UKC Forums - Tight Mouth or Silent Track Dogs

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Posted by flasher87 on 12-28-2010 02:42 AM:

Tight Mouth or Silent Track Dogs

Do any English or Walker breeders breed for this trait? I realize in a lot of circles this is not a desireable trait, however they are some people who like these type of hounds.

Posted by on 12-28-2010 06:08 AM:

tight mouth aka [ silent]

yes they do, that's what some went too about 25 yrs ago, now some want to get track back in dogs, some comp hunters want to go to 3 dog cast so they can get more strike pts instead of last strike. i think if other kc's hunt clubs go to 3 dog cast that 1st strike should get 100, 2nd-50 3rd-25 --- 1st tree gets 100, 2nd-75---3rd-50, that way can get back to breeding for balanced coon hounds. tried breeding F.R. track dogs to them 1bark tree wonders once, all i got was a gator. now the folks that raved on them dogs then,talk about how mean they were. got to say i enjoy hunting against them famous big named wonders then and now.

Posted by Russell Boyette on 12-28-2010 06:54 AM:

Re: tight mouth aka [ silent]

quote:
Originally posted by swamp1
yes they do, that's what some went too about 25 yrs ago, now some want to get track back in dogs, some comp hunters want to go to 3 dog cast so they can get more strike pts instead of last strike. i think if other kc's hunt clubs go to 3 dog cast that 1st strike should get 100, 2nd-50 3rd-25 --- 1st tree gets 100, 2nd-75---3rd-50, that way can get back to breeding for balanced coon hounds. tried breeding F.R. track dogs to them 1bark tree wonders once, all i got was a gator. now the folks that raved on them dogs then,talk about how mean they were. got to say i enjoy hunting against them famous big named wonders then and now.

You've got to be kidding me! Let me get this straight. U want to give a dog that leaves your feet barking at god knows what(if anything at all!), even MORE of any advantage over an honest strike dog??? And u think that's the answer to creating more trackdogs???

I think there's a bunch of folks out there that need to learn that a dog running around in the dark barking ain't got jack to do with being a track dog.

All your rule change would do is make it easier for a babbling, me-too dog to win even more hunts by nothing! How wud u feel if u took your shonuff top coondog to a hunt and my dog beat you because i struck the babbling fool off the leash for 100, & took 25 or 50 on every coon yours treed 4min & 30sec after u took 1st tree???

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Posted by Russell Boyette on 12-28-2010 07:19 AM:

Re: tight mouth aka [ silent]

quote:
Originally posted by swamp1
yes they do, that's what some went too about 25 yrs ago, now some want to get track back in dogs, some comp hunters want to go to 3 dog cast so they can get more strike pts instead of last strike. i think if other kc's hunt clubs go to 3 dog cast that 1st strike should get 100, 2nd-50 3rd-25 --- 1st tree gets 100, 2nd-75---3rd-50, that way can get back to breeding for balanced coon hounds. tried breeding F.R. track dogs to them 1bark tree wonders once, all i got was a gator. now the folks that raved on them dogs then,talk about how mean they were. got to say i enjoy hunting against them famous big named wonders then and now.

If that's your idea of the ideal rule u would want to hunt under, then I see how you beat them. When a dog opens in woods there is no way to prove he has struck a coon track, Hell! There's no way to prove he's struck on anything! All you know is the idiots barking, and you think THAT deserves the same amount of points as the dog that trees & SHOWS us the COON 1st???

Of course, someone who judges a whole line of dogs with the reputation of being trackdogs as idiots, because one time he bred a slick-treeing idiot to a cull from that line & got only culls, probably can't imagine that his rule change would just make things worse either...

Posted by l.lyle on 12-28-2010 07:41 AM:

I do not know where in the world some coonhunters dream came up with the thing bvout "MEEEEE TTOOOOO" answer that.

Well, while ya'll bin playin witchososhelfs , I am petting an almost 5 month old pup and next week , when he gets his first chance, wwwwhen I am holding him by his dime store collar and he don't turn around and chew on my wrist and say "Send me in coach, I'm ready to Play, todaay" I will be sorely dissappointed>> Yackety Yack , Why don't ya'll talk back?????n. ME TOO : My aASS. Do you even have a clue???

