (GrCh GrNiteCh 'PR' Twin Springs Runnin Bullet II X NiteCh Ch JJ's Code Blue Jenny)
Ch GrNiteCh Smokey River Blue Tramp II (GrCh GrNiteCh Smokey River Jean's Blue Tramp X Ch NiteCh Misty River Blue Doll IV)
GrNiteCh GrCh Vining's Hammerhead (Dual Grand Twin Springs Runnin Bullet II X Dual Grand Vining Blue Mollie)
GrNiteCh Ch Uchtmans Blue Logan (GrNiteCh Gene's Blue Newton X ChNiteCh Smiley's Blue Lady)
GrNiteCh GrCh Makin' Music Banjo (GrNiteCh Washburn Valley Blue Drip X GrNiteCh GrCh Razor Ridge Unstable Mable)
GrNiteCh. Uncle Pen (GrNiteCh South Shore Drive Blue Kev X GrNiteCh Frosty's Fancy)

Re: Studs

quote:

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Originally posted by Scott VH
Uncle Pen
Bullet II
Jet 8
Raisen Cain
Bo Bo
Screwey Lewey
Bogie
Bullet's Runnin Rattler
Short Mtn Blue Buck
Tree Slammin Hill Billy
Southern Knight
Sturtz's Ben
Pounder
Appels Bullet

Some of these are younger and some a little older but one thing is for sure, if you don't breed good females to them they probably won't reproduce. Just breeding to anything to get 100 puppies or not turning down poor females is not good for our breed. Don't let a post like this divide us blue dog people. I would buy a dog off of any of theses studs if it suited me and I could care less on the breeding and like wise I would cull a Pen pup in a heart beat if it were useless. If someone is looking for a dog Mackie has a NiteCh male off of Pounder and Lou for sale on the board. If I were looking It sure would have interested me. If us Blue guys do not stick together we will not be as succesful as we could be. If there is a good stud that you can afford to breed a good female to breed to him no matter what the bloodline. If you look at some of the most succesful crosses in the bluetick breed alot of times there is no reason why they should have worked from a line breeding standpoint. It was because they bred good males to good females. I hope all of these males put their mark in Bluetick History.


Sincerely,
Scott

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__________________
It takes a big man to cry; it takes an even bigger man to laugh at that man.

I will have to agree John. Scott that post made alot of sense. Everyone who breeds should read that post.

__________________
STRAIGHTDRIVE KENNEL'S

Owner / Handler:
Larry Puckett

HOME OF:
GR. CH."PR"DEADLY PETEY UKC 1st. place( SIRE=Gr.Nt.Ch.Ch.PR Mc's Deadly Hitman / Dam=Ch.Nt.Ch.PR Beard's Stylish Magic) (Gone but Not Forgotten)

GR.NT.CH PR Spades Nite Heat Sky (Gone But Not Forgotten)

i agree with you scott lots of people are kennel blind for instance alot of people will not hunt a dog out anything but there stuff and so called stud dog me i have a nice dog my self. reproducer who knows one things for sure i want a coon dog no matter the pedigree so if my dog wont produce it wot hurt my feelings a bit to hunt a pen,bobo, bullet pup or what ever. my opinion would be that if every one felt the way i did you would you would sooner or later find the next great reproducer .just my 2 cents

quote:

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Originally posted by JESSICA GRUENER
I put my money on Bullett's Runnin Rattler, time will tell.

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__________________
Tree Jar'n Black and Tans
Home of Tree Jar'n Coonhound Kennels


319-201-8445

a stud doesnt need to be great for me to want to breed to him. when i think of great, i think of pushing 10%, with a high total number of grands and nites, such as hawk, bullet, rambo II, jet 5, spanky, cheif, ect ect.

i might want to bred to a uchtman stud, but at that particular time there might not be a proven superior one out there, im still going to bred to an uchtman dog if thats what i need to do at that point in time. this is made possible by having nice females. a great stud is going to reproduce soem nice pups from about anything because he is a dominant reproducer. thats what i want to see in a stud, the same dominant traits showing up in his offspring. that way, you know what to expect.

between the ramboII and bullet studs, we are going to see some really nice reproducers imo. i feel rattler is the most proven of all of them at this point. I bred my first gyp to him and im buying a pup off him as we speak. i also feel the studs bred like rattler(bullet x jet 5 gyps) are going to reproduce also. such as runnin gun and appels bullet. i have a female off of a littermate to apels bullet that made nite ch real easy and can flat get it done and she just turned 2. more reason to beleive they will reproduce as a whole. Im going to make a big bet on bullet II and send all my females there at least once. RC might be the special reprodicer also, you cant argue with his numbers up to this point. another bullet stud that i really like what i heard about him and his pedigree, is the tuff stuff dog. dont have any firsthand knowledge but he has some blood that is tough to find up that close.

