UKC Forums - how do you get a dog to stand in one spot at tree?

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Posted by RBursby on 02-18-2010 07:35 PM:

jay

i would not put up with that!!!!just give her to me and ill take care of her.....lol ....you hunting to night??? lol

Posted by elvis on 02-18-2010 07:46 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by buckeyebuck
thanks for the replies. I have a young female thats a stay put tree dog, reel accurate so far. She is just all over the tree when u get there runs circles around the tree hops around the tree just wonedering if theres was any way to calm her down. Thanks again

well by all means dont pet her up and get her even more revved up. if anything tie her back and dont even talk to her, or get a little switch and switch her in the nose everytime she jumps. try to teach her not to jump up on the tree just like you would teach her not to jump up on you.

most of the dogs we hunt today have got too much tree in them to be petting and rib slappin them and causing their eyes to glaze over and to lose their mind. I believe it is the single biggest reason for the many empty tree and poor tree manners problems we see in so many hounds today.

the dogs we used to hunt years ago we had to beg, pet and plead with to get them to tree. when the breeders bred all the natural treeing instinct into them we had to change our training methods accordingly.

Posted by John D on 02-18-2010 08:02 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by buckeyebuck
thanks for the replies. I have a young female thats a stay put tree dog, reel accurate so far. She is just all over the tree when u get there runs circles around the tree hops around the tree just wonedering if theres was any way to calm her down. Thanks again

Here's a video of a young female I'm starting that might be a little like yours?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOn7cYK49IQ

The first tree she treed on she jacked it something fierce and from then on I've been tying her low with just enough slack in the leash so she could stand on the tree, but not jump. In this video I had nothing to tie her down to.

I think I made some progress with her. Even in this video she is not as violent as she was. Last night she was treed for awhile by herself and she was getting up and down from the tree but staying in one spot.

So, I think you can change these dogs some when they are first starting but if a habit gets set in, its going to be awful hard to change. I also believe that pups can be very wound up and as they get some experience they settle down a little on their own.

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Posted by wayne f on 02-18-2010 08:18 PM:

i pet them up after leaving the tree elvis is correct petting then on the tree only makes them more excited. i have a jack pup that was jacking the tree untill i took a strong bungee cord put a snap on both ends and tied him at the tree this pup is smart and in 3 times jetting jerked back down he quit jacking he also chewed at the tree out of frustration because he couldn't get to the coon but quit when i hunted him hard and kept him tired as soon as i get him broke off bobcats he is going to be one good hound it's hard to get him broke off the bobs as they aren't plentiful but there are some around and if he picks up the scent he will pursue it

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Posted by Dan Dogs on 02-18-2010 08:20 PM:

i think making them tree longer while correcting them helps too..let them get wore down to the point they decide barking is less painful then jumping..i use a tritronic on #2 and just enuff to make them twitch a little..but it must be done before it gets to be a habit..

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Posted by ov_blues on 02-18-2010 08:21 PM:

My suggestion is to handle the dog at the tree the same way you would anywhere else. Just because the dog is treed doesn't give it a free pass to not handle. Once a dog handles well at the tree, a lot of the craziness goes away too.

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Posted by buckeyebuck on 02-19-2010 01:02 AM:

rod

lol no way.

Waynef. the female im talking about is also out of jack.

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Posted by wayne f on 02-19-2010 02:50 AM:

buckeyebuck

the jack pups are something else there supersmart and learn quick but they sure are wired 220 i have had more fun with this hound than any pup i started sometimes i think he is smarter than me a buddy saw him one night when he got deep and was running a bob he ran that cat over 3 hours i just couldn't get to him as as soon as i was getting close to zap him he and the cat were off again i finally gave up and went home he pissed everybody around here off he is one of the loudest hounds i have ever heard he rocks the mountain and when he is treed i hate to go to him he hurts your ears. i sure aren't rich but there isn't enough money to buy him he is one good looking saddleback blue.
my best advice is to hunt them hard and hunt them often and then and only then they settle down. my friend had a jack pup that his young son won 2 hunts in a row with then the dog got sick and died from blasto the vets around here never picked up on it untill he was too far gone. i'm a bif fan of the rooster hounds but these mainstreet hounds are something else you got to love them

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Posted by Lowell Lynn on 02-19-2010 03:02 AM:

They most definitely can be worked with on tree style. I have cleaned up so many tree jacking,bark grabbing,vine hanging nuisance type tree dogs I could not give a count.Any dog that left here that I started or trained stands in one spot, back feet on the ground, straight up the tree tree dog. It can and has been done many many times.