Posted by Russell Boyette on 12-28-2010 08:09 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by l.lyle
I do not know where in the world some coonhunters dream came up with the thing bvout "MEEEEE TTOOOOO" answer that.

Well, while ya'll bin playin witchososhelfs , I am petting an almost 5 month old pup and next week , when he gets his first chance, wwwwhen I am holding him by his dime store collar and he don't turn around and chew on my wrist and say "Send me in coach, I'm ready to Play, todaay" I will be sorely dissappointed>> Yackety Yack , Why don't ya'll talk back?????n. ME TOO : My aASS. Do you even have a clue???

l.lyle, by the time u got done pettin' on your lil puppy & tryin' to remember how to turn your computer on, I'd unsnapped my lil' pup named "De" 4 times & walked to him treed on 4 wild raccoons, & made it home in time to teach u a little lesson about "me-too dogs" before I went to bed! ; )

Posted by l.lyle on 12-28-2010 08:25 AM:

I'm sorry, for ya'll that went slip sliding away on datun. Let me see if I am following you? Open? a pup that opens. Silent , a pup that keeps his mouth sshut. Like the sourthern girl said, "Hush yo mout". Figure that one out. Si vu ple'. IF that pup does try to get in front and catch, he had to be a me too to go into them( right or wrong) D.ASSES? What a shame, that is a followtail noaccount, ennaso? But if the five year old in her brand new ballet shhoes begins to Teaching the Ballet class and wwwwwhile she is at it teach the Ballet instructor a trhing or two, ( Do you noe begin to get an inkling of how stupid , even though well meaning, Yo little five year old can do? And WHYT is THat? That is because you you Paid for some Aristocratic Papers yore little TINY Winy Pup can NOT LIVE up to. Excuise me , but let's just play wit each other, while you bees first strikin and first treein and givin yourself a pat ont the back. NO, I Am not an *******, I have lived the Aristocrat life. I had no idea so many of you Ckrackers wanted to do likewise.

Posted by bluecole on 12-28-2010 11:40 AM:

"crackers" isn't that a racist remark?whach ur **** mouth.

Posted by jackbob42 on 12-28-2010 01:43 PM:

Re: Re: tight mouth aka [ silent]

quote:
Originally posted by Russell Boyette
...
All your rule change would do is make it easier for a babbling, me-too dog to win even more hunts by nothing! How wud u feel if u took your shonuff top coondog to a hunt and my dog beat you because i struck the babbling fool off the leash for 100, & took 25 or 50 on every coon yours treed 4min & 30sec after u took 1st tree???

Them dogs don't bother me. I'm man enough to hold them accountable for them strike points. If you're man enough , it ain't long and they're gone.

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Posted by Jason smith on 12-28-2010 02:25 PM:

silent track power

Just because a dog doesn't say much on the ground does'nt mean he's not one heck of a track dog. The only thing that means he's smart enough to keep his mouth shut in heavy hunted woods that when a coon hears a dog bark it heads for a den. If I was a betting man I say in some of your guys so called track dog woods when your dogs are treeing den trees I could send my tight mouth dogs in and they would show you some meat.

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Posted by Todd M. on 12-28-2010 02:31 PM:

These dogs that run in and get struck in and get treed and show you a coon are "Top Shelf hounds" I ve seen a couple of hounds get treed and show me the coon all in about 150 yrds on seperate trees and on seperate turnouts. While the rest of our dogs went deep and come up short. Just how many times have you sent your dogs in the woods and yoiur standing there listening to your hounds looking around and see coon sitten up. I for one would like my hound to locate and find that coon. I like to listen to them run but I also like to see them do the job right.....Good and bad em all you got to know what your hound will do and wont do and huntin them once or twice a week is going to tell you squat about that dog. JMO

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Posted by Lee Currens Jr. on 12-28-2010 02:37 PM:

Re: Tight Mouth or Silent Track Dogs

quote:
Originally posted by flasher87
Do any English or Walker breeders breed for this trait? I realize in a lot of circles this is not a desireable trait, however they are some people who like these type of hounds.

Spring Creek walkers use to be pretty tight on the ground.
my buddy has english that runs back into blue boy stuff
that is.