Right now, if i want rambo blood, its the bobo dog. he can turn out to be something special. i think in due time a rambo stud will seperate himself from the pack. the best bet is to get it from ritchie mcdonalds lil bit, you are basically getting stud dog quality in a female.

and no, im not really qualified to have opinions on this discussion

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

rance

whats the tuff stuff dog bred like, I also think bullet II is gonna have to be reckoned with in the stud pen. I own two from 2 diff. gyps.

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" OLD' DIAMOND JIM " LONG LIVE THE KING OF COONHOUNDS.

he is directly off bullet and grand nite gyp that has blue run gentleman and kirbys blue spike up close. all grand except cheif

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

????

where is he located ? what state

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" OLD' DIAMOND JIM " LONG LIVE THE KING OF COONHOUNDS.

wisconsin, ron behne owns him, the only pup that lived out of that litter. he is breeding him to his nt ch misery female later this year, she is directly off tramp and a nt ch cheif female. if i had the room i would be getting one. who knows, i might have to make room.

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

Really Good Post

Good information passing back and forth. Just a thougt I have had, how much of the percentages to you think really have to do with the stud and really more to do with all the other circumastances involved.

Pup gets hit on road
Poor trianing
Goes to pleasure hunter
Really bad handler
female never gets hunted/breed only


I would think that some breeders that over the years keep reporducing reproducers, have a system to get the pups in the right hands and that has as much to do with it as the stud/female as far as the percentages go. I know this has nothing to do with what kind of pups they throw.

For example A very well knowen breeder such as utchmans, smiley, and so on when they have a litter of thier own they are going to have alot of interst from lost of people they will be able to pick and choose where the pups go. 8 pups go to 8 very serious comp hunters and handlers and you are way ahead of the game.

Enough on my worthless thoughts..well one more next great stud dog.....


Brian Lucas ..........BOBO.......He is getting his shot with a lot of nice females.

BOBO X LITTLE BIT could be the next whole litter of coon dogs.

__________________
Ryan Schweizer
Knightstown, Indiana
765-465-8102
Home of:
GRCH, NTCH NGRCH 'PR' Shelton's Betty Lou (Strothers Rambo X Sheltons Sky)
GRNTCH CH 'PR' Ceder Creek Blu Bell( Heavy Rambo Bred)

www.hoosiertreedogs.org

sm rv
tramp
geronimo
pop a top
sheltons sm rv fly

bullet
rattler
bullet II
Blaze
Rc

uchtman
JJ
Drip
Max

rambo
bo bo
strothers rambo
bogie
screwy lewy

spanky
pounder
bach

jet
jet 7
shorty

hammer
hammer 18

various
towash creek smoke
lil arkie

there are other dogs than this for sure, especially ones that are just now getting pups on the ground, but for what its worth, here is my short list as of now for various lines.

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

blueballing,

you hit the nail on the head, the established breeders with a big demand for their pups are way ahead of the game. they get the choice females and the pups go to top hunters/trainers.

as for someone starting out, it can be a self fullfilling prophecy, they have to breed to ok to bad females cause thats all they can get till they prove themselves, and by having to bred to poor quality females the pups dont turn out, thus they never get good females brought to them "cause they dont reproduce."

i think if all you want is to hit the reproducers list, with a decent stud and with acess to some decent to nice females and good hunters, you can get on the list if you just bred enough to get 100 pups. it will take awhile, but the dog will eventually show up in the back of the mag somewhere in the top 10. thats why I am only keeping females right now, so when i do get a kennel full of nice gyps, and i come across a nice male, i wont have to go out looking for nice females to bred to.

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

Re: Really Good Post

quote:

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Originally posted by blueballing
Good information passing back and forth. Just a thougt I have had, how much of the percentages to you think really have to do with the stud and really more to do with all the other circumastances involved.

Pup gets hit on road
Poor trianing
Goes to pleasure hunter
Really bad handler
female never gets hunted/breed only

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__________________
Tree Jar'n Black and Tans
Home of Tree Jar'n Coonhound Kennels


319-201-8445