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Posted by Dwils on 02-19-2010 04:57 PM:

Re: Re: how do you get a dog to stand in one spot at tree?

quote:
Originally posted by treberta
Handle them as soon as you get to them. Shorten the leash up and encourage them to get up on the tree. Smack the tree with youre hands and get them fired up to stand on the tree. Most dogs it can't be taught they just naturally do it but some can be taught.

smacking the tree normally causes jacking . come on man, its just common sense.

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Posted by on 02-19-2010 05:15 PM:

Daniel, you hunt'in tonite? Let me know. We need you to get some pics of Kate on the tree. I'll bring the hotdogs......

Posted by on 02-19-2010 05:19 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by SEMO
If anyone figures out how to do this please let me know because i'd like to teach mine to sit on his butt about 3-4 feet off the tree.

My female does it if they're jockeying for position. I love it. Less arguments, and I normally know where to start shining

Posted by treberta on 02-19-2010 05:22 PM:

Re: Re: Re: how do you get a dog to stand in one spot at tree?

quote:
Originally posted by Dwils
smacking the tree normally causes jacking . come on man, its just common sense.

Does it?

Posted by treberta on 02-19-2010 05:23 PM:

There's a huge difference in jumping in one spot and jacking the tree.

Posted by Dwils on 02-19-2010 06:02 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by JiM
Daniel, you hunt'in tonite? Let me know. We need you to get some pics of Kate on the tree. I'll bring the hotdogs......

LOL yeah JiM i am lookin for someone to pleasure hunt with , think i am goin to skip out on the hunt,lol. i will bring a rope and the tanned coon hide with some training scent , haha

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Posted by Ben Crocker on 02-19-2010 06:56 PM:

I have much respect for guys like Elvis, Jim, Jerry Moll, Frank Giddings, and any others on here that have made a strong name for yourself. All of these guys mentioned are strong believers of not praising at the tree. With that said, we all our different and we all for sure have had different luck with different methods. To me it boils down to a bond that is made between the dog and handler. Anyone who knows me understands the time I put in with these dogs..and I'll be the first to say I am probably way to rough on my hounds for simple things that most wouldn't even notice or worry about. Again with that said, most of my training is done at the tree, whether it is the process of recasting, covering late, times covering at all, tree style...ect.. You get the point. Much stuff that many wouldn't ever work on I work extra hard on. For the third time with all that said...EVERY time I am satisfied with what one of my dogs did for me on a coon I pet and praise them to no end on the tree like I do in the yard. My 3 most well known dogs being Jake, Jewel, and Flash I would guess was in a estimated 300+ cast and I offer anybody that hunted with any of them to tell me a time they seen or heard a off bark from any of them. All of those 3 arrived here at 6 weeks old, and once I had them what I called finished they were stand on the wood treedogs that never shut up tell I got done shining and made my way in to handle. All 3 would make a strong point to get around the tree to my side and rub up on me waiting for the good or bad I was about to give. Most every tree they knew before I leashed them what was going to happen. All 3 hated me and loved me but mostly understood me. Just my experience..Thanks for reading.

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Posted by on 02-19-2010 10:04 PM:

Ben, I made one response on this thread to a comment by trebertha that was "Smack that tree with your hands and get them fired up". I absolutely believe that is a major mistake and will lead to a tree jacking dog that will get itself in trouble sooner or later. Praise is one thing, you do it at the tree, I do the same thing away from the tree. But banging on that tree and hepping up a pup to get them fired up has been cause for regrets in my experience.

Posted by Ben Crocker on 02-19-2010 11:19 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by JiM
Ben, I made one response on this thread to a comment by trebertha that was "Smack that tree with your hands and get them fired up". I absolutely believe that is a major mistake and will lead to a tree jacking dog that will get itself in trouble sooner or later. Praise is one thing, you do it at the tree, I do the same thing away from the tree. But banging on that tree and hepping up a pup to get them fired up has been cause for regrets in my experience.