Posted by JiM on 12-28-2010 03:23 PM:

Re: Tight Mouth or Silent Track Dogs

quote:
Originally posted by flasher87
Do any English or Walker breeders breed for this trait? I realize in a lot of circles this is not a desireable trait, however they are some people who like these type of hounds.

None that I know of. I know plenty of coonhunters who like a dog tight on the ground but I don't know of anyone out there breeding for a silent trailer.

To me, tight on the ground doesn't have to mean last strike. A dog can be a quick strike dog and still use it's mouth very little as it moves a track. Which is about perfect to me.

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Posted by Russell Boyette on 12-28-2010 04:08 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by l.lyle
I'm sorry, for ya'll that went slip sliding away on datun. Let me see if I am following you? Open? a pup that opens. Silent , a pup that keeps his mouth sshut. Like the sourthern girl said, "Hush yo mout". Figure that one out. Si vu ple'. IF that pup does try to get in front and catch, he had to be a me too to go into them( right or wrong) D.ASSES? What a shame, that is a followtail noaccount, ennaso? But if the five year old in her brand new ballet shhoes begins to Teaching the Ballet class and wwwwwhile she is at it teach the Ballet instructor a trhing or two, ( Do you noe begin to get an inkling of how stupid , even though well meaning, Yo little five year old can do? And WHYT is THat? That is because you you Paid for some Aristocratic Papers yore little TINY Winy Pup can NOT LIVE up to. Excuise me , but let's just play wit each other, while you bees first strikin and first treein and givin yourself a pat ont the back. NO, I Am not an *******, I have lived the Aristocrat life. I had no idea so many of you Ckrackers wanted to do likewise.

Bud, I really hope your "in-character" or something on here & you actually make some sense in person, cuz you haven't said the 1st thing that makes any sense. Idk what brand of Pig-Latin language you're typing in but you went from a talking about how much mouth a pup uses on track, to a kid taking ballet lessons, to aristocratic papers, & ended up calling me what I assume was your attempt to spell "cracker." If I was supposed to take that as an insult, it didn't work. Maybe u should google the meaning of those $5 words like "aristocratic" if you want to make sense to someone other than yourself. Have a happy New Year l.lyle, & I hope your New Years' Resolution is to take an on-line English language class if you really want to sound as smart as you seem to think you are. ; )

Posted by Russell Boyette on 12-28-2010 04:40 PM:

Re: Re: Re: tight mouth aka [ silent]

quote:
Originally posted by jackbob42
Them dogs don't bother me. I'm man enough to hold them accountable for them strike points. If you're man enough , it ain't long and they're gone.

Yeah, I've heard that one before. That's assuming you have the card & 2 handlers to back you up when he carries that one back to the panel. How are you going to send him packing when the babbler belongs to the man holding the card? You gonna MAKE him minus his dog? You can scream, holler, jump up & down, and beat yourself all you want to but the majority of the time that babblers 100 strike is gonna stay on the card. I've been holding the card minused them when they're struck off the leash, & when they're getting struck at the edge of our lights everytime & had it overturned. The biggest "man" in the world can't do much about one that leaves barking & don't shut up till it gets treed or backs a dog with a coon, that's not even taking into account that 9 times outta 10, as soon as the babbler's handler takes 100, someone else's gonna jump out & take 2nd if there's makes a whimper.

If a KC will give me a "real" babbling rule that won't leave me standing in front of a panel looking like an ass for minusing a babbler, then I'm "man" enough to use it.

Posted by amazingcursouth on 12-28-2010 05:10 PM:

a tight mouth dog seems to get under more coons faster, from what i have seen. i have a walker now that is a honest strike dog, but then only barks here and there according to the track. and when he hushes completely he is getting ready to throw a locate that a deaf man could call. this type dog suits me fine. and besides i hunt them treeing curs that are semi silent on coon any way. they sneak up on em and the coon has no choice but climb or get caught.

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Posted by CoonBusterWV on 12-28-2010 05:11 PM:

I like one that barks when it smells a coon, and just a few other times before it comes treed. I realize that is hard to find, but i would rather have one that is tight than one that barks non-stop till its treed. Seems like the tight mouthed dogs are more of an explosive tree dog

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Posted by Larry Atherton on 12-28-2010 05:54 PM:

I raised a pup out of 1 stud dog and female, and my buddy raised another out of a different stud and different female. Both pups were Old Clover bred top and bottom and both were silent.

