UKC Forums - Should silent dogs be scratched?

Pages (14): « First ... « 12 13 [14]
Show all 336 posts from this thread on one page

UKC Forums (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/index.php)
- UKC Coonhounds (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=4)
-- Should silent dogs be scratched? (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=456734)

Posted by Okie Dawg on 11-03-2011 07:23 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Lakeland Kennel
"In fact I don't recall ever being in a hunt where a silent dog miraculously got treed way ahead or behind open trailing hounds!"

All I can say is that you may not have been with a good silent trailer.

I have an old English female a buddy of mine helped me train. In my opinion, she is as good as they get. The first winter I hunted my Mt Cur Scout (silent), Scout had to tree about 5 coon ahead of Penny before my hunting buddy would believe it. Did Scout always tree ahead of Penny, heck no, Penny is a tough hound. But on some nights, in some places, Scout treed coon ahead of Penny.

I have places where if I hunt open dogs, the coon will always be in the ground, in a brush pile or up a den tree. The coon head for these places the minute a dog opens. But, I can sneak in with one of my silent trailing Curs and they will have a big coon on the outside, often up a bush.

Would I give up my open trailing hounds to go to Curs only, heck no.

David, you guys videoed some of Amy's half Curs. I am sure they didn't open much. And those Cur squirrel dogs you guys taped didn't open. Get you a good Cur and start enjoying some of the fun.

If you take a good air scent dog in good conditions for air scent they would beat a trail hound about every time. But if it isn't good air scent conditions the trail hound will beat them EVERY time.
The big differance is if the air scent dog doesn't allso know how to track he won't find you nothing when the conditions arent right to be able to air scent. The trail dog will be able to trail in good air scent conditions and tracking conditions.

__________________
UNITED WE STAND DIVIDED WE FALL
Grady Jarvis
808 N. Main St.
Tonkawa Okla. 74653
580-628-0507
CH 'PR' Grady's Dark Woods Waylon -Bluetic

NITECH 'PR' Grady's Insane Tinker Bell (Tink) - Treeing walker --Okla. State Hunt open redg. winner

'PR' Grady's Barley - Treeing Walker

Posted by eric carter on 11-03-2011 07:43 PM:

If u breed a babbler to a silent dog what would the pups b like

__________________
eric

Posted by Caleb Wilson on 11-03-2011 08:06 PM:

Lol shock the babbler and it don't babble anymore the pups would be both some would be open some would be silent no way to tell what they'd be like

__________________
Caleb Wilson

423 322 9448

Posted by nccoonhunter197 on 11-03-2011 08:40 PM:

Ok, this post has beat this horse to death. The way I see it and the way the rules read, a hound was bred to open on the trail and when the coon climbs, locate and tree it. The original question was should they be scratched? The rules state yes if consistently silent on track. I agree with that rule. I am by no means a hound purist but I like to hear a hound open on the ground. I have listened to awesome track dogs work tracks for miles and work them for feet. I know years ago when hide prices were high people liked silent track dogs that when treed were not very loud. They didn't want other hide hunters knowing where they were hunting. Some people used hounds, some used curs, and some used a variation of different breeds. If you like a silent dog then so be it. I just would not hunt a silent dog in a hunt where I know the rules prohibit that type of dog. I have never drew a complete true to life silent dog in a hunt. Most of what people are calling silent on here are considered by most semi-silent. A dog that opens a few times on the ground and then trees. ( Still not my type of dog ) I had a female that would just fall treed from time to time and would have the coon. She was silent by no means but would tree a lay up. She treed alot of coon like this and by opening on the ground. I had a male that was probably one of the best track dogs ever. He won alot of hunts and granded easily. I liked my males ability to move a track and he was fast and accurate on the the tree end as well. He would take a bad track from other dogs and drift it out and tree well ahead of the other dogs. He would scream on a hot track and if anything was with him, it better have its running shoes on. I tried to train a few young dogs ( 12 to 16 months old ) and they simply could not keep up. He was not a pup trainer. The young dogs would either start babbling trying to keep up or would not say a word until they got to the tree. To make a long opinion as short as possible, silent is bred into some dogs and in others it is developed by hunting them either to early with older dogs or with a dog that can't keep up with. You can sometimes reverse the later two but the bred into you can't. Independent dogs will sometimes be silent or semi-silent so they can sneak away from the pack. Is this good or bad? If you got plenty of coons not a problem. In thinner coons=long night. So lets just agree to disagree and hunt what you like. Neither dog ( open trailing or silent ) is better then the other if the owner is happy and no dog will win all the time. My thought on the original question is still yes they should be scratched in UKC. If you like a silent dog and the rules prohibit it hunt in a different registry where it is not prohibited. All of this is JMO.