I agree with that 100%

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Posted by ml2543 on 02-19-2010 11:55 PM:

kinda new to the coon hunting world and all that. Kinda a stupid question but what does it mean by tree jacking?

Posted by Clint Welsh on 02-20-2010 12:10 AM:

ml2543

Tree jacking is when your dog jumps up and down at the tree. It often leads to a dog jumping or falling on another. The jacker isn't trying to start a fight, but it can get one started pretty quick. Whenever you get dogs pushing around at the bottom of the tree it can lead to trouble. Dogs with their belly on the wood looks pretty, but the one sitting on it's butt about 4 feet out is going to stay out of trouble.

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Posted by coondogman on 02-20-2010 12:30 AM:

Re: treberta

quote:
Originally posted by David Boggs
i have never petted up a dog on a tree in my life unless its the pups first coon after that your just petting up troubel.pet them after you get 100 yards from the tree a littel and that is a nuff and if it is the pups first 10 coon he gets his coon shot out season or not a fine is cheeper for me then a mean dog,but thats just me becauls i have sean it first hand make gaters out of plenty dogs on the tree.david..ps no i dont kill all the coon i tree eather i just kill wat my dogs need is all i leave just as maney sit in season as i do out of season ,

MAKES absoulutely no sense to pet after you leave the tree a 100 yards later, my gosh these are dogs .

Pet the dog at the tree then he knows he done well. i sometimes wonder how some of you guys have ever made a dog. Most of you better buy a ready made dog and let them teach you something, if you are not to hard headed to learn.

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Posted by coondogman on 02-20-2010 12:35 AM:

Re: Re: Re: how do you get a dog to stand in one spot at tree?

quote:
Originally posted by Dwils
smacking the tree normally causes jacking . come on man, its just common sense.

smacking the tree or petting dog at the tree will not cause them to jack a tree. hanging a dead coon or squirrel up where they can see it will start them to jack.

A dog learns from reputition and reward, or reputition and force breaking. reward your dog when they do right not later after you leave the tree. They have no idea what the reward is at that point.

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Posted by David Boggs on 02-20-2010 03:29 AM:

btt

when the coon is shot out to the young dog .I CALL THAT A REWORD.train your way i will train my way it WORKS 4 ME and has worked for a round 40 years for me.yes i am just soon to be 49 and have had dogs all my life,i do not claim to be a expert but i do claim to be as good as they come in hound and in protection dogs as well and every dog is different.BUT PETTING UP DOGS AT A TREE COUSSES to much problems dowen the road and a hound that cant take a ass kicking is one i dont like eather.a dog learns through a recall memorie like when a dog pulls up short i put its ass on from that tree NO MATTER WAT IT TAKES.i just dont pet at the tree but i do pet when one of my dogs have a man dowen in a bite suite.david boggs sandy hook ky just a old crazey hillbilley that can not spell a lick becauls i was working training dogs

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Posted by Ben Crocker on 02-20-2010 04:45 AM:

Re: btt

quote:
Originally posted by David Boggs
when the coon is shot out to the young dog .I CALL THAT A REWORD.train your way i will train my way it WORKS 4 ME and has worked for a round 40 years for me.yes i am just soon to be 49 and have had dogs all my life,i do not claim to be a expert but i do claim to be as good as they come in hound and in protection dogs as well and every dog is different.BUT PETTING UP DOGS AT A TREE COUSSES to much problems dowen the road and a hound that cant take a ass kicking is one i dont like eather.a dog learns through a recall memorie like when a dog pulls up short i put its ass on from that tree NO MATTER WAT IT TAKES.i just dont pet at the tree but i do pet when one of my dogs have a man dowen in a bite suite.david boggs sandy hook ky just a old crazey hillbilley that can not spell a lick becauls i was working training dogs

good post David, your one of the guys I was referring to that has been around and had good luck doing things your way. I'm in no way against what "winners" do to get ready. I'm just saying I've had good luck praising at the tree without any future problems. But again my dogs are handled good or bad on most every tree they make. Only time I won't praise or scold a hound is a ANY kind of a den tree that a coon is not seen or a tree that I believe may hold a coon that I can't fully shine.

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Posted by buckeyebuck on 02-20-2010 01:22 PM:

Im going to have to try the no petting approach. I always figured thats what you wanted to do.

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