I know not all Clover dogs are silent, but after 2 for 2 I quit trying.

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Posted by walkercash on 12-28-2010 06:40 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Larry Atherton
I raised a pup out of 1 stud dog and female, and my buddy raised another out of a different stud and different female. Both pups were Old Clover bred top and bottom and both were silent.

I know not all Clover dogs are silent, but after 2 for 2 I quit trying.

ahhh Larry your missing the boat. Look what the Clover x Sackett crosses have done for Ben. Let me know if ya feel like trying again! Got two here that are open trailing dogs.

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Posted by Travis Sawney on 12-28-2010 07:17 PM:

What do you guys think about using a coon treeing silent dog for a brood female? She trees alot of coon and does it quick, but is totally silent unless shes looking at it. The only one out of the litter that i know of that turned out that way. Neither sire or dam are silent. Do you think she'd pass that on?

Posted by Larry Atherton on 12-28-2010 07:30 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by walkercash
ahhh Larry your missing the boat. Look what the Clover x Sackett crosses have done for Ben. Let me know if ya feel like trying again! Got two here that are open trailing dogs.

Shawn,

Wrong Clover. I guess I should have said Lone Pine bred. By the way my son has a Trip pup.

Travis,

Is is hard to say, but I have seen a couple of open males bred to silent females. The typical results are some are like dad and some are like mom.

I know a female that is in many all grand pedigrees that was silent.

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Posted by Majestic Tree H on 12-28-2010 07:35 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by l.lyle
I'm sorry, for ya'll that went slip sliding away on datun. Let me see if I am following you? Open? a pup that opens. Silent , a pup that keeps his mouth sshut. Like the sourthern girl said, "Hush yo mout". Figure that one out. Si vu ple'. IF that pup does try to get in front and catch, he had to be a me too to go into them( right or wrong) D.ASSES? What a shame, that is a followtail noaccount, ennaso? But if the five year old in her brand new ballet shhoes begins to Teaching the Ballet class and wwwwwhile she is at it teach the Ballet instructor a trhing or two, ( Do you noe begin to get an inkling of how stupid , even though well meaning, Yo little five year old can do? And WHYT is THat? That is because you you Paid for some Aristocratic Papers yore little TINY Winy Pup can NOT LIVE up to. Excuise me , but let's just play wit each other, while you bees first strikin and first treein and givin yourself a pat ont the back. NO, I Am not an *******, I have lived the Aristocrat life. I had no idea so many of you Ckrackers wanted to do likewise.

"l.lyle"

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And His Mastery of Ebonics is Incredible to say the least ..

Some of his other Writings are "Book Worthy Works Of Art"

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Posted by hillbilly56 on 12-28-2010 10:02 PM:

dogs

me myself i always liked a hound that would only open here and there i had a young red gyp if you heard her open she was almost looking at mr coon other than that she would just come up treed caught a lot of coon with her go in holler when somebody had open dogs didnt tree a coon i went in the holler and tree coons some folks like real open dogs some like realtight mouth or silent dogs jmo

Posted by jculler8 on 12-28-2010 10:28 PM:

Re: Re: Tight Mouth or Silent Track Dogs

quote:
Originally posted by JiM
None that I know of. I know plenty of coonhunters who like a dog tight on the ground but I don't know of anyone out there breeding for a silent trailer.

To me, tight on the ground doesn't have to mean last strike. A dog can be a quick strike dog and still use it's mouth very little as it moves a track. Which is about perfect to me.

You hit the nail on the head Jim. My female here will strike 1 or 2 barks when it's cold when she first smells a track. She usually doesn't bark again until she's locating. That would be my definition of a "tight mouthed" hound.

She has won a lot doing this and I really like it!

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Posted by psiskjr on 12-28-2010 11:23 PM:

I want a hound that barks according to the track. If it is a hot track tell me so. If it is cold also tell me so. I hunt to hear the hounds be "hounds". If I wanted silent I would hunt curs.

My experience with the mouth on hounds a lot comes from the female, at least in my Plott hounds. A loose mouth bitch will throw mostly the same and a tight mouth bitch will throw mostly tight mouthed dogs. "Mostly" being the key word.

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