__________________
"To educate a man in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to society." -
-- Theodore Roosevelt

Brian Teague 252-649-3050

Posted by Okie Dawg on 11-03-2011 09:15 PM:

Good post NCCOONHUNTER.

Posted by gfults on 11-05-2011 05:58 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by eric carter
If u breed a babbler to a silent dog what would the pups b like

A silent dog should be bred to a babbler, so that the pups may be more balanced. That dont work every time but its the right idea.

__________________
Skin that one pilgrim and I'll bring ya another

Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Pa. Junior
Tenn. Black Lexus( Pa. Junior x Hulios Lil Stripper)

PKC Ch. Tenn. Blackjack- R.I.P.

Posted by Dwils on 11-05-2011 11:02 PM:

it just doesnt work that way. you can have a pup off two wide open trailers throw a very tight mouthed or semi -silent pup......i know from experience.

As for me i like to know where that coon is going. I dont like one Stone silent. but like and prefer a tight mouth dog that opens no more than he has to. i guess it depends totally on the track.
As far as scratching a dog for being silent?? you can bet i WILL NEVER scratch a dog for being silent..go ahead, get mad. If that day comes i will look seriously hard at whats at the end of my lead . Its about treeing coon. I can definately think of ALOT worse faults than having a silent dog. and if ya think about it....How can you fault a dog for treeing coon? and what alot of you call a Silent trailer,,,is in fact only semi-silent or very tight mouthed

my biggest problem in these hunts are these dogs that are nothing more than a wide open mouthy babbler that are nothing more than a me too dog

__________________
Home of :
GrNtCh PKC ch Skuna River Fred Bear
GrNtCh Skuna River Bear
NtCh PKCCh Skuna River Faith
NtCh PKC Ch Catch This
Silver Ch River Bend Lacey

Posted by gfults on 11-06-2011 02:13 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Dwils
it just doesnt work that way. you can have a pup off two wide open trailers throw a very tight mouthed or semi -silent pup......i know from experience.

As for me i like to know where that coon is going. I dont like one Stone silent. but like and prefer a tight mouth dog that opens no more than he has to. i guess it depends totally on the track.
As far as scratching a dog for being silent?? you can bet i WILL NEVER scratch a dog for being silent..go ahead, get mad. If that day comes i will look seriously hard at whats at the end of my lead . Its about treeing coon. I can definately think of ALOT worse faults than having a silent dog. and if ya think about it....How can you fault a dog for treeing coon? and what alot of you call a Silent trailer,,,is in fact only semi-silent or very tight mouthed

my biggest problem in these hunts are these dogs that are nothing more than a wide open mouthy babbler that are nothing more than a me too dog

Well it can work that way. My male dog is tight on most tracks and sometimes just falls treed without opening on track. I bred him to the mouthiest babbling female I could find and kept a male pup as a stud fee pup. Hes 16 months old now and is absolutely the quickest strike dog Ive ever owned. Im not gonna promise he always gets struck on a coon, but he gets open REAL quick!! Thats my experience with trying that kind of breeding.

__________________
Skin that one pilgrim and I'll bring ya another

Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Pa. Junior
Tenn. Black Lexus( Pa. Junior x Hulios Lil Stripper)

PKC Ch. Tenn. Blackjack- R.I.P.

Posted by Okie Dawg on 11-06-2011 06:33 AM:

I have allways figured if you want one like the sire take a male pup and if you want one like the dam take a female. If it makes a lot of differance to you wait till they are a year old to take your pic. Because nothing is certain in a gene pool. LOL

Posted by l.lyle on 11-06-2011 08:17 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by gfults
Well it can work that way. My male dog is tight on most tracks and sometimes just falls treed without opening on track. I bred him to the mouthiest babbling female I could find and kept a male pup as a stud fee pup. Hes 16 months old now and is absolutely the quickest strike dog Ive ever owned. Im not gonna promise he always gets struck on a coon, but he gets open REAL quick!! Thats my experience with trying that kind of breeding.

Please please please list the dams line and the sires line so I can stay away from both.

Posted by gfults on 11-06-2011 09:49 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by l.lyle
Please please please list the dams line and the sires line so I can stay away from both.

No need to list the lines of either dog. If you can read and pay attention, you shouldnt have any trouble figuring it out! You wont have to worry about staying away from that line because Im kinda picky about who I let breed to my dog anyway!! But I will say this, that line has probably won more than any other line of black dogs out there in all 3 KC's! Especially in the last 10-15 years!!

__________________
Skin that one pilgrim and I'll bring ya another

Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Pa. Junior
Tenn. Black Lexus( Pa. Junior x Hulios Lil Stripper)

PKC Ch. Tenn. Blackjack- R.I.P.

All times are GMT. The time now is 07:55 AM.

Pages (14): « First ... « 12 13 [14]
Show all 336 posts from this thread on one page